Brexit again...

[Regal Beagle]

On 05/10/2019 at 00:03, Nofinikea said:

Have done as you suggested and there is no reference to Jake Berry or what he said, so unless you can provide a link to prove hansard provides the details of what he said and the context you have called out a "liar" by using a lie.

I have not lied. 

But I am also not going to go out of my way posting sources for someone who flat out refused to do it when asked last week. 

Especially someone who constantly lies about me on here and then amazingly tries to call me a liar.

[geosname]

On 05/10/2019 at 12:34, Aussie Rules said:

Listening to our early edition of the BBC News an OxBridge civil servant was giving a 'definitive hard border response' plus the effects it will have on 'Chunnel activities.

Sir Humphry Appleby would have been very proud.

Sadly, I remain non the wiser re. the Border issue.

 

The boarder issue is fairly simple Barry.

As both parties are in the same group the only boarder is a line on the map, people and goods can travel freely.

If the two parties agree a trade deal that could remain the same...... however.... the EU will not negotiate a trade deal until the divorce agreement is settled.... so until that is agreed we simply don't know...... that's the simple bit.

Now it starts to get complicated..... the EU don't want a hard boarder, the UK does not want a hard boarder, the Irish on either side of the line don't want a hard boarder. The EU  and the UK both have a responsibility to protect its boarders 're smuggling and people etc but the EU sèem to be implying it's the Uks responsibility to create a solution to the EU's responsibility as well as it's own..... and pay for that privilage whilst trade negotiations are taking place.... also it seems the EU wants to keep the payments and other things under it's control indefinitely..... which could create a different boarder between NI and the UK but keep the boarder open between North and South.... and North and the EU but create a boarder between NI and the UK and between UK and EU. ... which will cause problems for people and goods traveling to and from the UK and NI.

I don't know if the same problems will exist between mainland UK and the EU at seaports or for rail travel between the two.

Add in the GF agreement and the probability that a % of parliament and the EU have no idea where NI is and it becomes cloudy to say the least.

Clear as mud mate.

[Jacko51]

With regard to the amount of lies being told in the Brexit debate, how about this info which has been doing the rounds on Facebook and Twitter for months? It even emerged in the letters page of the Sentinel this week. 

https://m.facebook.com/LBC/posts/10156995473506558

 

[Aussie Rules]

40 minutes ago, Jacko51 said:

With regard to the amount of lies being told in the Brexit debate, how about this info which has been doing the rounds on Facebook and Twitter for months? It even emerged in the letters page of the Sentinel this week. 

https://m.facebook.com/LBC/posts/10156995473506558

 

I'm assuming Jean, that if the UK MEPs were fully apprised of the Lisbon Treaty and its intended impact they would have been banging the alert drums across the land (providing, of course, it's not a fake treaty 😉).  

[geosname]

The SNP would demand the power to hold another independence referendum in return for supporting a minority Labour government, the party's Westminister leader has suggested.

well that's a surprise eh...... national crisis my ass

[For Us All]

5 hours ago, Jacko51 said:

With regard to the amount of lies being told in the Brexit debate, how about this info which has been doing the rounds on Facebook and Twitter for months? It even emerged in the letters page of the Sentinel this week. 

https://m.facebook.com/LBC/posts/10156995473506558

 

Anybody who believes that deserves to get a bigger laugh than Sarah Jones did on Question Time the other night.🤣

[Jacko51]

1 hour ago, For Us All said:

Anybody who believes that deserves to get a bigger laugh than Sarah Jones did on Question Time the other night.🤣

Well Esther McVey retweeted it. And it’s pretty clear a lot of people believed it judging by the amount of time it’s been shared on social media. 

[geosname]

Social Media... the great arbiter in the sky.

[Regal Beagle]

On 06/10/2019 at 09:13, Nofinikea said:

You dont need to post the source I have looked.  It doesnt say anything about it.

Sound, you know I'm right about the context part at least, as per hansard then.

 

No need to reply if you've read it. It's there.

[Regal Beagle]

23 hours ago, Jacko51 said:

Well Esther McVey retweeted it. And it’s pretty clear a lot of people believed it judging by the amount of time it’s been shared on social media. 

