Match Thread: Bolton Wanderers v Port Vale

[philpvfc]

16 minutes ago, sheffield61 said:

NEXT HOME GAMES......

MKD 

BURTON 

CAMBRIDGE 

BRISTOL ROVERS 

 

Surely enough points there to achieve a mid table finish come May time....🤔😁

 

 

 

 

 

 

Agree, we should take 3 points from those games.

[werstayinup]

10 hours ago, 1 said:

I’d be happy with doing a deal to bring Taylor in on a permanent in the summer, assuming he can do a full season without getting a long term injury. I suppose it’s a risk with anyone. Then get two strikers as good as Willo and Proc to make up the 4. The irony is we don’t need to improve the strike force for next season, we just need 3 of available for every game, not 1 or none for half the season, or nobody actually properly fit or whatever other scenario we turn up with. 

I think the question will be can we afford Taylor on a full wage and can we afford two strikers the same calibre as Proc and Wilson? We certainly do need those type of players as well as a first class keeper but all come at a price which we may or may not be prepared to pay.

[PV1973]

1 hour ago, Bald Eagle said:

Connor Hall is one of those who’s performances improve the longer he is gone.

in reality this season he was a shadow of the player in the promotion run in, and was at fault for numerous goals before rightly losing his spot to Dan Jones, who has stepped up a level in terms of performances.

Every transfer is a calculated risk, however maybe the club had already decided they wouldn’t be offering Connor a deal in the summer, and when a fee was put on the table for a now back up centre half then they have offered to take it for the long term betterment of the club.  Same as happened with Johnson and the much maligned Hussey, both of whom are now regulars at League 2 promotion hunting Stockport. Donnelly came in as the replacement back up, and due to injuries to Cass and Jones has become first choice, and has fared reasonably overall.

We still have more than enough to be safe this season, and with a better balance sheet can look for a better version of Connor Hall in the summer.

 Yes we could have kept him, but the outcome was not guaranteed. Maybe his performances would have dipped further as the travelling and young family took its toll or as he was disillusioned at not being allowed to move closer to home. Maybe he would have performed the same or better than Donnelly. Maybe he would have got injured and never kicked another ball for us, and we would have paid a further 6 months wages and never received a transfer fee.  

in summary, a calculated risk, after which I am sure we will be comfortably in League 1, and in better financial shape.

You may not agree with the outcome, but I believe it will have been a logical decision making process and not a knee jerk slashing of the wage bill.

Donnolly has performed nowhere near as well as Hall this season. But that’s not my point about Hall, it was not in response to  how good or bad he was, it’s about us shifting players off the budget because it needs to be cut. It’s about us getting rid of staff behind the scenes to cut the budget, the stadium manager being one of many who’ve gone. It’s about us bringing in a cheap option like Donnolly and taking a chance. It’s about us not bringing in any signings in January despite flitcroft and Clarke saying they were. Things have changed behind the scenes and are not as rosey as people may think. 

[Bycarsbill]

14 hours ago, LancyTony said:

 

You know this, do you? Or is it that, under pressure, the players show they are only human and make mistakes? Why assume it's lack of coaching?

Look back over many matches and there have been far too many goals conceded from shots in the 20yds plus range. Closing down is a simple tenet of coaching and taking these two facts together, is the reason for the assumption. Sure, goalkeeping also becomes an issue when conceding from this range, but if the shooter is closed-down much more quickly less shots reach the target! 

[philpvfc]

40 minutes ago, werstayinup said:

I think the question will be can we afford Taylor on a full wage and can we afford two strikers the same calibre as Proc and Wilson? We certainly do need those type of players as well as a first class keeper but all come at a price which we may or may not be prepared to pay.

I’ve not seen anything in Taylor to make me feel he is any better than what we already have and at his age he won’t be getting any better. The only real positive in Taylor is in the fact he is fit.

[JRC]

9 minutes ago, Bycarsbill said:

Look back over many matches and there have been far too many goals conceded from shots in the 20yds plus range. Closing down is a simple tenet of coaching and taking these two facts together, is the reason for the assumption. Sure, goalkeeping also becomes an issue when conceding from this range, but if the shooter is closed-down much more quickly less shots reach the target! 

When teams attack out wide we drop one of our central midfield players behind the wingback.  That allows the 3 centrebacks to stay in the box. That leaves one midfield player to challenge for the second ball. Whether changing how we defend and sending a centrehalf out to support the wingback would lead to more goals conceded from the initial cross is the question. 

There second goal yesterday came from Pett gambling on winning the ball off their centreforward. I thought there centreforward showed good skill and awareness to play the ball back to their midfield player. The midfield player also showed good awareness of what Pett was trying to do, checked his run and gave himself an extra couple of metres to get his shot away.

[Coyney Valiant]

8 hours ago, philpvfc said:

I’d agree with your comments but we probably won’t play like that for the remainder of the season and we will lose a lot more than we win.

A lot on hear are talking like we play like that most games and are not getting the rub of the green , yesterday was an exception we were excellent apart for the defending on the 2 goals but most games we are very poor and are likely to be against the Dons on Saturday and if we lose are very much in a relegation battle which was unthinkable after we beat forest green 

[chrisbirchall]

Why are so many people unhappy with the manager being questioned. We have 5 points from the last 30 available. Sorry who else are we to question with form like that. Five year deal was crazy at this level of football but it is what it is. Somehow we have to get another 8/9 points from somewhere. It won’t be easy. It’s ok saying we have teams below to play at home but they have more to fight for and will be far harder games than we all think. 

