To provide a little balance - The budget

[Iron Curtain]

That’s what I can’t get my head round.

If the club is losing money as he claims a clever businessman would sell it now while he can still get some money for it instead of letting it fall into receivership.

Unfortunately the Hugill money (last payment due anytime now ) has given him time to continue his rule over our club.

As you say if you allowed your house to fall into disrepair you would not expect to sell it for more than you paid for it.

He paid 1.2 million to buy the club and admits he made mistakes( I won’t duplicate Mellon’s post).

He has had 5 interested parties willing to stump up 50k to see the books who must have been seriously considering taking over the club.

Surely even he must realise now he has inherited the Hugill money that there are no obvious windfalls coming in his direction and he will have to put his hand in his pocket to keep the club going.

His chances of selling the club for a reasonable price are falling each week.

The 4 million pound question is why is he hanging on to the club?

 

My guess is because if anyone were to buy it now, they wouldn’t pay his crazy asking price given it’s not worth that... so he would still “lose on the deal”

 

He is valuing the club at the money he is invested into it... which is wrong.

 

As money is coming into the club, my guess is that he is chipping away at his directors loans (whilst not reinvesting in the playing squad)... eventually the loans will be reduced to the level that the club is actually worth.

 

My guess is that at this point he will make a decision:

 

A) if he thinks he can continue to make money from transfers of youth players then he will hang onto the club and keep taking that money out (hopefully whilst redressing the balance between paying himself and investing in the squad, but I wouldn’t hold my breath)

 

B) if he thinks there is no more money to come then he will sell the club and disappear.

 

Either way... he can look at himself in the mirror and say “Norman, you never lose on a deal”

 

The fact that he has negatively impacted a community club beloved by so many won’t even cross his mind. What a man.

 

Now interestingly... if he has not reduced his directors loans then he is just syphoning off the cash and not even lowering his valuation. Then he really is a nasty piece of work.

 

The fine for posting accounts late is minimal, so I suspect we won’t find out for a while.

[Valiant!]

My guess is because if anyone were to buy it now, they wouldn’t pay his crazy asking price given it’s not worth that... so he would still “lose on the deal”

 

He is valuing the club at the money he is invested into it... which is wrong.

 

As money is coming into the club, my guess is that he is chipping away at his directors loans (whilst not reinvesting in the playing squad)... eventually the loans will be reduced to the level that the club is actually worth.

 

My guess is that at this point he will make a decision:

 

A) if he thinks he can continue to make money from transfers of youth players then he will hang onto the club and keep taking that money out (hopefully whilst redressing the balance between paying himself and investing in the squad, but I wouldn’t hold my breath)

 

B) if he thinks there is no more money to come then he will sell the club and disappear.

 

Either way... he can look at himself in the mirror and say “Norman, you never lose on a deal”

 

The fact that he has negatively impacted a community club beloved by so many won’t even cross his mind. What a man.

 

Now interestingly... if he has not reduced his directors loans then he is just syphoning off the cash and not even lowering his valuation. Then he really is a nasty piece of work.

 

The fine for posting accounts late is minimal, so I suspect we won’t find out for a while.

 

Accounts are done by his Mrs?😂

[Regal Beagle]

Do you think an appropriate amount of the £2.4m earned from player sales, cup runs and other income has been reinvested in the squad?

 

No I don't.

[Regal Beagle]

My guess is because if anyone were to buy it now, they wouldn’t pay his crazy asking price given it’s not worth that... so he would still “lose on the deal”

 

He is valuing the club at the money he is invested into it... which is wrong.

 

As money is coming into the club, my guess is that he is chipping away at his directors loans (whilst not reinvesting in the playing squad)... eventually the loans will be reduced to the level that the club is actually worth.

 

My guess is that at this point he will make a decision:

 

A) if he thinks he can continue to make money from transfers of youth players then he will hang onto the club and keep taking that money out (hopefully whilst redressing the balance between paying himself and investing in the squad, but I wouldn’t hold my breath)

 

B) if he thinks there is no more money to come then he will sell the club and disappear.

 

Either way... he can look at himself in the mirror and say “Norman, you never lose on a deal”

 

The fact that he has negatively impacted a community club beloved by so many won’t even cross his mind. What a man.

 

Now interestingly... if he has not reduced his directors loans then he is just syphoning off the cash and not even lowering his valuation. Then he really is a nasty piece of work.

 

The fine for posting accounts late is minimal, so I suspect we won’t find out for a while.

 

I would hope that Smurf isn't stupid enough to have taken the money out and not paid down the loan. He'd be paying income tax otherwise so it would not be beneficial to him to take it out as a salary/dividend without paying off his loan first.

