May on the way??

[For Us All]

19 hours ago, Heatwave said:

It would destroy the post Thatcher consensus that prioritises private sector over public. Too many vested interests. 

Red Ed wants to abolish private schools,does the rest of the Labour Party know?

[Fosse69]

10 minutes ago, For Us All said:

Red Ed wants to abolish private schools,does the rest of the Labour Party know?

Public schools first., starting with the most expensive.

[For Us All]

21 minutes ago, Fosse69 said:

Public schools first., starting with the most expensive.

 

21 minutes ago, Fosse69 said:

Public schools first., starting with the most expensive.

A race to the bottom then?

[Regal Beagle]

8 hours ago, mr.hobblesworth said:

Lammy's said that this is nonsense and that all letters have been sent to the police. He's already seen one sender of death threats imprisoned (although hardly anyone is racist any more) and it must be pretty galling to not only be repeatedly on the receiving end of despicable <ovf censored> like that but also to be accused of lying and writing them yourself.

I must admit my first thought when I read the note was that it looked completely fake, how it's hit almost every racist note and the Anne Widdecombe reference is crowbarred in. It looks like it was planned out to the point that I don't think a person who seriously holds those views could manage. It smacks of Jussie Smollett who engineered his "attack" to just be too perfect. A homophobic/racist attack and coincidentally the attackers (Who were supposedly carrying a noose with them) also shout pro-Trump slogans whilst they do it? It's just not believable to me.

I'm not saying I think it is Lammy himself, I just don't think the note is from a genuine person although fair play if I'm proven wrong.

These fake hate crimes are an absolutely huge problem in America and I've been wondering for some time how long it would take for the trend to begin over here.

 

On 16/07/2019 at 10:21, mr.hobblesworth said:

Do you not think that much of the smears and furore aimed at Corbyn is down to the establishment and vested interests wanting to prevent him from implementing his policies that will bring about real positive change for people in this country? The muddying of the water every time Labour look like making any headway is, IMO, no accident. 

Yeah just imagine if Corbyn has an argument with his wife, god forbid.

Will his policies bring about real positive change or will we be eating rats and slowing starving to death like in other socialist countries?

Just out of interest, and this is a serious point, what policies in particular and do you think he can bring about this change whilst the UK is inside of the EU? All of our laws have to be compatible with their's as we know.

[mr.hobblesworth]

If Corbyn had an argument with his wife to the extent that neighbours could hear her screaming 'get off me' through the walls, I would expect him to resign as leader as the party, or at least offer a full and frank admission of what was going on.

I think I know what you're getting at but it's my understanding that Labour could bring the railways, water etc back in to public ownership even if we remained in the EU.

I thought the recent policy announcement regarding fitting solar panels to 1.75 million homes was great

Banning zero hours contracts and helping to end in-employment poverty. 

Ring fencing mental health 

Increase tax on higher earners

Increase corporation tax

They're just off the top of my head.

 

 

 

[Regal Beagle]

1 hour ago, mr.hobblesworth said:

If Corbyn had an argument with his wife to the extent that neighbours could hear her screaming 'get off me' through the walls, I would expect him to resign as leader as the party, or at least offer a full and frank admission of what was going on.

I think I know what you're getting at but it's my understanding that Labour could bring the railways, water etc back in to public ownership even if we remained in the EU.

I thought the recent policy announcement regarding fitting solar panels to 1.75 million homes was great 

Banning zero hours contracts and helping to end in-employment poverty. 

Ring fencing mental health 

Increase tax on higher earners

Increase corporation tax

They're just off the top of my head.

 

 

 

What if the neighbours heard him call his wife a stupid woman through the walls?

 

Fair play, can't agree that some of those policies will ultimately help people but that is the front line of where we disagree I suppose.

[geosname]

5 hours ago, mr.hobblesworth said:

If Corbyn had an argument with his wife to the extent that neighbours could hear her screaming 'get off me' through the walls, I would expect him to resign as leader as the party, or at least offer a full and frank admission of what was going on.

I think I know what you're getting at but it's my understanding that Labour could bring the railways, water etc back in to public ownership even if we remained in the EU.

I thought the recent policy announcement regarding fitting solar panels to 1.75 million homes was great

Banning zero hours contracts and helping to end in-employment poverty. 

Ring fencing mental health 

Increase tax on higher earners

Increase corporation tax

They're just off the top of my head.

 

 

 

In my opinion....

Calling the police is fine... calling the newspapers is questionable... don't think he should have to "fully explain" what the row was about to anyone... wouldn't expect him to resign unless everyone who ever had a row followed suite.

Utilities etc could probably be renationalised.... at what cost? What benefit? Where would the money come from?

Instead of solar panels why not build 1.75 million homes,affordable and social, with solar panels.

Banning zero hours...?. Yes

Ring fence mental health....... what does that really mean?

Overhaul the tax system... hit the avoiders and evaders..

Sometimes when you increase a tax you get less in..... the last time corporation tax was cut the tax take increased. 

[Paul6754]

16 hours ago, mr.hobblesworth said:

Lammy's said that this is nonsense and that all letters have been sent to the police. He's already seen one sender of death threats imprisoned (although hardly anyone is racist any more) and it must be pretty galling to not only be repeatedly on the receiving end of despicable <ovf censored> like that but also to be accused of lying and writing them yourself.

