Brown as manager

[Paul6754]

Correct. For the record, here's the evidence on Rudgie's and Brown's respective records in their first season:

 

John Rudge P29 W10 D7 L12 Win Ratio 34.5%

 

Michael Brown P24 W5 D7 L12 Win Ratio 20.8%

 

Brown's record is the THIRD WORST in the club's history since records began in 1896. Even allowing for the poor start he was given, I don't think there's any evidence to believe that Brown is the answer. Brown simply had to keep us away from the relegation zone, which was the position he inherited.

 

Nor is there any evidence that Brown should be appointed on the basis that Rudge also couldn't prevent us from being relegated. Rudge had a far worse start as the Vale took only 6 points from their first 17 games, having lost 13 of them. If he'd been in charge from the start of that season, his record suggests he would have kept us up.

 

We can't take any more chances with the future management of the club or we are going to find ourselves in another relegation battle next season.

 

For the second season running we need a fresh start - new owner, new manager and new squad (with a few notable exceptions).

 

But CD, did John Rudge or any manager in Vale's history pick up such an appalling squad, have to contend with losing 3 of the better players (43% of the spine of the team including the goalkeeper and leading goalscorer, arguably the two most important players in the team in the Jan transfer window) and receive insufficient financial support from the chairman at such a crucial time in the season to enable his targets to be signed. I think not.

[MarkCh]

He didn't have to take the job.

[Howjy04]

Talking of snot, I am surprised we haven't heard from Martino today.

 

5hit fan on a windup,dap.

[CambridgeDon]

But CD, did John Rudge or any manager in Vale's history pick up such an appalling squad, have to contend with losing 3 of the better players (43% of the spine of the team including the goalkeeper and leading goalscorer, arguably the two most important players in the team in the Jan transfer window) and receive insufficient financial support from the chairman at such a crucial time in the season to enable his targets to be signed. I think not.

 

 

As a matter of fact, it was just as bad. When Rudge took over, the Sentinel described the Vale as "the poorest side in the third division by a long chalk". At the start of the season:

 

* Several players refused to sign new contracts and were put on weekly contracts, causing real unrest in the camp

* Two players walked out (Siddall and Bromage)

* Bob Newton, the top scorer (22 goals in 48 games), was transferred to Chester

* At the end of October, Vale had to use their 41 year old coach Alan Oakes in the 1-0 defeat to Plymouth

* The chairman blocked the signing of a new defender (sound familiar?)

* The manager was gagged from speaking to the press on anything there than team matters

* There were demonstrations by supporters

* One player, Steve Fox, was suspended for refusing to play in defence.

 

Even after Rudge took over:

 

* His first game finished with 9 men

* Towards the end of the season there was an injury crisis resulting in one win in nine games

* Another forward, Jim Steel, was transferred to Wrexham

 

So plenty of similarities with this season with one big difference, Rudge was in charge - and came out winning over 34% of his games, compared to Brown's paltry 20.5%. Hence, Rudge was kept on the following season.

 

Let's hope Brown is not - there is simply no evidence that he would prove to be a success even in League 2.

[Paul6754]

As a matter of fact, it was just as bad. When Rudge took over, the Sentinel described the Vale as "the poorest side in the third division by a long chalk". At the start of the season:

 

* Several players refused to sign new contracts and were put on weekly contracts, causing real unrest in the camp

* Two players walked out (Siddall and Bromage)

* Bob Newton, the top scorer (22 goals in 48 games), was transferred to Chester

* At the end of October, Vale had to use their 41 year old coach Alan Oakes in the 1-0 defeat to Plymouth

* The chairman blocked the signing of a new defender (sound familiar?)

* The manager was gagged from speaking to the press on anything there than team matters

* There were demonstrations by supporters

* One player, Steve Fox, was suspended for refusing to play in defence.

 

Even after Rudge took over:

 

* His first game finished with 9 men

* Towards the end of the season there was an injury crisis resulting in one win in nine games

* Another forward, Jim Steel, was transferred to Wrexham

 

So plenty of similarities with this season with one big difference, Rudge was in charge - and came out winning over 34% of his games, compared to Brown's paltry 20.5%. Hence, Rudge was kept on the following season.

 

Let's hope Brown is not - there is simply no evidence that he would prove to be a success even in League 2.

 

Similarities but not quite as bad as the situation MB found himself in IMHO. Rudge still had Eamon O'Keefe who scored a few goals that season together wuth a young Mark Bright who also scored a few hence more games were won. Big difference was when Alex Jones left MB was left with nothing up front especially after Walker got injured. A young Robbie Earle played a few games for Vale that season to.

[valiant_593]

I do think that most of the people on here are being very, very unfair to Michael Brown.

 

Lets make no bones about it we were sliding down to relegation long before Brown took over. The team that he inherited was garbage and he got no help in the January window in fact we lost three of our most influential players with not a dime being handed to him to strengthen the squad. I am reliably informed that one player on hearing that it was Port Vale who wanted to sign him blew a 'raspberry' down the phone and hung up. This is because our reputation is of us being a bad club at this moment in time. I'll let you guess who that is all down too.

