Would Vale get more from Norman by making some sort of peace?

[geosname]

If someone knows and have qualifications in understanding and applying the law better than them fine but patronising them or indeed referees who are meticulous in their preparation and understanding of the laws to be applied and have been examined and undertake regular seminars and assessments because someone thinks they know is ignorant' date=' arrogant and / or dim.[/quote']

It is rarely the fault of the "law" when something goes wrong..... you can wear the uniform and memorize all the laws but if you can't interpret them or apply them to the relevant situation your still an ass.... sadly with the police they tend to rely on their authority, uniform, warrent card etc to bend, and sometimes break, the law to gain conformity with what they want and sadly the public expects and relies on the police to be honest so accept it... if a police officer tells you he/she knows the law they are lying.... they don't even know their own policy.

[pjg1876]

Nope and this is his biggest failure - the 4 appointments of 4 poor managers who haven’t been able to motivate poor players they have brought in.

 

Not sure that Aspin's signings are all poor players. They just haven't played to their potential as a team.

 

Brown, Legge, Clark, Joyce, Okeleye, Miller (to name a few) are not poor players. Some have had decent careers, the others will probably go on to have decent careers. But they (Brown excepted) have never achieved any consistency since being at the Vale.

[Robbie Earle's Perm]

Not sure that Aspin's signings are all poor players. They just haven't played to their potential as a team.

 

Brown, Legge, Clark, Joyce, Okeleye, Miller (to name a few) are not poor players. Some have had decent careers, the others will probably go on to have decent careers. But they (Brown excepted) have never achieved any consistency since being at the Vale.

 

Completely agree on Brown and there is hope for Hannant, Okeleye and Clark but I can’t see it in the others unless they get a rocket from a Micky style of manager.

[geosname]

As an aside, I'm always very wary of the over simplified narrative regarding Chamberlain. There's an argument he was buying time.

 

You could argue whether Smurthwaite would have got more out of Page if he'd made peace with him rather than being a total **** to him, telling BT Sport he'd sack him live on air, giving him a public bollocking on the pitch at Exeter, and then admitting on social media he'd offered all his players rubbish money so both them and him would leave.

 

Does anybody really think he recruited Bruno and his merry band of amateurs because somebody was calling him unkind names?

 

Re Chamberlain... that's not what he said.

Re Smurf..... the only way to get him to do what most want is to hit him where it hurts most... sadly this also hurts the club.

Shouting at him during the match.... or pre match then paying to enter won't do a damn thing, he already has your money or he will get it. Once he has it there doesn't have to be change.

[Santa]

Nope and this is his biggest failure - the 4 appointments of 4 poor managers who haven’t been able to motivate poor players they have brought in.

That's quite a biggie for a football club owner.

 

OK fair enough, so there's an overarching recruitment problem that won't resolve itself by simply being nice to Norman.

 

We need to look at the root causes of that: wages? poor reputation within the game as an employer? It's a very competitive market out there for a relatively small pool of talent. The owner has not appreciated this and has tried to game this market, with disastrous results.

[Robbie Earle's Perm]

That's quite a biggie for a football club owner.

 

OK fair enough, so there's an overarching recruitment problem that won't resolve itself by simply being nice to Norman.

 

We need to look at the root causes of that: wages? poor reputation within the game as an employer? It's a very competitive market out there for a relatively small pool of talent. The owner has not appreciated this and has tried to game this market, with disastrous results.

 

Totally agree and it’s his biggest failure and can’t be defended.

 

It appears easiest to suggest wages, pay peanuts and get monkeys.

 

He needs to go back to what worked brilliantly for him and the club, an experienced and successful league manager that can galvanise the players, fans and club as a whole.

 

If we are successful fans will forget about him, ultimately the managers he’s appointed have wasted decent budgets and players have underperformed since Adams left and that’s the main Radeon why he gets flack, after all it’s a football club, not an accountants.

[Erniemossrules]

If someone knows and have qualifications in understanding and applying the law better than them fine but patronising them or indeed referees who are meticulous in their preparation and understanding of the laws to be applied and have been examined and undertake regular seminars and assessments because someone thinks they know is ignorant' date=' arrogant and / or dim.[/quote']

 

Some of the referees at Vale have been ignorant,arrogant and dim.

You only have to watch some of the referees in the Premier League who want to be the centre of attention rather than letting the players get on with the game.

If you can’t be a referee why don’t you get a job as a traffic warden?

[The Kalamazoo Kid]

Totally agree and it’s his biggest failure and can’t be defended.

 

It appears easiest to suggest wages, pay peanuts and get monkeys.

 

He needs to go back to what worked brilliantly for him and the club, an experienced and successful league manager that can galvanise the players, fans and club as a whole.

 

But even when he had Adams it seemed that he was eager to move him on, probably as he was costing too much. I posted the following earlier on this thread, but its probably more appropriate in response to your post :-

 

"..then when Adams contract was up took an absolute age to renew it - in fact, at the end of that season (first one after promotion when we finished 9th?) it seemed likely that Adams would be leaving.

 

Didn't Smurthwaite supposedly suggest to Adams that he should look what else was available as he didn't want us holding him back? (aka if you leave I can reduce the cost of the manager?!......plus start interfering on the playing side, which Smurthwaite himself has admitted he was able to do when Adams left, as he wouldn't have put up with it)."

 

Its all about getting people in on the cheap, as he won't pay the going rate - whether it be for a proven striker or, THE most important role at a football club, an experienced manager who knows what he is doing.

 

That incompetence and penny-pinching alone (not once or twice but 4, probably soon to be 5 times over) is reason enough to prove just how clueless and unsuitable he is for ownership of a professional football club, and why we need rid of him ASAP.

