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Turnstile situation at the Railway Stand/Paddock.


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I got to the ground at 2.45 thinking it will take about 15 minutes get in. When I got there and saw the queues there was queues everywhere I joined a queue with about 50 people ahead of me and I thought I should still get in by kick off. It got to 3 o clock and the queue had barely moved and there were more people behind us. A steward then had to open the gate up for something which resulted in a few vale fans forcing it open fully and ended up with what must have been 500 people including myself getting in the ground around 3.05 without being scanned in. If the gate hadn't been opened we wouldn't have got in till 3.30 maybe later. I don't know why they didn't delay kick off by 15 minutes or so to give people the chance to get in and take there seats on time. We have played Macclesfield a few times away and they delay kick offs if there's still big queues outside but vale never do it.

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Just now, Andy Proctor said:

I got to the ground at 2.45 thinking it will take about 15 minutes get in. When I got there and saw the queues there was queues everywhere I joined a queue with about 50 people ahead of me and I thought I should still get in by kick off. It got to 3 o clock and the queue had barely moved and there were more people behind us.

I was the same Andy, although got in eventually through the turnstile shortly before the gate thing happened, the stewards looked pretty lost to be honest.

I overheard someone saying that supposedly Vale had the option and authority to delay but actually declined. Heresay but that's what I heard.

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1 hour ago, Rudgiesflatcap said:

that’s a difficult choice in my opinion! Oh no changed my mind I’ll just leave the pub 15 minutes earlier. 

To do what? Stand on an open to the elements concourse in the cold for an extra 30 mins before kick off, to queue for 20 mins to buy crap food (for cash only despite advertisments to the contrary) from 2 overwhelmed staff in the kiosk?

As Joe says, everyone getting there early just also brings the bottleneck forward in time. It does nothing to solve the fundamental issue of a complete lack of planning and management in relation to the woefully inadequate facilities.

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Posted (edited)

People are making it a time issue (get there at 2:30! I'm so mint!) and not a capacity issue.

I don't know the exact capacity of the Railway Stand but for arguments sake let's say it's 3000. Four turnstiles.

3000/4 = 750 fans per turnstile.

30 mins from 2:30-3:00. Each turnstile has to process 750 each. That's 25 people a minute, or a person through every 2 seconds. 

If we intend on having full, or even close to full, Railway Stands, we need more than 4 turnstiles, whether people get there at 2:30 to pay cash for a cold pie and stand on a hill in the cold or not.

Edited by Joe B

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21 minutes ago, Doha said:

To do what? Stand on an open to the elements concourse in the cold for an extra 30 mins before kick off, to queue for 20 mins to buy crap food (for cash only despite advertisments to the contrary) from 2 overwhelmed staff in the kiosk?

As Joe says, everyone getting there early just also brings the bottleneck forward in time. It does nothing to solve the fundamental issue of a complete lack of planning and management in relation to the woefully inadequate facilities.

If your choice is to sit in a pub for an extra 15 minutes then that’s your choice. I’d rather see a stronger team on the pitch and build success for the team. Just don’t complain when you have to wait. 
theres no magic money tree out there. Unless of course you want to pay for turnstiles personally. 

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3 minutes ago, Rudgiesflatcap said:

If your choice is to sit in a pub for an extra 15 minutes then that’s your choice. I’d rather see a stronger team on the pitch and build success for the team. Just don’t complain when you have to wait. 
theres no magic money tree out there. Unless of course you want to pay for turnstiles personally. 

Everyone rocking up earlier only makes the bottleneck happen earlier. Then what?

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1 minute ago, Doha said:

Everyone rocking up earlier only makes the bottleneck happen earlier. Then what?

I agree you would have to wait, but you wouldn’t miss the start of the match like some did. 
what do you suggest is the solution?
Do you turn up everywhere a few minutes before it starts and expect to walk straight in. 

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Wonder if anyone from the club comes on OVF to see this thread eg mr garlicky or mr tideswell, what should be certain is the operators in the police box should of seen the chaos outside at 3 pm as there are cameras in that area above the turnstiles 

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2 minutes ago, Rudgiesflatcap said:

I agree you would have to wait, but you wouldn’t miss the start of the match like some did. 
what do you suggest is the solution?
Do you turn up everywhere a few minutes before it starts and expect to walk straight in. 

I've honestly never had to queue at any other league ground as long as I have at Vale, never. Even a sold out Crewe away stand, Burton, sold out Rochdale in the promotion season, many of the away games this season, all miles and miles quicker.

I have a vague recollection of someone official at the club posting a authoritive breakdown of the capacity by stand at VP since the LS seats were put in on social media but I can't find it. However, I know that the paddock alone holds 3750 not including the railway stand above.