 

I think.

[Howjy04]

That’s what I can’t get my head round.

If the club is losing money as he claims a clever businessman would sell it now while he can still get some money for it instead of letting it fall into receivership.

Unfortunately the Hugill money (last payment due anytime now ) has given him time to continue his rule over our club.

As you say if you allowed your house to fall into disrepair you would not expect to sell it for more than you paid for it.

He paid 1.2 million to buy the club and admits he made mistakes( I won’t duplicate Mellon’s post).

He has had 5 interested parties willing to stump up 50k to see the books who must have been seriously considering taking over the club.

Surely even he must realise now he has inherited the Hugill money that there are no obvious windfalls coming in his direction and he will have to put his hand in his pocket to keep the club going.

His chances of selling the club for a reasonable price are falling each week.

The 4 million pound question is why is he hanging on to the club?

 

Last Hughill payment due 2020.

[Erniemossrules]

Last Hughill payment due 2020.

 

I thought there were 3 payments so does that mean they are annual payments?

He moved last January so has he only received the second payment now.

[Bycarsbill]

Can someone help me out and tell me; is John Rudge still associated with the club and if so, what his role is and does he have any input into signings/pay structure?

[man in the pub]

That’s what I can’t get my head round.

If the club is losing money as he claims a clever businessman would sell it now while he can still get some money for it instead of letting it fall into receivership.

Unfortunately the Hugill money (last payment due anytime now ) has given him time to continue his rule over our club.

As you say if you allowed your house to fall into disrepair you would not expect to sell it for more than you paid for it.

He paid 1.2 million to buy the club and admits he made mistakes( I won’t duplicate Mellon’s post).

He has had 5 interested parties willing to stump up 50k to see the books who must have been seriously considering taking over the club.

Surely even he must realise now he has inherited the Hugill money that there are no obvious windfalls coming in his direction and he will have to put his hand in his pocket to keep the club going.

His chances of selling the club for a reasonable price are falling each week.

The 4 million pound question is why is he hanging on to the club?

 

Spot on Ernie. Its like a situation where lets say my wife wants us to move house but I dont. So I put the house on the market for twice its value. I can then say I have put it up for sale BUT in reality I haven't because there isn't a snowballs chance in Hell of me selling it. Isn't that exactly what Smurf has done and the killer question is why. Surely like in my scenario its because there isn't a genuine desire to sell it and why is that. My view is that the Vale isn't losing him 75k per month but quite the opposite its generating him a profit.

[smithie]

Can someone help me out and tell me; is John Rudge still associated with the club and if so, what his role is and does he have any input into signings/pay structure?

 

Sir John was at the reserve game on Wednesday so I'd assume he's sticking around.

[man in the pub]

Last Hughill payment due 2020.

 

Surely though Howjy if all he is waiting for is the Howgill money a deal could be done for the Vale at a sensible price with the future payments going to Smurf.

[Erniemossrules]

I would hope that Smurf isn't stupid enough to have taken the money out and not paid down the loan. He'd be paying income tax otherwise so it would not be beneficial to him to take it out as a salary/dividend without paying off his loan first.

 

I think.

 

Creative accounting springs to mind.What other reason is there for him to keep his ghost companies as they are not trading.

He also has Borough Stadium co at Nuneaton Borough to squirrel away his ill gotten gains.

[Santa]

Creative accounting springs to mind.What other reason is there for him to keep his ghost companies as they are not trading.

You have to ask what is Borough stadium co set up in July 2018.

I was under the impression the stadium was under Alchemy and the club Port Vale FC.

Boro Stadium Company is for the other team's ground that he owns.

[Howjy04]

Surely though Howjy if all he is waiting for is the Howgill money a deal could be done for the Vale at a sensible price with the future payments going to Smurf.

 

I have said in the past,MITP,any new owner

who offered what Smurthwaite paid for the club(1.2m) and he sold it at that price the new owners would be getting the club for nothing.That was before January 2019 payment.Now they would have to find extra.I did say I would be looking for 3m if I was selling.Probably 2.5+ now.

[Jacko51]

I have said in the past,MITP,any new owner

who offered what Smurthwaite paid for the club(1.2m) and he sold it at that price the new owners would be getting the club for nothing.That was before January 2019 payment.Now they would have to find extra.I did say I would be looking for 3m if I was selling.Probably 2.5+ now.

 

Are we talking club or cluband ground here?

[Howjy04]

Are we talking club or cluband ground here?

 

Both Jean.