 

Yes I agree the idea of playing with one forward was poor but in truth did we have any forwards that were worth playing?

 

I'm far happier to give Michael a chance than the owner who has made us pretty much of a laughing stock with his lies, bad decisions and crazy get rich quick antics of trying to bring in foreign starlets for us to buff up and sell on for massive profits for our owner to pocket.

 

I completely disagree re brown. I think people are being fat too generous to him. Yes he joined the club in bad form and some bad results. But that dosent mean it should continue. He's had plenty of time to change it and hasn't; some of his signings have been dreadful, bikey and eagles apart. I don't understand why people would want him next year.

Some of the performances have been ******* atrocious and worse than under Bruno! Baring in mind we lost to sides like chesterfield, Coventry etc and stuggled against other ***** sides.

His tactics have been beyond negative as the results and 1 goal in 7 proves, Bruno was constantly slated for one up top and brown has done exactly the same but seems to get away with it.

Picks players out of position and keeps the same ***** players on who should've been dropped weeks ago. Examples being purkiss,Taylor and hooper. The latter two both consistently played out of position and consistently dreadful yet continued to get match time ahead of others.

Subs, again highly negative, like for like changes. Never did one sub that made me think we're trying something different just the same old crap. Just because our forwards are crap dosent mean we should only pick 1. We should've tried 352 our side fits it and would get 3 of our best players, smith bikey and streete all on the pitch and make it able to leave out ***** like Taylor or purkiss.

Of course I agree re signings and smurf being the major culprit for everything but brown is also to blame.

 

Bruno was ****, but brown has been much much worse in every department and that's saying something.

 

we need a massive clearout, that includes brown and obviously our **** of a chairman.

 

Honestly I'd like to see Adams back, knows how to get a side promoted and we scored goals. I've not seen anything from brown that makes me think we will do well next season or do anything remotely entertaining

[Another shropshire valiant]

I listerned to his interview after today's game, he is clearly hurting and spoke of his desire to build a squad "in his own image" and he knows who he wants to keep and more importantly who he doesn't want in his team.... but in the same vane, we also need a period of stability... I say give Browny a go...

[CAVALIER]

There's an issue here. Whatever anyone says. Whoever we recruit is currently out of work . Ask why? Perhaps advertise and see who applies.. I don't think anyone realised what our reputation is like under Smurf. We don't even have the local Rag in the ground.

[Fosse69]

We could always compromise and give him until Xmas.

[mr.hobblesworth]

Then we get the same situation whereby an incoming manager has to deal with the previous manager's dross.

 

In another post, someone mentioned (in a positive way) that Brown's side had "huffed and puffed" itself almost to safety. That's the sense I get from Brown and his sides - huff and puff. Christ, if people were bored by Page they've got a shock coming.

 

Do people really believe that we can't get better than Brown?

[CambridgeDon]

Similarities but not quite as bad as the situation MB found himself in IMHO. Rudge still had Eamon O'Keefe who scored a few goals that season together wuth a young Mark Bright who also scored a few hence more games were won. Big difference was when Alex Jones left MB was left with nothing up front especially after Walker got injured. A young Robbie Earle played a few games for Vale that season to.

 

No Paul, not the same, but close enough to say that Rudge made the most of his poor hand but Brown has not.

 

How many fans on this site would trust Norman's judgement? Few, if any, I would suspect. So would we trust Norman again if he kept to Brown? For Norman, it would be the cheap option again. Nothing would change: the same interference, the same insufficient level of resources, the same dire reputation, the same lack of incentives for the kind of players we need, the same loading of debt on the club and the same negative outcomes. What's going to change any of this? A road to Damascus conversion by Norman? A bolt from the blue?

 

The only way out of the spiral of decline we're looking at is a change of ownership, change of manager, and change of squad.

 

It's only my opinion and yours of course is as valid as mine. But even at this early stage I'd say that if Brown stays, we're in for another season of negativity, anxiety and despair. If that's Norman's solution for next season, I'm going to spend a lot of my time watching the results through my fingers.

[Guest TommyMac]

 

Do people really believe that we can't get better than Brown?

 

If we can't then we might as well kick the cat out and padlock the gates.

[Fosse69]

Then we get the same situation whereby an incoming manager has to deal with the previous manager's dross.

 

In another post, someone mentioned (in a positive way) that Brown's side had "huffed and puffed" itself almost to safety. That's the sense I get from Brown and his sides - huff and puff. Christ, if people were bored by Page they've got a shock coming.

 

Do people really believe that we can't get better than Brown?

Will depend on pay and conditions, who is the owner - contract - player budget - control of player selection etc.

[Yukon]

It's really easy, if you want Brown to stay you are stupid. Not just a bit daft but idiotic on a cellular level. If you want Brown to stay then form a queue because I'm selling pound coins for £1500 & you're happy with that because you're a certified fool

 

 

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[gags 64]

I get that Brown was left with an unfit team, no money for decent players and the spine of the team ripped out but did he put his own stamp on the style of play or seemingly change anything? Not from where I was watching.

 

1 up front, forwards on the wing, ignoring some of our more technically gifted players because they weren't British. Not convinced I'm afraid.

 

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