It has 6 turnstiles. 2 on the club shop side are reserved for ST only, general admission tickets get turned away. I think one of the other two on the synectics side is also restricted to ST.

3 general admission turnstiles for a section holding 3750.

If it's getting on for full, as it nearly was yesterday -

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FIl-37nWQAI8_KP?format=jpg&name=large

 

then getting 3750 people through 6 turnstiles by getting there early at 14:30 as you suggest would need a flow rate of 21 fans a minute through each turnstile to just make kick off. Ignoring how that rate would actually be completely hampered by the fact that only some fans are allowed through 3 of those turnstiles because they're ST only.

If everyone showed up even an hour before kick off it'd still necessiate a very optimistic rate of 1 entry every 6 seconds. Just for the paddock.

The railway has 6 gates too, some also ST restricted. Were all 6 even open yesterday as I heard something about the 2 at the bycars end not being manned? Not sure.

The crapness of the facilities is exposed every single single single time the crowd is above about 6000, and the management of mitigating the problems whenever it does happen is always non existant, hence the gate being rushed yesterday. Garlick was on the radio saying they were expecting over 8000, how do they then manage the busiest stand knowing there'd be massive queues, particuarly with people buying tickets at the last minute because the last 4 games got cancelled at short notice? They didn't, at least they didn't overtly. No planning, no queue management measures, several long queues snaking around, even crossing, and stewards doing nothing. Hence hundreds stuck outside until the gate got rushed. 

I'm not asking for a row of automated turnstiles right this very isntant. I'm asking for Vale to get a grip, acknowledge the perpetual list of shortcomings in the typical fans matchday experience that starts even before you can actually get in, and actually talk to us about the way forward. This is going to happen several more times this season if we carry on as we've started and go for automatic promotion.

 

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I'm wondering if something happened yesterday with regard to the stewards? 

I've been to nearly every home game this season and have often been bemused by the sheer number of stewards for a crowd of 5k odd. It has seemed completely disproportionate and presumably quite costly. 

So it was surprising to see just a couple outside the Railway Paddock entrance yesterday for what was bound to be a bigger crowd. They seemed to serve no purpose such as directing the queues, and l noticed any attempt at searching people had been abandoned (there were two bag-search tables left unmanned). 

One very simple effort might have helped, i. e making sure everyone knew that tickets could be presented at any of the three turnstiles. Unfortunately the league match signage saying "Season Tickets" above one of the turnstiles probably confused many people and resulted in people needlessly doing what British people do... join the biggest queue! 

We seem to have a staff of hundreds these days with all manner of fancy job titles....but the absolute basics continue to elude us. Time for someone at the club to actually get a grip of this nonsense. 

 

 

 

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I completely understand and sympathise by the way if they're struggling with turnstile operator/steward recruitment, covid isolating etc. Tell us though, customers don't like getting let down and then left in the dark. Some of those casual walk up fans cba coming back. Costing us ticket and merch and kiosk revenue.

I'll be there for Swindon. Should be a good crowd after the Brentford performance, time off, massive 3 points against a promotion rival. Will it all still be as disorganised and will the promised card payment systems still not be working? I'd put money on my guess tbh.

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@Doha it’s always been the case for us long as I’ve been going the vale. It’s a catch 22 situation when we have poor teams and results resulting in low numbers there’s no case to make for improvements.
When we start to invest correctly in the team, resulting in  better performance  and increasing numbers in the ground.  do we then improve the access and maybe not have the resources to buy the players to gain promotion.I personally will put up with the difficulties and hope for success and wait for improvements in the infrastructure to follow from there. 

Admittedly during the periods when we were in higher leagues during JR,s and Micky’s tenures it wasn’t as difficult to get fans through the gates. 
Iv’e no idea why this is, maybe someone at the club needs to find out. 
it surely can’t be quicker to take entrance money and give out change than scan a pre purchased ticket. 

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2 minutes ago, Playa Amodores said:

I enter by the turnstiles by the club shop. It’s been a long time since I’ve been to the other end of the RP. I thought that there were turnstiles there, is that not the case

Are the family stand turnstiles shared with the paddock on that side then? I can't remember ever being up that end. Would they even be in operation if so given the family stand is closed?

 

Untitled.thumb.png.42538af675619d2fb306413757d24d09.png

 

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4 minutes ago, Doha said:

Are the family stand turnstiles shared with the paddock on that side then? I can't remember ever being up that end. Would they even be in operation if so given the family stand is closed?

 

Untitled.thumb.png.42538af675619d2fb306413757d24d09.png

 

Neither of the sets of turnstiles in the photo are in use.

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