A lot of people believe that female and BAME MPs receive more abuse than male/white counterparts. Including, I think I'm right in saying, yourself?

 

There's lots of lies going round on social media, on both sides.

[Davebrad]

On ‎06‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 10:35, geosname said:

The boarder issue is fairly simple Barry.

As both parties are in the same group the only boarder is a line on the map, people and goods can travel freely.

If the two parties agree a trade deal that could remain the same...... however.... the EU will not negotiate a trade deal until the divorce agreement is settled.... so until that is agreed we simply don't know...... that's the simple bit.

Now it starts to get complicated..... the EU don't want a hard boarder, the UK does not want a hard boarder, the Irish on either side of the line don't want a hard boarder. The EU  and the UK both have a responsibility to protect its boarders 're smuggling and people etc but the EU sèem to be implying it's the Uks responsibility to create a solution to the EU's responsibility as well as it's own..... and pay for that privilage whilst trade negotiations are taking place.... also it seems the EU wants to keep the payments and other things under it's control indefinitely..... which could create a different boarder between NI and the UK but keep the boarder open between North and South.... and North and the EU but create a boarder between NI and the UK and between UK and EU. ... which will cause problems for people and goods traveling to and from the UK and NI.

I don't know if the same problems will exist between mainland UK and the EU at seaports or for rail travel between the two.

Add in the GF agreement and the probability that a % of parliament and the EU have no idea where NI is and it becomes cloudy to say the least.

Clear as mud mate.

totally agree, so is it bloody mindedness from the eu? also in a earlier post I asked if we do leave, then Scotland voted for independence, and asks and gets back into the eu, who then sorts out the border issues, if it falls to us we'd better start negotiating now...

[Jacko51]

The whole issue of the Irish border was almost totally ignored during the Referendum campaign.  The government didn't mention it in the document that was sent out to all households.  I can't find a single Leave leaflet that mentions it.  It was not an issue.  It wasn't important.  Yet it turns out it was the crux of the whole issue of leaving.  You cannot, as the Leave campaign claimed, regain control of our borders if there is no control of the only land border between the EU and the UK.  If the Leavers have a solution to this that makes sense, then why have they not mentioned it for three years??? 

[VantaaVale]

53 minutes ago, Jacko51 said:

The whole issue of the Irish border was almost totally ignored during the Referendum campaign.  The government didn't mention it in the document that was sent out to all households.  I can't find a single Leave leaflet that mentions it.  It was not an issue.  It wasn't important.  Yet it turns out it was the crux of the whole issue of leaving.  You cannot, as the Leave campaign claimed, regain control of our borders if there is no control of the only land border between the EU and the UK.  If the Leavers have a solution to this that makes sense, then why have they not mentioned it for three years??? 

PLAN AHEAD

[geosname]

1 hour ago, Jacko51 said:

The whole issue of the Irish border was almost totally ignored during the Referendum campaign.  The government didn't mention it in the document that was sent out to all households.  I can't find a single Leave leaflet that mentions it.  It was not an issue.  It wasn't important.  Yet it turns out it was the crux of the whole issue of leaving.  You cannot, as the Leave campaign claimed, regain control of our borders if there is no control of the only land border between the EU and the UK.  If the Leavers have a solution to this that makes sense, then why have they not mentioned it for three years??? 

Neither side saw it as a problem, neither side mentioned it.

Both sides have spent 3 years arguing about what a yes (leave) no (remain) answer means.

I think the big obstical isn't the boarder but the unending connection the EU want, which was the main reason Mays deal faltered.... at least that's the reason given?

[geosname]

1 hour ago, Davebrad said:

totally agree, so is it bloody mindedness from the eu? also in a earlier post I asked if we do leave, then Scotland voted for independence, and asks and gets back into the eu, who then sorts out the border issues, if it falls to us we'd better start negotiating now...

In part yes.

If Scotland want to split and rejoin the EU it would be up to them to negotiate a deal to join the EU and a divorce deal from the UK. 

From the EU's standpoint they would have to pay to get in the EU and out of the UK..... not sure they could afford it if money from the UK dried up and they had to finance Scotland on their own..... especially as oil is becoming a poisoned tree..... but as hard boarders would not be a problem it could be easier to fix.