Brexit again...

[Thevalefan]

That's exactly what they do.I know it's hard to believe but they all get €4,400 expenses straight into their bank accounts every month with no questions asked.That's on top of their salary of €6,250 per month after tax.

Look it up.

 

Fair enough!! That won't last forever. Probably blocked the disclosure right now because of Brexit too!

 

Wrong that is it's structure though. Tory MEPs seem the worst ones for it for a quick search into it, check out Amjad Bashir!

 

Still small fry for a union that can create a GDP of $1.9 trillion mate. Much bigger issues surrounding the EU!

[geosname]

My memory may be faulty but didn't 3 Labour and one Tory get jailed over expenses?

[geosname]

Fair enough!! That won't last forever. Probably blocked the disclosure right now because of Brexit too!

 

Wrong that is it's structure though. Tory MEPs seem the worst ones for it for a quick search into it, check out Amjad Bashir!

 

Still small fry for a union that can create a GDP of $1.9 trillion mate. Much bigger issues surrounding the EU!

 

There are always bigger issues, it's the art of misdirection.

People on the gravy train drive it, they only want it to go faster... the trick is not to attack the engine, take out the track it runs on.

[Thevalefan]

Here's something for you to enjoy today.

 

Nigel Farage Facebook page (leave means leave) have run a poll on EU membership, based on what we know now. More or less 1,000,000 votes so VERY good size.

 

37% Leave

63% Remain

 

It's reassuring to know people have woken up to the stupidity going on around them. What makes it even sweeter is how embarrassing this is for Farage, the man who's done more than most to cause Brexit and pushed lies alongside the likes of JRM. Egg on face.

Legs are falling off Brexit. Is it undemocratic to vote again, if people have genuinely changed their minds? This poll massively suggests they have.

 

(No, I don't use Facebook... But I thought I better post a link so you can see I'm not making it up).

[Thevalefan]

https://m.facebook.com/NFarageHero/posts/2202705069947730?__tn__=-R

[Thevalefan]

There are always bigger issues, it's the art of misdirection.

People on the gravy train drive it, they only want it to go faster... the trick is not to attack the engine, take out the track it runs on.

 

UK has missed a golden opportunity to reform the EU, which - if you speak to other Europeans in the EU states - they would have backed us. It's desperate for someone to stand up and say "we are going in the wrong direction, we want to lead the way forward", it needs leadership that represents normal people. It is too bureaucratic, it creates it's own barriers.... But equally, it's served the UK better than most countries and I think it's something we should always be appreciative of because look how life has improved for most people since being members.

 

The Vale are being run by an idiot now. We don't decided to stop supporting them, we make some noise and rock the boat - for the long term good of the club.

 

I'll concede the EU is a bit of a gravy train but no different than being an MP here. I don't remember the likes of Farage or other Euro-sceptic MEP's rallying around for transparency, no - they take their crust and talk about things that suit their narrative..

 

Brexit is estimated now to be costing us £500m a week (fake news/scaremongering.... Or economic statistics by economists of the UK?) and the economy has shrunk 2.5% - That's £24bn of extra austerity we have inflicted on ourselves for voting Leave without a proper plan/idea of what to do. Our taxes are paying for this absolute farce, and will be for decades to come to get nothing back.

 

That's what I can't get with Brexit. Fair enough if people wanted to leave, but to do it without a plan in place is just utter madness and the reason we are where we are right now.

[geosname]

UK has missed a golden opportunity to reform the EU, which - if you speak to other Europeans in the EU states - they would have backed us. It's desperate for someone to stand up and say "we are going in the wrong direction, we want to lead the way forward", it needs leadership that represents normal people. It is too bureaucratic, it creates it's own barriers.... But equally, it's served the UK better than most countries and I think it's something we should always be appreciative of because look how life has improved for most people since being members.

 

The Vale are being run by an idiot now. We don't decided to stop supporting them, we make some noise and rock the boat - for the long term good of the club.

 

I'll concede the EU is a bit of a gravy train but no different than being an MP here. I don't remember the likes of Farage or other Euro-sceptic MEP's rallying around for transparency, no - they take their crust and talk about things that suit their narrative..

