PVFC Meet delegation of fans regarding current concerns

[joker1968]

4 hours ago, TonyD said:

I dont have much to add that Bede and Mellor haven't already said however I would like to say something about my own experience of Monday and the few days since.

I am as guilty as anybody of bashing out my opinion on the Internet without any regard for the people I am talking about.  Many people give the impression that they would love to have the opportunity to "put the owners right" on a few things.

It was not pleasant seeing first hand just how much the situation is affecting Carol.  I think we all forget sometimes that the people we lambast are just that, people.  We often think its OK to scream all sorts of things into the Internet but it really isn't.  

I have had a very strange week, where I have seen people take a statement and add their own conotations to it and talk about them like they are fact.  I have seen the absolute worst of people on all SM platforms, screaming all sorts of made up theories into the ether. 

I understand the clamour for detail and there was alot of debate behind the scenes over what, if anything we should say further.  We have been under alot of pressure to get this right.

One part of the official joint statement that seemed to attract alot of critism was the part about urging fans to put aside frustration to help give the players and management a boost.  I will hold my hands up and say that I wrote that part and not the club.  It was never meant to insinuate that fans hadn't been supportive and was only intended as it was written.  It was simply asking people to but it on the back burner to deal with later whilst we try to slavage league one status.  I felt that there was pertinence in acknowledging we are in a relegation battle and also in acknowledging there is fan frustration.  I got that wrong, so please don't bash the club for my misjudgement.

Some of the critism we faced was too much.

As I have said, I have been massively guilty of this myself and after this week, I must be better in future because I now know first hand that things we say on the Internet do effect people personally.

Meeting Carol under these circumstances has reassured me that the whole family are absolutely the right people to look after the best interests of the club.  I have not changed my mind about David Flitcroft, I am still of the opinion that he cannot come back from this.

I wanted to just calrify and apologise for my part in the statement and also to appeal to people to think a bit more before they sit at a keyboard.

I can't see how we stay up but one thing I will say from Monday is that Carol and Paddy have an absolute belief in Darren Moore, so until the fat lady sings, I'll be crossing my fingers that we are still a league one side next season.

I would say, let's get behind them on Saturday and see if we can't get 3 points to put us back in the race...  but perhaps not.

 

Well said and Thank You.UTV!

[Bimbleabout]

It may well be that DF's hands were tied for various financial reasons, wage structure, signing on fees, agents fees etc.
That, along with actually getting players interested in joining Vale and moving to this area could well be stumbling blocks for many a signing.
I'm not trying to defend DF but we are all pretty guilty of "assuming" and yes, the last 3 transfer windows go a long way to adding to what we percive to be failure on his part.
Maybe now that Carol and the top brass are possibly looking at things from a different perspective as discussed at the meeting, aligned with perhaps new investment and the new managers wishes, DF may find another role within the club, or have a better base to work from when trying to attract players - Carol obviously sets a great deal of store with DF and maybe he's not entirely to blame.
Let's hope that whether or not DF is involved in recruitment going forward to next season, its for League One players we are chasing.
UTV

I'm sure aswell that there has been a certain amount of 'waiting' to return to form after the 7 games earlier this season. Hoping it will come good again as it's pretty much the same group of lads

[Bimbleabout]