In these days of being able to photo shop virtually any photograph, who knows what's real and what's not in the absence of the original. However, given Lammy is an MP (A Rt. Hon.) who likes to keep racism at the top of the agenda I would expect the Police to thoroughly investigate these allegations and take appropriate action if found true. The wring in the letters does show some striking similarities to that purported to be from Lammy's own hand.

[TheSage]

Cutting tax rates does not necessarily increase revenue. It's a very complex process with lots of variables and you can't make overarching statements about if you do X then Y automatically occurs. Economics isn't like that. 

Johnson's Laffer curve theory is rubbish but as with so many other myths and lies on Brexit and the economy folk appear to think if you repeat these catch phrases over and over again they eventually become accepted wisdom.

When corporation tax was cut (around 2008 I think it was) the amount went down for 2 years. It's gone up since as the economy as gradually improved but X didn't mean Y happened as a matter of course.

And if taxes are cut for those who least need the extra money, governments have to claw it back from other areas.

Government politicians, the Establishment, most of the press, wealthy folk everywhere, will all claim cutting taxes for them is a great idea but Mandy Rice Davies was more honest than all of them!

[geosname]

6 minutes ago, TheSage said:

Cutting tax rates does not necessarily increase revenue. It's a very complex process with lots of variables and you can't make overarching statements about if you do X then Y automatically occurs. Economics isn't like that. 

Johnson's Laffer curve theory is rubbish but as with so many other myths and lies on Brexit and the economy folk appear to think if you repeat these catch phrases over and over again they eventually become accepted wisdom.

When corporation tax was cut (around 2008 I think it was) the amount went down for 2 years. It's gone up since as the economy as gradually improved but X didn't mean Y happened as a matter of course.

And if taxes are cut for those who least need the extra money, governments have to claw it back from other areas.

Government politicians, the Establishment, most of the press, wealthy folk everywhere, will all claim cutting taxes for them is a great idea but Mandy Rice Davies was more honest than all of them!

I'm not advocating tax cuts or increases..... Chase the avoiders and evaiders.... big and small... overhaul the system not just patch it with political crap..... it won't be done because it isn't popular and won't get votes.

How about increasing the tax on booze to the level of cigarettes...... it does more damage and costs more to public service...... how about an extra tax on more than one vehicle at an address and more than one vehicle owned...... how about taking away qualified immunity for service workers so they have to pay for their screw ups not the public purse.... I could go on and on..... but none would be vote catchers.

Appeal to the poorer voters by taxing the richer...... or appealing to the richer by cutting tax.... now that wins elections...... and that's what it's all about..... that's playing the political game

[Fosse69]

46 minutes ago, geosname said:

 I'm not advocating tax cuts or increases..... Chase the avoiders and evaiders.... big and small... overhaul the system not just patch it with political crap..... it won't be done because it isn't popular and won't get votes.

How about increasing the tax on booze to the level of cigarettes...... it does more damage and costs more to public service...... how about an extra tax on more than one vehicle at an address and more than one vehicle owned...... how about taking away qualified immunity for service workers so they have to pay for their screw ups not the public purse.... I could go on and on..... but none would be vote catchers.

Appeal to the poorer voters by taxing the richer...... or appealing to the richer by cutting tax.... now that wins elections...... and that's what it's all about..... that's playing the political game

Tax system far  too complex, it is is continually being tweaked to avoid anomalies or suit lobby power, which creates more anomalies. Side effects being  we have a tax change industry providing a good living for some. Changing the system will be a colossal task, needing the sort of impetus that in the past has  only come after a major war.

[cheshirevaliant]

I watched the final hustings last night between Johnson and Hunt. Whilst I agreed with some of what they both said, and disagreed with more, it always staggers me the times when politicians answer questions by saying "I know this isn't working, but if I was in charge, it would definitely work". What have you been doing for the past 9 years that you have been in power? 

The last Labour government were as guilty of this as the current Conservatives by the way. I think it is time for a change of government but I don't see who would do a better job. I agree with a fair bit of what Corbyn says, but he is not a statesman in my eyes. His career has been built on heckling from the sidelines, Statler and Waldorf style and I'm not sure he has the gumption to convince "Middle England" to believe in him even if they believe in his policies, in the way that Blair and Cameron did. 

[Regal Beagle]

12 hours ago, TheSage said:

Cutting tax rates does not necessarily increase revenue. It's a very complex process with lots of variables and you can't make overarching statements about if you do X then Y automatically occurs. Economics isn't like that. 

Johnson's Laffer curve theory is rubbish but as with so many other myths and lies on Brexit and the economy folk appear to think if you repeat these catch phrases over and over again they eventually become accepted wisdom.

When corporation tax was cut (around 2008 I think it was) the amount went down for 2 years. It's gone up since as the economy as gradually improved but X didn't mean Y happened as a matter of course.

Why did the economy improve then? I'd suggest it had a lot to do with the stimulation caused by decreasing corporation tax.

It's anecdotal but I've seen many instances of the wealthy simply keeping money in their companies when labour are in power and tax rates are high. It's not doing anyone any good sat there for years. I could quite clearly see a relationship between lower tax rates and money being taken out, meaning that it was then in the economy and was being spent and transferred to other people.

 

[mr.hobblesworth]

Off topic, but what did you think of Donald Trump's 'go home' speech and the subsequent 'send her back' chants?

[geosname]

13 minutes ago, mr.hobblesworth said:

Off topic, but what did you think of Donald Trump's 'go home' speech and the subsequent 'send her back' chants?

What was said/happened previously to attract the comments?