 

And that's without going into any of the other crap that he's been involved in since being here.

[Robbie Earle's Perm]

Some of the referees at Vale have been ignorant,arrogant and dim.

You only have to watch some of the referees in the Premier League who want to be the centre of attention rather than letting the players get on with the game.

 

You should always want play to flow, players and their cheating and theatrics play a massive part in that though, it’s why I was never a fan of Haldane or Worrall.

[Erniemossrules]

If appeasement or negotiation is not available the alternative is to TAKE POWER.Standing outside the Lorne Street shouting “Get out of our club” won’t achieve that.With V2001 there was a small chance that it could due to share ownership.Only one shareholder now.A negotiated sale at a price,not what fans think it should be,is the way forward imo.Probably more than someone is prepared to pay and probably less than the seller wants.It will be down to 2 parties eventually.We shall see who wants the club the most.

 

Actually I think you are wrong about protesting.

Norman is a sensitive soul who enjoys the free hospitality and pies and lording it over his followers on match days.

He has already contacted the supporters club asking them to be nice to him and not organise protests regarding his incompetent running of the club.

He makes up excuses that it might prevent sponsors giving him money on match days and hindering his marketing staff from doing their job.(Do they do any marketing anyway or sit down waiting for the phone to ring).Everything happening is not due to his previous history of running the club on a shoestring and making mistakes that have cost us our place in Div 1 and possibly in Div 2.If he thinks he is doing his best it is not good enough and he needs to give some one else who has Port Vale at heart the chance to turn things round.

He gave Fradley and Garlick the opportunity and it failed (is Garlick up to being CEO on a big salary as he does not seem to improve anything at the club since he came.In fact Norman said that when Baldrick Brown went Garlick would follow him.

He must be forced to accept that he is incapable of turning the club round and needs to sell at a reasonable price to give someone else a chance.

[Robbie Earle's Perm]

But even when he had Adams it seemed that he was eager to move him on, probably as he was costing too much. I posted the following earlier on this thread, but its probably more appropriate in response to your post :-

 

"..then when Adams contract was up took an absolute age to renew it - in fact, at the end of that season (first one after promotion when we finished 9th?) it seemed likely that Adams would be leaving.

 

Didn't Smurthwaite supposedly suggest to Adams that he should look what else was available as he didn't want us holding him back? (aka if you leave I can reduce the cost of the manager?!......plus start interfering on the playing side, which Smurthwaite himself has admitted he was able to do when Adams left, as he wouldn't have put up with it)."

 

Its all about getting people in on the cheap, as he won't pay the going rate - whether it be for a proven striker or, THE most important role at a football club, an experienced manager who knows what he is doing.

 

That incompetence and penny-pinching alone (not once or twice but 4, probably soon to be 5 times over) is reason enough to prove just how clueless and unsuitable he is for ownership of a professional football club, and why we need rid of him ASAP.

 

And that's without going into any of the other crap that he's been involved in since being here.

 

Can’t disagree with much if any of that, if he does appoint Askey he really has learnt nothing for the fifth time in a row.

[Howjy04]

Actually I think you are wrong about protesting.

Norman is a sensitive soul who enjoys the free hospitality and pies and lording it over his followers on match days.

He has already contacted the supporters club asking them to be nice to him and not organise protests regarding his incompetent running of the club.

He makes up excuses that it might prevent sponsors giving him money on match days and hindering his marketing staff from doing their job.(Do they do any marketing anyway or sit down waiting for the phone to ring).Everything happening is not due to his previous history of running the club on a shoestring and making mistakes that have cost us our place in Div 1 and possibly in Div 2.If he thinks he is doing his best it is not good enough and he needs to give some one else who has Port Vale at heart the chance to turn things round.

He gave Fradley and Garlick the opportunity and it failed (is Garlick up to being CEO on a big salary as he does not seem to improve anything at the club since he came.In fact Norman said that when Baldrick Brown went Garlick would follow him.

He must be forced to accept that he is incapable of turning the club round and needs to sell at a reasonable price to give someone else a chance.

 

How do you suggest you can get him to leave ernie?

[Jacko51]

How do you suggest you can get him to leave ernie?

 

Do you want him to stay, Howjy?

[Erniemossrules]

How do you suggest you can get him to leave ernie?

 

Starve him of the publicity he craves when he attends Vale matches.

He is already rattled by the protest organised by the supporters club.

It won’t be easy and will it get through his thick skull that he is not wanted by the majority of supporters.

We can’t just sit around expecting him to do the decent thing and sell up for a reasonable price to someone who has Vale at heart.His pathetic threats to go crying to the police about being abused and preventing young Vale supporters hearing nasty chants about him show that he is not a happy chappy being ridiculed.

You have to ask why he is staying on as owner unless he is milking it for every penny he can before leaving.

His best chance of making any money is to sell now while he still can get anything for it.

His over my dead body approach is killing the club and will never improve it while he runs it on a shoestring.

The other question is are any genuine buyers willing to negotiate with his belligerent attitude.

On his own admission there are people out there who have been willing to pay 50k to have sole buying rights but all have failed to conclude a deal.

He deliberately includes clauses so they can’t go public about any deal to prevent criticism of his way of negotiating or publicly saying what price he would accept.I do believe Carol and Ian negotiated a deal but he threw his toys out of his prom and walked out.

Maybe he still believes in fairies and that some Chinese billionaire will come along and make him an offer he can’t refuse.

[Santa]

How do you suggest you can get him to leave ernie?

Stop being mean to him?