I dont have much to add that Bede and Mellor haven't already said however I would like to say something about my own experience of Monday and the few days since.
I am as guilty as anybody of bashing out my opinion on the Internet without any regard for the people I am talking about.  Many people give the impression that they would love to have the opportunity to "put the owners right" on a few things.
It was not pleasant seeing first hand just how much the situation is affecting Carol.  I think we all forget sometimes that the people we lambast are just that, people.  We often think its OK to scream all sorts of things into the Internet but it really isn't.  
I have had a very strange week, where I have seen people take a statement and add their own conotations to it and talk about them like they are fact.  I have seen the absolute worst of people on all SM platforms, screaming all sorts of made up theories into the ether. 
I understand the clamour for detail and there was alot of debate behind the scenes over what, if anything we should say further.  We have been under alot of pressure to get this right.
One part of the official joint statement that seemed to attract alot of critism was the part about urging fans to put aside frustration to help give the players and management a boost.  I will hold my hands up and say that I wrote that part and not the club.  It was never meant to insinuate that fans hadn't been supportive and was only intended as it was written.  It was simply asking people to but it on the back burner to deal with later whilst we try to slavage league one status.  I felt that there was pertinence in acknowledging we are in a relegation battle and also in acknowledging there is fan frustration.  I got that wrong, so please don't bash the club for my misjudgement.
Some of the critism we faced was too much.
As I have said, I have been massively guilty of this myself and after this week, I must be better in future because I now know first hand that things we say on the Internet do effect people personally.
Meeting Carol under these circumstances has reassured me that the whole family are absolutely the right people to look after the best interests of the club.  I have not changed my mind about David Flitcroft, I am still of the opinion that he cannot come back from this.
I wanted to just calrify and apologise for my part in the statement and also to appeal to people to think a bit more before they sit at a keyboard.
I can't see how we stay up but one thing I will say from Monday is that Carol and Paddy have an absolute belief in Darren Moore, so until the fat lady sings, I'll be crossing my fingers that we are still a league one side next season.
I would say, let's get behind them on Saturday and see if we can't get 3 points to put us back in the race...  but perhaps not.
 

Nice one Tony UTV

[STUNG]

3 hours ago, Sandyford_Lion said:

Tony. What a post.

Together with this , Bede, Mellor and co. its time we all accepted the meaning of the meeting.

No one can honestly expect a sacking the following morning but that is exactly what people expect to see. Hopefully follow ups to continue and this is what should happen at the Vale. Then we can see if there is any benefits to both the club and fans, on and off the pitch.

All us fans wanted was to be kept informed and not keep hearing bits sneaking out from people who were also not present at the meeting.

Anyway.

Now that i have read your post and your humble reply to what you say was your initial thoughts and what your comments would have been had you been sat on the keyboard, I cannot wait for your post re : your comments to referees and officials over the last fifty years !!!

We sometimes forget that referees are people, hard to believe i know, but people they are, as you know from your stint in the middle. Found this quite amusing to be honest aswell as a terrific post from a true Vale fan.

Are they really though ?? I'm sceptical 

[Sandyford_Lion]

2 minutes ago, STUNG said:

Are they really though ?? I'm sceptical 

Get yourself in the middle and have a go

[Paul6754]

11 hours ago, Bede said:

In all seriousness, it is our complete aim to resolve things amicably.  If that doesn't happen, then it's down to the will of the people.  It's not for me, or any of us, to spoon-feed you what to think.  As in the past, we will harness whatever the fans' feelings are and act accordingly.  How that looks right now we simply cannot say.

Any Vale fan wants a situation like this to be resolved amicably.

I can think for myself and certainly don't want anyone to spoon feed me anything.

just think through "The will of the people" and what the consequences could be for PVFC if the main demand, Flitcroft's removal,  isn't met in an acceptable timeframe.

The Shanahan family have shown they are open to questioning and will listen to fans but at the end of the day the buck stops with them and whether they continue as owners of PVFC or not.

PVFC have the most professional owners for many, many years, lets not jeopardize it as fans.

 

 

 

 

 

[JohnJames]

I have just read Tony’s post about the meeting and that he apologised for what was in the statement.

I’ve represented my Union in National Negotiations from pay to shift patterns and the reaction to the statement reminds me of the ones put out at work. We regularly fell out with our CEO who called us a bunch of Fuckers from time to time. The statements obvs didn’t reflect that and were quite bland. Then we had then to put up with the moans of our members 

This reminds me of that. 

I have utmost respect for the people who went in. You can’t scream and shout and get your own way like certain people on SM and P&G think. It’s a very difficult job. So regardless of how the team plays until the rest of the season FWIW they have my thanks.

