Brexit again...

[SourceOfTheTrent]

Another two Tories have just quit. This is one monumental mess, 8 months before we leave and the government is ripping itself apart.

[Thevalefan]

That’s correct tvf.BMW also use Cooper S platforms on their latest small SUVs.I cannot honestly believe that Germany would give us a body swerve.EU trade will still be there,of that I have no doubt.We can shop elsewhere ,if not ,with agreeable tariffs and I’ll have to get myself a Jag instead.

 

Still doesn't explain what restriction the EU are imposing, as you said they do.

 

Like I said in an earlier post, having been in Frankfurt and speaking to blokes from Merc/Audi - whatever extra costs incurred due to Brexit regarding cars specifically will be covered in further finance agreements with customers.

 

If you take a finance deal of £25,000 for example over 3 years, the thinking is someone will have no problem taking out £30,000 for the same product. Because people can't really afford it in the first place but still buy it. Makes sense too when you sit down and think about it. Again, British people are worse off in that scenario.

[For Us All]

I don't deride patriotism but I am opposed to unquestioning, blind jingoistic patriotism of the type displayed, unfortunately, by quite a few England fans at many games. I have been to some international matches where I've felt so alienated from my own team I could almost have wanted them to lose. I'm white European myself but it must be even more alienating if you're black or Asian British.

There are things Britain can be proud of and things Britain should be ashamed of but that is true for any country I can think of to greater or lesser degrees.

I have a massive respect for the UK military and I have numerous relations who have served and even given their lives in service, however, that doesn't mean the military has always been used in a none oppressive manner and some peoples will, quite rightly, have a very dim view of Britain and it's military.

What I will never accept is unthinking or non critical patriotism, we need to be truthful with ourselves and to me real patriotism is to want what's best for the country and by that I mean all the people which is what any country really is.

I consider my pro-EU position to be a patriotic one because I want the best for the largest proportion of the British population as possible. You may hold a different view or wish to achieve the same thing via a different method which is one of the things we can all be proud of Britain for, it may not always have been true but currently we have as much if not more right to free speech as any nation on the planet.

We have the right to have this bunfight and I am enjoying my freedom to engage in it, even if it is also driving me batty!

 

If you want the best for the largest proportion of the British population,so do we,welcome to the 17.4 million people who voted for Brexit.

[Thevalefan]

Another two Tories have just quit. This is one monumental mess, 8 months before we leave and the government is ripping itself apart.

 

This is all very British now. If you disagree with something - quit. Don't bother to try and suggest better alternatives, influence or fight against things you don't agree with; just walk away and let someone else sort it out.

 

People didn't like aspects of the EU, so decided we should just quit. Now politicians are doing the same!

[For Us All]

Great debate and would be even better if certain posters refrained from unkind name calling.

 

Totally agree Barry,these Remainers need to take it on the chin and accept the result of the referendum.

A united Brexit is now required,how about a new approach,perhaps a ReLeave group can be formed going forward?

[philpvfc]

I've been over this.

 

87% of cars are bought on finance in the UK. I was in Frankfurt at Mercedes and Audi in 2016 after the Referendum and the people I met there found this incredible, that we have such a buy now pay later culture.

 

It's finance companies buying the cars and leasing them to customers. Any higher costs associated with Brexit for the cars will simply mean that people who takes a £25,000 over 3 years (for example) option will have to pay more like £27,000 over three years, or maybe even more over a longer period of time. Same with Lidl or Aldi, they're already undercutting their competitors so a slight increase will still see them positioning where they want to be in the UK market.

 

Okay mate, go buy a car from Brazil or the US and import it here... You must be richer than the rest of us 😂

 

You will find that more Germans lease their vehicles than the U.K. plus they rent their properties rather than buy. Plus the manufacturer which has most of its sales in the U.K. on finance is Bentley whereby most owners could easily pay cash.

 

With rates as low as they are you’d be stupid to pay cash for a high value vehicle as there are far better places to put your money. So not sure what your point was really.

[philpvfc]

My Dad's bigger than your Dad

 

I've got a Masters in International Economic Law, and what? Big deal, who care's?

 

It makes it more ironic you say the things you do and then quote to have an A Level in Economics!

 

Read this afterwards. Laughable after my last post!

