Brexit again...

[whotobeakiller]

It really is boring reading some of these comments on this page. We voted out decidedly it's called democracy get over it.

 

As for the arguments that the 'majority' to win was slim-we could go on forever unfair FPTP is in our domestic general elections. Stoke on Trent voters combined voted for others parties more than the traditional party who always gets in Labour-shall we have another vote on that?

 

The majority on here who obviously do not consider themselves as 'workers' working class or people who struggle to make ends meet whilst working, will obviously be ignorant to the ramifications that staying in the EU would mean to them.

 

1.Healthcare issues Cannot get to see a GP etc

 

2 High rents and out of reach Mortgages

 

3.Ridiculous uncontrolled immigration meaning Employers can keep wages as low as possible and not have to worry about replacing-leading to bad working conditions

 

4.Cheap products by Multinationals putting smaller business out of business

 

5.Multinationals making huge profits for shareholders within the EU and not paying fair share of tax because EU laws allow them to get away with it and allow them to exploit working class people further with low wages.

 

6.High costs in waste disposal

 

7. High costs in energy prices again protected by the EU money men

 

8.Open borders putting out safety at risk

 

9.No national army and leading to dependency of foreign armies (Very dangerous)

 

10.Poor allocation of EU money leading to many areas to become neglected (Burslem is one which has declined under EU rule)

 

Yeah the EU is really a good idea isn't it?

[tommytunstall]

Think your ten points have much more chance of happening if we leave the EU.

It really is boring reading some of these comments on this page. We voted out decidedly it's called democracy get over it.

 

As for the arguments that the 'majority' to win was slim-we could go on forever unfair FPTP is in our domestic general elections. Stoke on Trent voters combined voted for others parties more than the traditional party who always gets in Labour-shall we have another vote on that?

 

The majority on here who obviously do not consider themselves as 'workers' working class or people who struggle to make ends meet whilst working, will obviously be ignorant to the ramifications that staying in the EU would mean to them.

 

1.Healthcare issues Cannot get to see a GP etc

 

2 High rents and out of reach Mortgages

 

3.Ridiculous uncontrolled immigration meaning Employers can keep wages as low as possible and not have to worry about replacing-leading to bad working conditions

 

4.Cheap products by Multinationals putting smaller business out of business

 

5.Multinationals making huge profits for shareholders within the EU and not paying fair share of tax because EU laws allow them to get away with it and allow them to exploit working class people further with low wages.

 

6.High costs in waste disposal

 

7. High costs in energy prices again protected by the EU money men

 

8.Open borders putting out safety at risk

 

9.No national army and leading to dependency of foreign armies (Very dangerous)

 

10.Poor allocation of EU money leading to many areas to become neglected (Burslem is one which has declined under EU rule)

 

Yeah the EU is really a good idea isn't it?

[Fosse69]

How does the EU control rents and mortgages?

[cheshirevaliant]

Carllllllll is back to tell everyone how working class he is.

[SourceOfTheTrent]

It really is boring reading some of these comments on this page. We voted out decidedly it's called democracy get over it.

 

As for the arguments that the 'majority' to win was slim-we could go on forever unfair FPTP is in our domestic general elections. Stoke on Trent voters combined voted for others parties more than the traditional party who always gets in Labour-shall we have another vote on that?

 

The majority on here who obviously do not consider themselves as 'workers' working class or people who struggle to make ends meet whilst working, will obviously be ignorant to the ramifications that staying in the EU would mean to them.

 

1.Healthcare issues Cannot get to see a GP etc

 

2 High rents and out of reach Mortgages

 

3.Ridiculous uncontrolled immigration meaning Employers can keep wages as low as possible and not have to worry about replacing-leading to bad working conditions

 

4.Cheap products by Multinationals putting smaller business out of business

 

5.Multinationals making huge profits for shareholders within the EU and not paying fair share of tax because EU laws allow them to get away with it and allow them to exploit working class people further with low wages.

 

6.High costs in waste disposal

 

7. High costs in energy prices again protected by the EU money men

 

8.Open borders putting out safety at risk

 

9.No national army and leading to dependency of foreign armies (Very dangerous)

 

10.Poor allocation of EU money leading to many areas to become neglected (Burslem is one which has declined under EU rule)

 

Yeah the EU is really a good idea isn't it?

