Brexit again...

[Andyregs]

"Every new day is a new beginning with new horizons" Barry.

We are Great Britain and should never be afraid of going it alone.

 

But...but...but we’re Great Britain! We have great in our name? They’ve got to give us what we want!...empire...great...

[Fosse69]

We voted to join a global economy.

Which new country will we be able to deal with?

[SourceOfTheTrent]

We voted to join a global economy.

We are already in it! Leave was a vote to make international trade harder!! Just because we could say 'tariff free' to imports doesn't mean other countries will reciprocate. We don't even have the staff to negotiate trade deals outside the EU, it would take years and years to agree significant deals during which time we would be on WTO terms giving us no advantages whatsoever. Apart from that only a small proportion of our export trade is outside the EU so growing it to even half our trade would take years, making EU trade more difficult by introducing tariffs either way or introducing bureaucratical administration can only harm our trade.

I can't get over this leave fantasy that somehow we are blocked from global trade by our membership of the EU. Just look how much stuff you buy is from non-EU countries! As for exports non-EU countries are not necessarily going to suddenly give the UK tariff free exports or even as good as we have as EU members.

Whatever arguments are put forward in support of Brexit economic ones are the worst of the lot, leaving is economic suicide and anyone who can't see that knows nothing of international trade and business.

[SourceOfTheTrent]

"Every new day is a new beginning with new horizons" Barry.

We are Great Britain and should never be afraid of going it alone.

You're showing your true colours there, a childish patriotic stance in the false belief Britain is somehow superior to other countries. It wasn't you on the radio a few months ago, was it, ringing in to suggest we should send the RAF to attack Russia? When England are playing on Wednesday will you be with your mates belting out those old bigot's favourites, 10 German Bombers and 2 World Wars & 1 World Cup?

Yes, we are Great Britain, as in the greater land mass than the individual UK countries, it does not mean we are great in some intangible measure of superior ability. When people from other nations spout their arrogant belief in their superiority how does it make other peoples feel? Nauseous is the answer.

[SourceOfTheTrent]

We're the 6th biggest economy in the world and the Germans especially would be gutted if they lost our market. Look at the ads on TV for German goods, Mercedes, VW, (incl Seat, Skoda etc), Adidas, Miele, even those Harrys razor blades and Alpecin shampoo, not forgetting Lidl, Aldi and plenty more. The French also are bombarding our TV screens with ads for Citreon, Peugeot etc. What if instead we started inporting more cars from India, China the USA and goods from Brazil, Australia and Russia and of course we exported likewise to them in return. Do you not think the Germans and French haven't already thought about this and are playing a very dangerous game? Call their bluff Mrs May,because that's what it is, bluff.

Your patriotically blinded naeivety is staggering. Just because you imagine how things could be doesn't make them likely.

[Jacko51]

As I see it, the Remainers voted for something tangible - stay in the single market, free movement, with the worst bits (Schengen, the Euro) not on the menu. The Leavers voted for an "ideal" - taking back control, sovereignty, etc. - with no plan as to how this would actually be achieved. As soon as he realised he'd made an almighty cock up, Cameron ran away. Farage followed him. Now Davies and Johnson have headed for the hills as well. Theresa May, for all her faults (and there are many), is left holding the baby that should never have been conceived in the first place. She is taking the blame for two years of prevarication in which bugger all has been achieved in terms of moving the process forwards by the guy tasked with doing it.

 

Leavers talk of sovereignty yet wished to deny our sovereign Parliament the right to vote on the final deal. They talk of taking back control yet it is patently obvious that no one has any sort of control of the Leave process or indeed, any agreement on what it means. JRM talks of a no deal scenario which would see us facing WTO tarrifs in the short term with its consequent effect on inflation - a fact that would hit the average family in this country far harder than a multi-millionnaire like him who wouldn't notice.

 

If this was an episode of "Yes, Prime Minister" we would all be watching our tellies and laughing at the stupidity of it all. Sadly, it is real life and makes me want to cry instead.