[Thevalefan]

A united Brexit is now required

 

And what exactly is that? We all point blank agree on a no-deal Brexit?

 

No-one can agree on anything. I'm sure even hard line Brexiteers such as yourself, jimbo, howjy and so on would all disagree on many aspects of Brexit when you get past the surface of it all and into the complex side of things!

 

I have taken it on the chin and as said previously I am planning a life outside of England when I've worked more and saved more money. Can't take it on the chin much more than that really can you. The problem is if more people feel the same as me then its detriment to Britain in the long run!

[philpvfc]

I intend to retire to the continent as well, would go now if work allowed so hopefully more countries leave the EU making them more attractive propositions

[Thevalefan]

You will find that more Germans lease their vehicles than the U.K. plus they rent their properties rather than buy. Plus the manufacturer which has most of its sales in the U.K. on finance is Bentley whereby most owners could easily pay cash.

 

With rates as low as they are you’d be stupid to pay cash for a high value vehicle as there are far better places to put your money. So not sure what your point was really.

 

My point is outside the single market and any extra costs that it may bring around will mean British people get a worse deal when getting a new car against customers in Europe inside the single market with free trade agreements. As for what they find incredible, it is the 'buy now pay later' culture we have with companies like Brighthouse for items like sofas, mobile phones, washers, cookers etc etc. We have a the fourth-highest total household debt in the world in 2013. Germany not even in the top 10. In 2017 UK public debt was at 90% of total GDP against the Germans 65.7%. It's not a good place for us to be in as a nation.

 

How would you be stupid? If you buy a car for (hypothetically speaking) £20,000 and get finance on it that costs you £25,000 - then you're 5 grand down over three years. If you save up £20,000 and pay for it outright, your getting the same thing for 5 grand cheaper than what other people are getting through finance. Then you can sell it and recoup more money back. Generally people rent now because they don't want to keep the car for 5-10 years as folk traditionally would have in the past.

 

As for houses the numbers who rent is very similar to here in the UK. That is for a variety of reasons, not really relevant to what I was saying. Int Economic Law was a large part of my masters, but not that in its entirety. It was more tongue in cheek for bragging about an economics A Level. We didn't study about cars either, more about bilateral investment treaties, WTO law, investment law of private firms in international contexts etc. So, laugh all you like - I still have that on a piece of paper than helps me get by in life. I'm only in my 20's too, so still have a lot to learn as well and have no problem admitting that. What academic achievements in life have you made seeing as your so quick to denounce someone else's!?

 

Worth mentioning that interest rates will very much be influenced by the kind of Brexit deal we get, so it could be an outcome that finance will stop if rates increase!

[Thevalefan]

I intend to retire to the continent as well, would go now if work allowed so hopefully more countries leave the EU making them more attractive propositions

 

Where in the continent, out of interest?

[SourceOfTheTrent]

For clarity, in Germany it is common to rent in cities but they don't rent dumps from private landlords it's a regulated market and most rentals are with big organisations. In towns and rural areas it's common to own your house and their houses are incredibly better value than ours, much cheaper. I know this first hand as I've had German friends for 30 years.

Also, as in other posts, Germans have much lower personal debt than us, culturally they save for things like we used to. They reckon it's to do with poverty experienced in the Weimar hyperinflation and after the second war.

[Andyregs]

Totally agree Barry,these Remainers need to take it on the chin and accept the result of the referendum.

A united Brexit is now required,how about a new approach,perhaps a ReLeave group can be formed going forward?

 

A United brexit? You’ve literally just been calling for the prime minister to resign!

And why do we need a United brexit when you want a no deal anyway.

[SourceOfTheTrent]

Totally agree Barry,these Remainers need to take it on the chin and accept the result of the referendum.

A united Brexit is now required,how about a new approach,perhaps a ReLeave group can be formed going forward?

If you had a serious life changing illness surely you wouldn't just accept it? It's normal to oppose what you don't like, the anti-EU mob have been doing it for 45 years and now their chance has come they're making the biggest mess imaginable of it.

[SourceOfTheTrent]

I intend to retire to the continent as well, would go now if work allowed so hopefully more countries leave the EU making them more attractive propositions

So you want to make life harder for the young then swan off into the sunset leaving behind your Brexit Britain utopia? What crass hypocrisy!