Last note. What Tony said about slagging people off also importantly applies to the PLAYERS . They aren’t going to play their best if NobbY Nobrains  is screaming that insert name here is useless and a <ovf censored>. 

Edited March 9 by JohnJames

[PVFC764]

Well 2 down and all they will do is keep giving the ball away and making silly errors.

Fans will be turning now and it will only get worse.  

Carol - I know you feel fraudcroft is the best thing since a flat white coffee, but you need to get rid of him.  Its too late to save Vale's Div 1 league position now, but if he is still here next season, we are looking at relegation again and fans will not be buying season tickets in the numbers you hope for.

[JS Valiant]

54 minutes ago, PVFC764 said:

Well 2 down and all they will do is keep giving the ball away and making silly errors.

Fans will be turning now and it will only get worse.  

Carol - I know you feel fraudcroft is the best thing since a flat white coffee, but you need to get rid of him.  Its too late to save Vale's Div 1 league position now, but if he is still here next season, we are looking at relegation again and fans will not be buying season tickets in the numbers you hope for.

Yeh Shanahan and Fans that Stupid Meeting has made a Great Deal of Difference.

She thinks she’s Bigger than the Club, well we might well be about to see !

[Wrex]

1 minute ago, JS Valiant said:

Yeh Shanahan and Fans that Stupid Meeting has made a Great Deal of Difference.

The players that have been recruited are not good enough for League One.

I'm not sure why anyone would have expected a meeting between the owners and the fans would change that fact.

[valeparklife]

On 07/03/2024 at 17:02, JoeB2 said:

I think the only explanation for this loyalty to DF is that PVFC received consultancy from MRKT Insights at some point last year.

These are the same consultancy firm who were quite involved with Argyle’s recent success - a club Carol openly stated we were looking to emulate.

One of MRKT’s main guys is very vocal about not abandoning plans when things go poorly in the short-term, and not caving to fan pressure. I’m not saying ai agree with him (I definitely don’t), but that’s the party line.

It is a fairly arrogant line which assumes all fans are morons, but they’ve been successful in another specific environment, so surely it applies everywhere! 

I imagine Carol intends to ride the DF criticism out, fully committed to the fairly nonsensical long-term plan they’ve got.

We’re eventually going to have to accept this, for all the weeping and wailing we might do. Its her club, as as much as lads want to walk into a boardroom, down a pint, and make her sack someone, it isn’t going to happen. 

Re the line about "assuming all fans are morons" - I think there has been a lot of that recently.

Earlier on in the season when our sole tactic was passing it back to Ripley every time we get the ball - we had Ojo/DF and Crosby talk about "educating the fans" on why this is the best way to play and that anyone that disagreed was a pleb.

Then we had Carol's pathetic letter telling us all what an amazing job DF is doing (without mentioning what was happening on the pitch).

Even going back to last season when Carol said we'd "had a good January window" - we all knew we didn't.

Maybe, just maybe, the fans have a point here and actually know more than the "professionals" running the club?

[Wrex]

1 hour ago, valeparklife said:

Earlier on in the season when our sole tactic was passing it back to Ripley every time we get the ball - we had Ojo/DF and Crosby talk about "educating the fans" on why this is the best way to play and that anyone that disagreed was a pleb.

I don't recall that ever being said.

[Brian Johnson]

9 minutes ago, Wrex said:

I don't recall that ever being said.

I can not remember his exact words but he did say something along those lines

[Wrex]

3 minutes ago, Brian Johnson said:

I can not remember his exact words but he did say something along those lines

Flitcroft? I have a vague memory of him saying something along those lines but I don't remember Ojo or Crosby saying anything like it

[eh up nah]

Think I remember AC saying something completely bonkers as well about how the fans need to be patient and grow to understand the way we play.

Something like yeah, we know we're not scoring at the minute but we're deliberately not making the obvious pass or taking the obvious shot.

Something along those lines.

Could be wrong.