[SourceOfTheTrent]

That's a great, measured post, Jacko.

[Santa]

Exactly!!!

FWIW I could just as easily have used the word unicornism instead.

 

A deal with all the benefits of the single market but none of the costs or responsibilities was never on the table.

 

May is terrible but at the very least she seems to be dealing in the reality of the situation and trying to square the circle of single market / EEA access. Davis, Johnson et al have criticized the Chequers agreement but have yet to suggest an alternative.

 

I know it's hard for some people with their colonialist fantasies about being a great power again to accept being an equal partner with a country like Germany. However anybody who thinks Britain can get a good deal simply by throwing their weight around will be in for another shock à la Suez.

[Howjy04]

We are already in it! Leave was a vote to make international trade harder!! Just because we could say 'tariff free' to imports doesn't mean other countries will reciprocate. We don't even have the staff to negotiate trade deals outside the EU, it would take years and years to agree significant deals during which time we would be on WTO terms giving us no advantages whatsoever. Apart from that only a small proportion of our export trade is outside the EU so growing it to even half our trade would take years, making EU trade more difficult by introducing tariffs either way or introducing bureaucratical administration can only harm our trade.

I can't get over this leave fantasy that somehow we are blocked from global trade by our membership of the EU. Just look how much stuff you buy is from non-EU countries! As for exports non-EU countries are not necessarily going to suddenly give the UK tariff free exports or even as good as we have as EU members.

Whatever arguments are put forward in support of Brexit economic ones are the worst of the lot, leaving is economic suicide and anyone who can't see that knows nothing of international trade and business.

Of course you are correct as ever.It only took Canada a couple of weeks to get a trade deal with the EU.Not like the EU to drag their feet in future.Stoke on Trent pottery is/was a prime example why the EU can **** themselves.

[SourceOfTheTrent]

Of course you are correct as ever.It only took Canada a couple of weeks to get a trade deal with the EU.Not like the EU to drag their feet in future.Stoke on Trent pottery is/was a prime example why the EU can **** themselves.

What a great attitude. The true opinions and thinking of the Brexiteers is coming out now!

Imperialist, colonialist, fascist and blindly patriotic thinking all lead to disaster, usually ending in war.

[Howjy04]

What a great attitude. The true opinions and thinking of the Brexiteers is coming out now!

Imperialist, colonialist, fascist and blindly patriotic thinking all lead to disaster, usually ending in war.

 

Total boll0xx.

[SourceOfTheTrent]

Total boll0xx.

Would you care to expand on that philosophical statement, John Bull?

[Howjy04]

JCB-50m new factory- 200 new jobs-Unprecendented GLOBAL,yes,GLOBAL demand.Damn Brexit!!!!If people are scared of losing business , look no further than yourself and get off your arse and do something about it.

[Howjy04]

Would you care to expand on that philosophical statement, John Bull?

 

No J.Arthur.

[Fosse69]

We're the 6th biggest economy in the world and the Germans especially would be gutted if they lost our market. Look at the ads on TV for German goods, Mercedes, VW, (incl Seat, Skoda etc), Adidas, Miele, even those Harrys razor blades and Alpecin shampoo, not forgetting Lidl, Aldi and plenty more. The French also are bombarding our TV screens with ads for Citreon, Peugeot etc. What if instead we started inporting more cars from India, China the USA and goods from Brazil, Australia and Russia and of course we exported likewise to them in return. Do you not think the Germans and French haven't already thought about this and are playing a very dangerous game? Call their bluff Mrs May,because that's what it is, bluff.

Cars are a problem, as we don't own any factories apart from the odd small one. The Germans, French, Japanese, Indians etc will obviously reduce/close our factory production in line with EU demand. As for being gutted, taking a market of 60M out of a market of 500M has a far smaller effect on the larger market, so we are the ones to be greatly affected.