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Match Thread: Port Vale v Barrow


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18 hours ago, valiant_593 said:

Happy clappers 😂😂😂

yes we’re happy RZ we’re 3rd in the table 

Imagine where we could be if we had a manager who wasn't so nasty? And if we still had Pope I think the league would have granted us early promotion. Nasty Clarke out! 

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10 hours ago, MBE said:

Time for DC to bring in Stone to show the squad you have to perform or loose your place.

I'd agree with that. I  wouldn't be surprised if Covolan is left out because I worry that goal will affect his confidence and also because the rest of the squad are judged on their performances so you can't make an exception for the keeper

But I wouldn't write him off. He's just come into the FL and made a couple of noticeable errors. However, he's on a two year deal, he's got time to come back stronger and learn from these. He appears to be keen to make a success of it and learn so I hope he does but on current form, he must be worried about keeping his place.

For me, that's just the way it works. Some players (take Dan Jones) just come in from day one and impress. Others (Mal Benning for instance) seem to take longer. That could be for loads of reasons - moving to a new area, new team mates, different coaching methods, tactics and so on. With LC I suspect it's the move up in standard. But If the coaching staff have done their homework, Covolan is of the right stuff, he just may be more of a slow burner (a Benning) in adapting rather than being the finished product from day one.

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I stand by the view that you back your Number 1 if you're winning games. Engaging in a 'will he, won't he' battle for the gloves benefits no one, especially when neither keeper is massively experienced. Just engenders real nerves that the slightest mishap means they're out of the team for weeks, and fans will latch onto their preferred keeper and accentuate any mistakes the other one makes. Some on here have already firmly planted their flag in the Covolan camp (me), whilst others are concocting nicknames for Aiden Stone in readiness for his anointed accession.

People were calling for Covolan to be dropped after he returned from his Northampton suspension. At this stage, he's only arguably cost us the Northampton game and possibly a point at Sutton. 

We're third in the table and dropping him will probably undermine confidence further. If Stone was locked and loaded to be good/reliable I'd be all for it, but right now he's as much of a risk as Lucas. Whilst we're winning and winning well (6 in 8), don't roll the dice with your goalkeepers.

As I've said; Lucas is clearly on notice from DC, and that's entirely fair. Up to the Rochdale game we had the second best defence in the league, so the view that he's been a perpetual calamity is wide of the mark. He has to start getting the basics right but I don't think an immediate dropping after a mistake in the midst of an outstanding run of team form is the best course of action.

Edited by Joe B
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3 minutes ago, Joe B said:

Just engenders real nerves that the slightest mishap means they're out of the team for weeks

I don't agree with that point. If he's dropped it would be due to several errors not one. I would imagine that would be the same if Stone was brought in. He wouldn't be booted out as soon as he makes a mistake. 

For me, Clarke's harsh words for LC, "not good enough" even in the middle of a winning run were striking.

I guess the key question is are we winning because of the keeper or despite the keeper and which one of those camps DC falls into?

I suspect DC will be keeping a close eye on him in training today and seeing how Lucas responds. 

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I suppose it’s good analysing the little negative things after a good win. Still think the defensive wall business needs a little work, never mind turning your back keep your eye on the ball all the time. Goalkeeping is a very much a confidence thing, would I change things ? Not sure would Politic and Benning start so glad we have a manager to sort this out. Now we have lads on the bench to change a game which has to be a big plus.

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25 minutes ago, robf said:

I don't agree with that point. If he's dropped it would be due to several errors not one. I would imagine that would be the same if Stone was brought in. He wouldn't be booted out as soon as he makes a mistake. 

For me, Clarke's harsh words for LC, "not good enough" even in the middle of a winning run were striking.

I guess the key question is are we winning because of the keeper or despite the keeper and which one of those camps DC falls into?

I suspect DC will be keeping a close eye on him in training today and seeing how Lucas responds. 

I can't believe that Clarke would single out a player for criticism in a post match press conference, he is not like that. Especially after a win. 

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32 minutes ago, Rampant Zebra said:

I can't believe that Clarke would single out a player for criticism in a post match press conference, he is not like that. Especially after a win. 

Do you enjoy Port Vale wins?

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I'd be disappointed to see him dropped after his one 'error'.  I'm not sure that any of the goals against vs Sutton were down to him either, that result IMHO, especially after the performance was freakish.