[Port Vale Paul]

15 hours ago, soothsayer said:

Thought we played well today - Anyone who says otherwise didn’t go to the game. We are just going through one of those spells at the moment but keep playing like that and the tide will turn (hopefully Saturday). 
Had we had their No.5 Santos in our team we’d have won. We just need a big uncompromising centre to command our box.

Somebody like Derek Agyaka maybe.

[sandyford_valiant]

Thought vale were very good yesterday and should’ve come away with at least a point. Swap the keepers around and we win that game. The strikers headed their first goal in from about 4 yards out so I think stone has to move off his line a yard and claim the ball. Also ojo got outjumped. We’re crying out for some height in the team. That needs to be addressed in the summer also. The second was yet another strike from the edge of the box that sails past him (again). We played some good stuff and got in behind their full backs countless times and it’s just didn’t fall for us most of the day. The dummy by Taylor for example that got blocked would’ve been a simple tap in for Harrison. 

the only problem is we will probably turn up Saturday and be totally different again and it’s a very big game this is now. We have to win to restore some confidence and to get the points in the bag against a side below us. We can’t let morecambe and these beat us. 9 point gap is healthy but we’ve played games more and the longer we don’t win then it gives us a chance to slide down the table. Couple more wins could be enough but that has to start Saturday. Any news on the return of James Wilson? Or is he still running in straight lines on the grass 

[werstayinup]

5 minutes ago, Port Vale Paul said:

Somebody like Derek Agyaka maybe.

I wonder if once we are safe DC might give him a go and maybe even recall Plant for him to have a go

[philpvfc]

We ain’t got a problem with the centre back, Smith had a good game again yesterday but once again we conceded 2 goals which were not defenders faults, the first was very poor by Ojo ( I thought it was Massey so will need to see the video again) and no attempt by Stone to collect a cross within 6 feet of him and the second being Massey allowing a free head to set up the chance which although it was a decent shot, it was no better than Garrity’s which was well saved. 

Forrester and Smith look more than capable in this division as does Jones once back from injury and not playing in the middle. 

We are conceding goals because our keepers ain’t good enough and the midfielders don’t help out enough.

[valefan16]

Thought vale were very good yesterday and should’ve come away with at least a point. Swap the keepers around and we win that game. The strikers headed their first goal in from about 4 yards out so I think stone has to move off his line a yard and claim the ball. Also ojo got outjumped. We’re crying out for some height in the team. That needs to be addressed in the summer also. The second was yet another strike from the edge of the box that sails past him (again). We played some good stuff and got in behind their full backs countless times and it’s just didn’t fall for us most of the day. The dummy by Taylor for example that got blocked would’ve been a simple tap in for Harrison. 

the only problem is we will probably turn up Saturday and be totally different again and it’s a very big game this is now. We have to win to restore some confidence and to get the points in the bag against a side below us. We can’t let morecambe and these beat us. 9 point gap is healthy but we’ve played games more and the longer we don’t win then it gives us a chance to slide down the table. Couple more wins could be enough but that has to start Saturday. Any news on the return of James Wilson? Or is he still running in straight lines on the grass 

We’ve got 8 points from our last 12 games, poor and reason for concern but the positive is repeat that we are probably safe.

The only three points with equal are worse than us over that period are all well below us in the table so if they repeat that would see them unable to close in on us over the last 12 and three other sides below us only picked up 2-3 points which would if repeated still see us comfortably safe.

Essentially just a slight improvement and we cruise to safety from here.

Obviously can’t afford a poorer run over the next 12 but kind run in on paper and fit strikers surely will avoid that?

[JRC]

12 minutes ago, sandyford_valiant said:

Thought vale were very good yesterday and should’ve come away with at least a point. Swap the keepers around and we win that game. The strikers headed their first goal in from about 4 yards out so I think stone has to move off his line a yard and claim the ball. Also ojo got outjumped. We’re crying out for some height in the team. That needs to be addressed in the summer also. The second was yet another strike from the edge of the box that sails past him (again). We played some good stuff and got in behind their full backs countless times and it’s just didn’t fall for us most of the day. The dummy by Taylor for example that got blocked would’ve been a simple tap in for Harrison. 

the only problem is we will probably turn up Saturday and be totally different again and it’s a very big game this is now. We have to win to restore some confidence and to get the points in the bag against a side below us. We can’t let morecambe and these beat us. 9 point gap is healthy but we’ve played games more and the longer we don’t win then it gives us a chance to slide down the table. Couple more wins could be enough but that has to start Saturday. Any news on the return of James Wilson? Or is he still running in straight lines on the grass 

Don't agree on the second goal. It was from the edge of the box and hit the stiching of the side netting when it hit the back of the net. If you compare that shot to Garrity's from a little closer it much lower and wider of the keeper. First one some fault on the keeper but mainly on Massey. The keeper had to go near post when we reacted slowly to the short corner because we didn't have a defender on the post. If he'd kept his starting position from the initial corner it would definitely have been Stone's cross. 

Saturday is important. 

[sandyford_valiant]

7 minutes ago, valefan16 said:

We’ve got 8 points from our last 12 games, poor and reason for concern but the positive is repeat that we are probably safe.

The only three points with equal are worse than us over that period are all well below us in the table so if they repeat that would see them unable to close in on us over the last 12 and three other sides below us only picked up 2-3 points which would if repeated still see us comfortably safe.

Essentially just a slight improvement and we cruise to safety from here.

Obviously can’t afford a poorer run over the next 12 but kind run in on paper and fit strikers surely will avoid that?

I agree with you that we should be safe. But morecambe gained three on us and we can’t really let MK dons do the same. There’s more than enough games left and winnable to achieve another couple of wins and that should do it, but I’d very much like one of those to come Saturday and relieve some needless pressure that could set in.