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I think decent is over stretching Crookes performance. 

He's been ok /acceptable. Maybe 6 to 6.5 out of 10 each game. Basically his stock appears to of gone up a notch with our fan base.

Hate to be negative nelly but I'm far from convinced 

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No no no no we’ve fallen into this trap before. This squad has been in multiple relegation battles so a couple of wins doesn’t change anything for me. Big clear out needed

No. I'd still be ruthless. I'm angry that this bunch downed tools and gave me many a sleepless night worrying about losing our league status. Glad they've finally decided to start playing again, but

He probably will for 90 minutes!

3 minutes ago, Jacob_123 said:


Crookes is out of contract at the end of the season

Ah yes so he is,that one is touch and go as well then although his performances under DC have done him no harm imo

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2 minutes ago, darren1810 said:

I think decent is over stretching Crookes performance. 

He's been ok /acceptable. Maybe 6 to 6.5 out of 10 each game. Basically his stock appears to of gone up a notch with our fan base.

Hate to be negative nelly but I'm far from convinced 

I totally agree going off performances prior to DC coming in,he has improved under DC there is no doubting that,is it enough to get a deal i doubt it at the moment

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43 minutes ago, werstayinup said:

Before Clarke came in i would of said Crookes time is up but since he has played 3 at the back i do think he is improving and maybe worth keeping for the year left on his deal to see how he goes(he does have a season left doesn't he?) I really do think most will be gone even some under contract we could see 15 or 16 new players coming in.

I know this will be against the grain but i dont even think Brown is safe now

Crookes will definitely be released. Even though he’s done well in the past 3 games, he’s going to be too much of liability for what the club want to do moving forward

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2 minutes ago, Eddie Ford said:

Crookes will definitely be released. Even though he’s done well in the past 3 games, he’s going to be too much of liability for what the club want to do moving forward

We need a 4th centre half though for the squad, and I don’t think you can find a better candidate for it. He’s cheap, versatile, and ok at best. Ideally over a season he wouldn’t even play.

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12 minutes ago, Eddie Ford said:

Crookes will definitely be released. Even though he’s done well in the past 3 games, he’s going to be too much of liability for what the club want to do moving forward

Agree. With the squad cap of 20 (?) in place for next season, there has to be an anticipation/expectation that anyone in that 20-man squad may be required to play in a minimum of 15+ games - due to injuries, suspensions, loss of form, resting players, etc.

If we're aiming to be a top-7 side next season (and surely that has to be the target?) then is Crookes good enough to appear fairly regularly in a top-7 challenging side? Nowhere near IMO, and as such surely Clarke will release him in May?

Edited by The Kalamazoo Kid

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7 minutes ago, The Kalamazoo Kid said:

Agree. With the squad cap of 20 (?) in place for next season, there has to be an anticipation/expectation that anyone in that 20-man squad may be required to play in a minimum of 15+ games - due to injuries, suspensions, loss of form, resting players, etc.

If we're aiming to be a top-7 side next season (and surely that has to be the target?) then is Crookes good enough to appear fairly regularly in a top-7 challenging side? Nowhere near IMO, and as such surely Clarke will release him in May?

The happy clappers on here think mid table will be a good achievement next season 

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9 minutes ago, Powerline said:

We need a 4th centre half though for the squad, and I don’t think you can find a better candidate for it. He’s cheap, versatile, and ok at best. Ideally over a season he wouldn’t even play.

As stated above, I don't think that the "cheap, versatile, and hopefully won't be needed to play" argument (...aka "The Case For Ryan Lloyd"!) will really apply next season, with a reduced squad size. Everyone in that 20-man squad will need to be able to come in and play a number of games at various points over the season (the under-age players that can supplement the squad will be far more likely to fit your description though).

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On 25/02/2021 at 20:49, 1 said:

Who you keeping, assuming you can re-sign anyone and move on under-contract players?

Darrell may be mulling it over, but we’ve seen enough to know who we would keep.

Next season starters:

Brown (maybe bench)

 

Gibbo

NEW

Smith

NEW

 

NEW

Conlon

NEW

Worrall

 

NEW

NEW

 

Bench:

Taylor

Monty

Rodney

 

That’s a lot of new players, but I reckon that’s what we need to be serious about next season.

 

Thats about it. Will Pope be retained in some capacity? Join the gang of ex players. part-time Pro/ Coaching contract?