I think he adds more to the side than just his shop stopping.  I don't recall seeing a Vale keeper so strong in the air as him, he plays a high line and is also fairly quick unless we're winning and he's trotting back to take a goal kick.

DC made it clear that he was disappointed with his contribution to the goal, I'd hope and expect that to be enough. 

 

 

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22 minutes ago, Jacko51 said:

Scott Brown did!

Yeah I looked this up earlier to double check. Oldham at home, immediately after the little debacle at Cheltenham below, he hadn't been dropped. If Covolan had done this instead of the venerated saint Scott Brown there'd be murder on social media. 

 

 

Edited by Doha
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Yeah I looked this up earlier to double check. Oldham at home, immediately after the little debacle at Cheltenham below, he hadn't been dropped. If Covolan had done this instead of the venerated saint Scott Brown there'd be murder on social media. 
 
 
Don't forget the shambles of a GK performance against Walsall at home in January
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The thing that covolan doesnt get enough praise for is his ability to come and claim crosses, what some of you short sighted people dont see the impact of this is massive. Look how many goals we conceded with brown in goal with a header from about 5 yards out as he was glued to his goal line. So when covolan comes and claims things this is quickly forgotten when in fact in previous seasons these would of been goal scoring opportunities for the opposition. Yes he made a error for the goal but look where we are in the league. People on here are just desperate for someone to moan at we won 3:1 its not cost us the game. I cant imagine its even a question in clarkes mind about dropping him at the moment

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If we were losing games then I think there's an argument to be had regarding keepers.

When you're third, with 6 wins in 8, and a lot of the goals being conceded being flukey in nature (OGs and deflections), I simply don't like the risk involved. Stone is a gamble himself, and if you put him in for 3 games, and he's not good enough yet (only 22), you're left with a potentially confidence-bereft Lucas, on top of his inherent higher-risk style, with fans now firmly on his back/nervy.

That's before you consider the change in structure a switch from Covolan to Stone would entail. I am guessing here, but I doubt Stone is as good with his feet, or will start so high up the pitch, or will collect crosses. We won't be able to play from the back, recycle possession, and have a high line in the portions of games we get aggressive. You may have to completely reorient our build up play and structure for a team that is having absolutely no issues with winning games on a consistent basis, with all losses coming by an odd goal and one in very unlucky circumstances.

Edited by Joe B
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3 hours ago, Joe B said:

If we were losing games then I think there's an argument to be had regarding keepers.

When you're third, with 6 wins in 8, and a lot of the goals being conceded being flukey in nature (OGs and deflections), I simply don't like the risk involved. Stone is a gamble himself, and if you put him in for 3 games, and he's not good enough yet (only 22), you're left with a potentially confidence-bereft Lucas, on top of his inherent higher-risk style, with fans now firmly on his back/nervy.

That's before you consider the change in structure a switch from Covolan to Stone would entail. I am guessing here, but I doubt Stone is as good with his feet, or will start so high up the pitch, or will collect crosses. We won't be able to play from the back, recycle possession, and have a high line in the portions of games we get aggressive. You may have to completely reorient our build up play and structure for a team that is having absolutely no issues with winning games on a consistent basis, with all losses coming by an odd goal and one in very unlucky circumstances.

If that is Stone then we have made a poor choice for a number two.

Would have expected a cover goalkeeper to be similar to what we need in the first 11

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20 minutes ago, Sandyford_Lion said:

If that is Stone then we have made a poor choice for a number two.

Would have expected a cover goalkeeper to be similar to what we need in the first 11

He's 22. He might be a good shot stopper but the chances of him having the same skillset as Lucas is low. 

How many League 2 clubs will have 2 GKs of first-team quality? We have a young lad as a backup, the concept of putting him in for a keeper who has contributed to our successful style of play and expecting the same results is a risk in my view.

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Ultimately agree with @Joe B right now, but it's healthy for Covolan to be concerned about his place after an error that poor (something Scott Brown never really had to do), as @robf says. I am sure Lucas will have had an intense day's training today, and if he's good enough he'll put that mistake behind him whether he's dropped or not.

I certainly think he is good enough, and I like the way he plays the position - anyone should be able to see the difference he's making in cutting off crosses and through-balls. But I'd like Stone to be pushing him hard for the position too.

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