Brexit again...

[Paul6754]

I proved beyond doubt to you previously that the remain side told many lies during the campaign.

 

If you seriously believe that one side told more lies than the other, then you are deluded or dishonest. Even more so when you claim that this is somehow reason to ignore a democratic vote.

 

The remain side even actively threatened us with a punishment budget. Surely that is a bigger concern to you than what is written on a bus when it comes to democratic processes?

 

Or, it's fine because its your side that did it and so it was justified?

 

Regal, a prediction that doesn't come true is not a lie, the weather predictions made by the Met Office that don't come true are not lies.

 

A threat is not a lie.

 

350m to the NHS was a lie a damned big lie.

[Regal Beagle]

How is a decision democratic if it is, as you claim, based on huge dishonesty on both sides??

 

It wasn't based on huge dishonesty.

 

For instance, I am confident that brexit voters are supremely intelligent and reasonable enough to see through the lies and make their own mind up.

 

But seriously, I don't understand why you think democracy and honesty are dependent on each other. Democracy is a system of Government whereby the people chose who represent them. Honesty isn't a prerequisite of democracy although obviously honesty should be an important trait for a successful politician.

[Regal Beagle]

Regal, a prediction that doesn't come true is not a lie, the weather predictions made by the Met Office that don't come true are not lies.

 

A threat is not a lie.

 

350m to the NHS was a lie a damned big lie.

 

If the prediction is based on fabricated and false information and designed to get people to vote a certain way, then it is dishonest and a lie.

 

I know a threat is not a lie.

 

I also know that abuse of government power is low down on remainer priorities but how can you get on your high horse about a lie but be completely fine with the Government threatening the people with an increase in taxes as punishment for not voting with them?

 

It's an interesting moral contradiction you have there. Like I say, I think you'd be a lot more concerned about a tyrannical threat by the Government if it didn't favour your preferred outcome.

[Paul6754]

It wasn't based on huge dishonesty.

 

Regal, I realize you could well be on a wind up but the two major referendum campaign promises were lies, 350m to the HHS was a lie and the immigration promise was a lie.

 

For instance, I am confident that brexit voters are supremely intelligent and reasonable enough to see through the lies and make their own mind up.

 

I've no doubt they are intelligent but many, especially the older generation, bought the Farage/Johnson rhetoric hook line and sinker. Farage himself freely admits he had no idea what Brexit entailed instead preferring to dismiss it with words like "Easy, a cinch".

 

But seriously, I don't understand why you think democracy and honesty are dependent on each other. Democracy is a system of Government whereby the people chose who represent them. Honesty isn't a prerequisite of democracy although obviously honesty should be an important trait for a successful politician.

 

Honesty is a prerequisite of democracy and the widest and most truthful information should be given to the electorate else who knows what people are voting for, I'm surprise anyone would make such a comment. If you state "honesty should be an important trait for a successful politician" then honesty is central to a successful democracy.

 

The UK's process of democracy is what separated us from the lawless, currupt and failing countries around the world. The UK is a bastion of democracy, the world looks up to the UK in its upholding of democracy, the EU referendum was not a good example of democracy, an electorate swayed and misled by lies.

[Regal Beagle]

Regal, I realize you could well be on a wind up but the two major referendum campaign promises were lies, 350m to the HHS was a lie and the immigration promise was a lie.

 

 

 

I've no doubt they are intelligent but many, especially the older generation, bought the Farage/Johnson rhetoric hook line and sinker. Farage himself freely admits he had no idea what Brexit entailed instead preferring to dismiss it with words like "Easy, a cinch".

 

 

 

Honesty is a prerequisite of democracy and the widest and most truthful information should be given to the electorate else who knows what people are voting for, I'm surprise anyone would make such a comment. If you state "honesty should be an important trait for a successful politician" then honesty is central to a successful democracy.

 

The UK's process of democracy is what separated us from the lawless, currupt and failing countries around the world. The UK is a bastion of democracy, the world looks up to the UK in its upholding of democracy, the EU referendum was not a good example of democracy, an electorate swayed and misled by lies.

 

The referendum itself is the purest example of a democratic vote ever.

 

The way in which up to 48% of the country reacted to the result is not a good example of democracy however.

 

Go and find a definition of democracy and tell me where it says honest is a part of it?

 

Also, what immigration promise was a lie? The nhs bus argument is so feeble. Give it up.

[Paul6754]

The referendum itself is the purest example of a democratic vote ever.

 

The way in which up to 48% of the country reacted to the result is not a good example of democracy however.[/Quote]

 

A reaction is not an example of democracy, part of the reaction to the result was due to people realizing the result was obtained by lies.

 

Go and find a definition of democracy and tell me where it says honest is a part of it?

 

Honesty is not included in the definition of democracy but is implicit, what's the point of voting if you're being fed lies. In the process of democracy honesty is also implicit, required and assumed, just Google democracy and honesty.

 

Also, what immigration promise was a lie? The nhs bus argument is so feeble. Give it up.