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In today's Press Conference Clarke again alludes to the current defenders not being good enough in terms of distribution :-

"...we have to get better with the ball at the back. Are those players capable of doing that? I am not so sure but we will keep working away on that. But you can’t always change what has not been brought in to them."

From his repeated comments about this I can't see him keeping any of the defenders that are out-of-contract - Crookes, Mills, Legge (obviously depending on his contract terms) - and even more likely with those that he hasn't even picked up to yet, such as Brisley, Fitzpatrick, maybe RCG?

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The irony of that is that Fitzpatrick is probably the best defender that we have on the ball, he rarely gives it away. Although he doesn’t seem to take too many risks in his passing forwards like a Monty or a Gibbo does. 

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I think with Crookes he is at a point in his career where he needs someone to show faith in him and stick with him. If no one does then he may never make it.

When you look at players Prosser and Raglan that have left us whilst young and have gone onto having reasonable lower league careers that was what it took for them. Similarly with Jules.

Prosser played 33 times for us and didn't look like he would forge a career in the football league and has gone onto play over 100 games for 2 clubs.

Jules in his 2 appearances for us looked like he would never make a footballer. Macc and Walsall threw him in and let him play regularly. They probably saw him make a lot of awful errors similar to the ones Crookes made against Tranmere.

These young players either learn from the mistakes they make or don't. One thing is key though. If no one sticks with them and gives them the opportunity to learn then they never will.

If we want to develop players we have to pick the right players to have faith in and then stick with them for a reasonable period of time. Put up with their mistakes and give them the opportunity to develop. If not we will be faced with the same continual churn of players.

It's hard to get right and in the past we have certainly picked the wrong ones to stick with. You will get plenty of Dan Turners and James Lawries for every Billy Paynter. If you are lucky you may get a Jordan Hugill.

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In a squad of 20, assuming monty, Gibbo and Smith are all here, will mean we need at least 1 nailed on CB starter then two players who can be versatile in two positions across the back line. Crookes, Legge and Brisley have no chance of a single contract between them.

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Posted (edited)
On 28/02/2021 at 20:48, pete vale said:

Thats about it. Will Pope be retained in some capacity? Join the gang of ex players. part-time Pro/ Coaching contract?

I don’t mind him being given a coaching role. I think there’s a big difference between a player who happens to have finished up at Vale staying on, and a Vale fan who’s done so much for the club and is a lifelong fan. He’ll put everything into any role he has at the club, and that’s worth it’s weight in gold.

Edited by 1

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On 27/02/2021 at 13:55, Wrex said:

Exactly. Seems like everyone has forgotten this but there was a bloke called David Flitcroft who was hired a few weeks ago to be our new director of football.

Flitcroft handles the recruitment, he builds the academy, he judges how well the manager is doing.

Clarke picks the team, motivates the players and sets the match day tactics. If he gets a new squad in the summer (be realistic and say half of them new new, assuming you keep the good half of the current squad) and can't get results out of them then he's out the door. Simple as.

Absolutely no point in having a director of football if we can't sack the manager because he's on some long term project and we can only judge him after five years.

Clarke reckons he’s only “theoretically” under Flitcroft in the pecking order. That would be a popcorn-worthy barny to watch

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Posted (edited)

I thought Clarke's comments about the back "three" not playing it out was a bit disingenuous.  They are clearly under orders if in doubt row zed it at the moment. Which is fair enough.

Crookes can do a job as the left of three CB's. He's been alright there. As one of two, he's not good enough in the air. As LB he is too slow and poor on the ball.

Nothing against the bloke, he been alright playing there. Just it makes him a bit specialist to a three at the back.

Edited by toyahw
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On my retained list and aiming for promotion!

I don’t see that we will keep any of Legge, Brisley or Crookes. Fitzpatrick and Mills to vanish also with a doubt about Montano. Therefore, I complete overhaul of the defence! Speed, strength and ability to head and pass are prerequisite for the roles. Good luck with that!,

Midfield no Whithead, if we can get rid, Joyce and Amos and Manny also to go based on their injury records.

Up front, a combination of three to leave to definitely include Cullen and Guthrie.

This is a major task for DC/ DF to resolve with 13 players to go. Might sound cutthroat/ revolutionary, but it might need to be achieved in two stages. Strong cull next season, with a tinker the following season. 

 

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