 

Brexit is estimated now to be costing us £500m a week (fake news/scaremongering.... Or economic statistics by economists of the UK?) and the economy has shrunk 2.5% - That's £24bn of extra austerity we have inflicted on ourselves for voting Leave without a proper plan/idea of what to do. Our taxes are paying for this absolute farce, and will be for decades to come to get nothing back.

 

That's what I can't get with Brexit. Fair enough if people wanted to leave, but to do it without a plan in place is just utter madness and the reason we are where we are right now.

 

The people weren't offered a plan, it wasn't part of either campaign or on the ballot paper.... just leave or stay.

People voted for whatever they thought best.... right or wrong.

They have the right to change their minds.... but..... they also have the right to change their minds about the Mps they voted for. If someone chucked a couple of million in a pot to have a new vote after an election would that be acceptable?

How about deflecting an MP right after the election and replacing him?

There are numerous ways a change of mind can affect the politics of this country, not all bad but setting that precedent is brought with problems.

I agree it was a bad decision, the wrong decision, but it's been made.

[Thevalefan]

The people weren't offered a plan, it wasn't part of either campaign or on the ballot paper.... just leave or stay.

People voted for whatever they thought best.... right or wrong.

They have the right to change their minds.... but..... they also have the right to change their minds about the Mps they voted for. If someone chucked a couple of million in a pot to have a new vote after an election would that be acceptable?

How about deflecting an MP right after the election and replacing him?

There are numerous ways a change of mind can affect the politics of this country, not all bad but setting that precedent is brought with problems.

I agree it was a bad decision, the wrong decision, but it's been made.

 

Can't disagree with any of that really mate. "Don't bring facts to a culture war" I suppose.

 

You should check out American businessmen who have been donating to right wing groups and the Conservatives for years now. Many invested are within healthcare backgrounds... Russian links to Brexit groups - undoubtedly happening - we can do those things you've mentioned above, but right now it's becoming more clear that those who would benefit most without a single market (Russia, USA) are most supportive of it... That's a route that is complicated to go down and I guess Brexiteers will dismiss it as conspiracy or fake news though!

[Paul6754]

The Ryder Cup is a microcosm of the EU in/out situation. When the UK was on it's own against the USA it hadn't got a chance, with the inclusion of the European players in the early 80's the UK can successfully compete, the UK is much stronger being part of the EU than the UK being on its own.

[SourceOfTheTrent]

The Ryder Cup is a microcosm of the EU in/out situation. When the UK was on it's own against the USA it hadn't got a chance, with the inclusion of the European players in the early 80's the UK can successfully compete, the UK is much stronger being part of the EU than the UK being on its own.

Great analogy. Also great to see the European unity and team spirit shown by our players. Europe United is a formidable force.

[Regal Beagle]

The Ryder Cup is a microcosm of the EU in/out situation. When the UK was on it's own against the USA it hadn't got a chance, with the inclusion of the European players in the early 80's the UK can successfully compete, the UK is much stronger being part of the EU than the UK being on its own.

 

It's team Europe not team European Union though.

 

A great example of how individuals can be highly successful and then also be part of a successful, mutually beneficial team.

[Fosse69]

It's team Europe not team European Union though.

 

A great example of how individuals can be highly successful and then also be part of a successful, mutually beneficial team.

Of course, the whole point of the EU. Cant see us being better off under the control of the USA.

[tommytunstall]

Interesting after not looking at this thread for a while, people do seem to be realising what a momentous clanger we have made leaving the EU. There will always be some people who will keep there heads buried and follow the Tory Right. But the fact that we could lose most of the Car industry, Banking. Coupled with higher flight costs etc etc does focus the mind. Let's hope it's not to late,cos many people who voted Leave did not see a hard Brexit or a No deal coming along.

[Heatwave]

Of course, the whole point of the EU. Cant see us being better off under the control of the USA.

 

I think I might have mentioned this elsewhere, but in the 60s and in the wake of De Gaulle saying 'non' the Wilson government made a half hearted enquiry about becoming a state of the USA. Could history repeat itself?

[Fosse69]

I think I might have mentioned this elsewhere, but in the 60s and in the wake of De Gaulle saying 'non' the Wilson government made a half hearted enquiry about becoming a state of the USA. Could history repeat itself?

A state or a colony? I would think Wilson was not serious, after all he kept us out of Vietnam unlike a lot of later PMs who grovel when the US invades countries.