 

Is that what you honestly think, that all those issues are down to being in the EU and that by leaving they'll somehow be tackled? All those things are likely to be worse outside the EU; take immigration, just which government is going to 'control' immigration and what 'controls' are they going to put in place? During the Brexit campaign south Asian communities were targeted by the Leave campaign who were telling them if EU migration was stopped there'd be greater opportunity for increased immigration from the Indian sub-continent. Were the Leave campaign lying to them or lying to the general electorate by saying immigration could be controlled, implying it WOULD be controlled? I think we'd all like to see some greatly improved management of immigration but I have no faith in any of the major parties in doing so because they never have managed it properly and all subscribe to the view it's good for the economy. Also, it's difficult to argue it suppresses wage rates when we have a high level of residual unemployment, don't forget the figures have been fudged since Thatcher's time to make unemployment seem better than it really is. Wage rates are held down by the erosion of job security and employment rights, smaller workplaces making collective bargaining and organisation difficult and personal debt levels making people insecure in their personal lives and less confident in standing up for better terms of employment.

The EU can and should be greatly improved, that has been acknowledged through this thread, but so can the UK and any other democracy and the points you make are not due to the actions of the EU except, arguably, point 10 and even that is largely down to how Stoke-on-Trent council bid for funding from both the UK government and EU government.

[geosname]

Saying life is so much better since we joined the EU is about as valid as saying that joining the EU is the reason allergies have increased to 40% of the UK population (an extra 2,000,000 between 2008 and 2009)

[Paul6754]

I think I might have mentioned this elsewhere, but in the 60s and in the wake of De Gaulle saying 'non' the Wilson government made a half hearted enquiry about becoming a state of the USA. Could history repeat itself?

 

Why would that be a bad thing, especially if the UK could have the same gun laws at it currently has.

[Paul6754]

Saying life is so much better since we joined the EU is about as valid as saying that joining the EU is the reason allergies have increased to 40% of the UK population (an extra 2,000,000 between 2008 and 2009)

 

Geo that's an interesting question. Rather than life being so much better within the EU I would suggest life is better. No major wars within Europe, virtually unrestricted travel, increased collaboration between different EU countries, industries, Universities, scientists and medics leading to greater innovation in all areas of commerce, health and gizmos.

 

IMHO We're all so much "Richer" now although we'll never know whether current life in the UK would have been the same if the UK hadn't joined the EU. The Politicians who took the UK into the EU must have had good reason and vision (I realize the idea was to join an Economic Union), why should it be different now economically in such a relatively short period of time.

[SourceOfTheTrent]

Why would that be a bad thing, especially if the UK could have the same gun laws at it currently has.

Speak for yourself, personally I'd love it if I could pick up some assault rifles in Asda as I'm doing my weekly shop, like they do in Oklahoma! Anybody parking in front of my driveway would get blown away, that'll teach 'em!

[For Us All]

Interesting after not looking at this thread for a while, people do seem to be realising what a momentous clanger we have made leaving the EU. There will always be some people who will keep there heads buried and follow the Tory Right. But the fact that we could lose most of the Car industry, Banking. Coupled with higher flight costs etc etc does focus the mind. Let's hope it's not to late,cos many people who voted Leave did not see a hard Brexit or a No deal coming along.

 

You've obviously been indoctrinated by 'Project Fear'?

[For Us All]

Geo that's an interesting question. Rather than life being so much better within the EU I would suggest life is better. No major wars within Europe, virtually unrestricted travel, increased collaboration between different EU countries, industries, Universities, scientists and medics leading to greater innovation in all areas of commerce, health and gizmos.

 

IMHO We're all so much "Richer" now although we'll never know whether current life in the UK would have been the same if the UK hadn't joined the EU. The Politicians who took the UK into the EU must have had good reason and vision (I realize the idea was to join an Economic Union), why should it be different now economically in such a relatively short period of time.

 

It does make you wonder how the other countries outside the EU survive without being on board the gravy train?

[SourceOfTheTrent]

You've obviously been indoctrinated by 'Project Fear'?

As opposed to hard line Brexit supporters who've been indoctrinated by 'Project Lobotomy' !

[Thevalefan]

It does make you wonder how the other countries outside the EU survive without being on board the gravy train?

 

Name a country doing better than us, on the continent, who are outside of the EU?

[Thevalefan]

As opposed to hard line Brexit supporters who've been indoctrinated by 'Project Lobotomy' !

 

"project fib" these kind of people ignore facts like the economy has shrunk 2.5%. There is some sensationalised fabrications about leaving, but the reality is project fear is a piece of propaganda.

[SourceOfTheTrent]

Name a country doing better than us, on the continent, who are outside of the EU?

Norway!

They're members in all but name though.

Switzerland maybe with their small population and unique geographical location?

What about principalities like Monaco? Not sure what their status is as regards membership, e.g., are they separate from France and therefore not members?

We can be a ginormous Monaco after Brexit, we've got loads of casinos and plenty of coastline for everyone's yachts.