 

The 350m for the NHS is not feeble it was a giant lie. The immigration lie was to cut net migration by two thirds to around 100,000 per year, something the UK have been trying to do for years and years and has failed to do so.

 

I surprised you're so accepting and dismissive of the campaign lies told.

 

Take a look at this link from the Financial Times, it should update and inform you.

 

https://www.ft.com/content/3940cd66-3bdc-11e8-b7e0-52972418fec4

[Jacko51]

The referendum itself is the purest example of a democratic vote ever.

 

The way in which up to 48% of the country reacted to the result is not a good example of democracy however.

 

Go and find a definition of democracy and tell me where it says honest is a part of it?

 

Also, what immigration promise was a lie? The nhs bus argument is so feeble. Give it up.

 

How about the 75 Million Turks??

[Jacko51]

I actually laughed out loud when I read this!!

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/brexit-donald-tusk-theresa-may-hell-eu-boris-johnson-jeremy-hunt-the-sun-stalin-a8767871.html

[Fosse69]

The referendum itself is the purest example of a democratic vote ever.

 

The way in which up to 48% of the country reacted to the result is not a good example of democracy however.

 

Go and find a definition of democracy and tell me where it says honest is a part of it?

 

Also, what immigration promise was a lie? The nhs bus argument is so feeble. Give it up.

Not 48% of the country, not 48% of the electorate, just 48% of the voters. In reality 63% of the electorate did not vote to leave, quite a lot of people not convinced of its value.

[geosname]

Not 48% of the country, not 48% of the electorate, just 48% of the voters. In reality 63% of the electorate did not vote to leave, quite a lot of people not convinced of its value.

 

Using the same method how many didn't vote to stay?

[geosname]

When it comes to voting... truth goes out the window.... campaigning isn't about telling the truth... it's about winning... gaining control... being in power

[whotobeakiller]

The referendum itself is the purest example of a democratic vote ever.

 

The way in which up to 48% of the country reacted to the result is not a good example of democracy however.

 

Go and find a definition of democracy and tell me where it says honest is a part of it?

 

Also, what immigration promise was a lie? The nhs bus argument is so feeble. Give it up.

 

Regal, I realize you could well be on a wind up but the two major referendum campaign promises were lies, 350m to the HHS was a lie and the immigration promise was a lie.

 

 

 

I've no doubt they are intelligent but many, especially the older generation, bought the Farage/Johnson rhetoric hook line and sinker. Farage himself freely admits he had no idea what Brexit entailed instead preferring to dismiss it with words like "Easy, a cinch".

 

 

 

Honesty is a prerequisite of democracy and the widest and most truthful information should be given to the electorate else who knows what people are voting for, I'm surprise anyone would make such a comment. If you state "honesty should be an important trait for a successful politician" then honesty is central to a successful democracy.

 

The UK's process of democracy is what separated us from the lawless, currupt and failing countries around the world. The UK is a bastion of democracy, the world looks up to the UK in its upholding of democracy, the EU referendum was not a good example of democracy, an electorate swayed and misled by lies.

The 52% whom voted out made their minds up to leave through their own life experiences and justified their decisions within their own minds...the politician waffle hardly came into the equasion

The arrogance of the 48% who presume everyone who voted out were too stupid to have made the decision on their own backs.

 

Pure arrogance

[Regal Beagle]

A reaction is not an example of democracy, part of the reaction to the result was due to people realizing the result was obtained by lies.

 

 

 

Honesty is not included in the definition of democracy but is implicit, what's the point of voting if you're being fed lies. In the process of democracy honesty is also implicit, required and assumed, just Google democracy and honesty.

 

 

 

The 350m for the NHS is not feeble it was a giant lie. The immigration lie was to cut net migration by two thirds to around 100,000 per year, something the UK have been trying to do for years and years and has failed to do so.

 

I surprised you're so accepting and dismissive of the campaign lies told.

 

Take a look at this link from the Financial Times, it should update and inform you.

 

https://www.ft.com/content/3940cd66-3bdc-11e8-b7e0-52972418fec4

 

Honesty is not implicit in democracy, I'm sorry to tell you.

 

Democracy is simply the people choosing who represents them. It has nothing to do with the representatives being honest or being libra or whether or not they like cornflakes.

 

Of course we cannot cut net immigration, we don't control our borders!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Regal Beagle]

How about the 75 Million Turks??

 

Show me one person who honestly believed that the whole of turkey was going to come to the UK?

 

That wasn't a lie. Turkey were applying for EU membership and should they be successful then they would enjoy the same freedom of movement of everyone else.

 

Whether or not it played on peoples prejudices is another story. But it wasn't a lie.

[Jacko51]

Honesty is not implicit in democracy, I'm sorry to tell you.

 

Democracy is simply the people choosing who represents them. It has nothing to do with the representatives being honest or being libra or whether or not they like cornflakes.

 

Of course we cannot cut net immigration, we don't control our borders!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Not true. We should control our borders for non EU immigration but nobody seems to enforce that control. We are not part of Schengen so you can’t just walk into the country.