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My opinion of the team is that yes, it is poor. However, that's not the main problem. The main problem is its lack of balance and its overall, well, weakness. In nearly 40 years of now supporting Vale, I've possibly seen a poorer team in terms of individual talent, but I have certainly never seen a weaker squad. For the first time that I can ever remember, I cannot name you my preferred starting 11 from this squad. We simply cannot field one that in any way looks adequate. From a fully fit squad, any first 11 contains compromises of players being shoe-horned into positions that they are not suited to nor can successfully play. And that is exactly why I am so damn adamant that this DoF and his recruitment team need to sling their hooks back to obscurity. They have failed and are clearly out of their depth.

I don't understand the logic of that philosophy. Aspire to become a championship club through incremental development, but 'behaving' like one is naïve and simplistic. I'd rather us behave as a professional and ambitious 'whatever league we are in' club, and build from there with a solid foundation.

Our promotion happened a year too soon, didnt allow us to consolidate properly and it has continued to hamper us into this season. If we go down which is looking likely I think we will bounce back quickly and then have a better chance at consolidation in League 1. I do however think that the rebuilding process cannot be allowed to be run by David Flitcroft and in all honesty, i dont think should be done by a director of football at all. Darren Moore has a better CV and better contacts than Flitcroft for a start so Flitcroft's position is not only untenable but also completely redundant. What i would like to see in place is a return to the chief scout role, someone who can oversea the scouting network and report directly to Darren Moore.

It's always difficult if not impossible to make cross gererational comparisons. What I will say though, is that I have never in all my years watching the Vale seen a team that has less fight than the current lot. We have had some players, teams even, over the years that were actually far far less technically proficient than the current squad/team, but at least they would generally give it their all, something that sadly you just cannot say about this lot. Everything changes and sooner or later the wheel will turn, I just don't know what league we will be in when it does.

Great post mate that absolutely sums up how the i feel about it all. I sit there constantly watching players struggle in positions there not comfortable in and i cant see how they have allowed this to happen. Even now your telling me there is no free agents that could strengthen us just a little bit we dont even need world beaters at this point just someone who can play in there natural position but they sit back and have done nothing. Ive never felt so disengaged with a vale team in all my life so many forgettable players no characters it just bland. These people this is there job they supposedly spend hours and hours and hours looking into players to fit our system and ethos and this is what they came up with? Seriously?

I think we had some more committed players such as Dave Worrall and James Gibbons but we let them go.

We were fed that line after promotion but after the first season it shouldn’t have hampered us to the extent it has. Not withstanding overall deficiencies in the first team squad, we’ve basically been crying out for a couple of decent strikers since gaining promotion. Proctor and Wilson were never going to play enough games for one thing. If we had 2 forwards capable of scoring say ten goals a piece this current team would be fine, not world beaters but steady enough, simply having that threat takes pressure off the rest of the team. As it is we’ll still need to sign a couple of forwards to survive in League 2 never mind challenge for an immediate return.

Who Flitcroft employed. He had been a "performance analyst" until he came to Vale. He became our head of recruitment in July 2022 after a year of recruitment analysis. Since becoming head of recruitment, he has a terrible record of signing players of the required standard, along with with Flitcroft.

So it’s time to start preparing for next season in League 2. Plant, Dipepa, Shorrock, Lomax and Walters (?) will develop more quickly, as they could be legitimate starters that are not being bedded in, they are active contributors getting better and better. Obviously getting ride of players who are not up to it who are under contract will be preferable - but if we can’t do that at least they’ll do less damage and be more useful and productive, which may lead to better confidence. I strongly think that although Darren has probably made mistakes, he will turn the team around with his own players gradually being recruited and the trash removed over time. Both he and Carol must have known his first full season could have realistically been in league 2, and now that’s the case he’ll have a rebuild that makes the fans feel comfortable again. I think he can do it and we can’t judge based on what he’s trying to do with the current team. I hope he doesn’t walk. Obviously the fans and the club will be caught in a divisive stand off until Flitcroft is gone. That will never ever change and Carol seems happy for that to be the case. That is a bigger stumbling block than any other, as the toxic atmosphere and the failed recruitment both stem from that role. Fail to sort that and we cannot rebuild fully, properly or durably. Apart from that, we need / need to: Retain key players: Ensure that crucial players remain with the club to maintain team cohesion and talent. Garrity, Chislett, Clark, Ripley will be cheat codes in L2. Strengthen squad balance: Acquire new players that don’t use this ‘utility’ model. Just get players who play where they are supposed to play, and others to cover that same position. Simple. Review coaching staff: Assess the coaching team and consider changes if necessary to improve tactics and player development. The injuries, tactics and inability to change have been terrible for years and it needs to be addressed. Financial stability: Manage finances carefully to avoid further setbacks and ensure the club's long-term sustainability. Engage with supporters: Maintain positive communication with fans to boost morale and retain support during challenging times especially. Stop improving facilities: Nobody cares about new training facilities and stadium infrastructure if the results are not shown on the pitch. Develop a clear short term strategy: Define short-term goals for the club and implement a coherent plan to achieve them. Long term plans mean nothing. We can have a general vision, but talking about the Championship at the bottom of L1 is somewhere between criminally ignorant and laughable. Foster a winning mentality: Instil confidence and determination within the team to strive for success and bounce back from relegation. This team has no character, few big personalities and no meanness. I don’t care about them being mates, I want them to win as a team and sometimes you need to embrace the dark arts to achieve that.

Not sure none of it was his fault but hear what you are saying. Moore has not been any better so the problem likely lies elsewhere. But I don’t think it’s one person. It’s bigger than that. I fear we might end up where Forest Green are now if we aren’t careful.

Not yet me owd fruit

Yeah exactly Fraudcrofts track record isn't the best

You seem agitated bud, you need to chill. He needs to sod off back to Sjoke - WUM!!!!

I didn’t like what’s gone on many times before ,Ive marched with the black and gold and protested , and I don’t like what is going on now . BUT PLEASE tell me what are YOU PERSONALLY ,going to do about this predicament i look forward to hearing your ideas , probably make things better by shouting abuse from the the terrace , then turn up hypocritically for the next game ,or are you not going to be a Vale fan because we got relegated ? I’ve seen this many times before, I think 7 promotions and this could be my 8th relegation since I’ve been going to watch my team , I’ve seen some shyte down the vale some real shyte , you choose to slag off all and sundry here on a forum , I may think the same as you but I don’t do this , it achieves ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ,so does that make me a “happy clapper “ or a just a Vale fan …….till I die.

Well if we weren't doing things to attract that next generation of fans with all the other options around these days then there definitely won't be people coming on match days in the future. Also, don't forget that Vale Park has basically had no investment of any note in 20 years. We're also ignoring the unforseen and unprecedented impact of Covid where the Shanahans basically had to spend a lot of money just to see the club continue to exist at all. The thought of what would have happened had the lock down season happened on Norman's watch is truly frightenting. I agree the balance hasn't been 100% right and I think the director of football was always a role too far and is a failed experiment for me now but I totally get why such off field investments had to be made.

I know that our annual turnover is £7.9m and all the things you've listed will contribute a tiny % towards that. I also know the going 'price' for a league one standard striker and a league one standard manager, with the 'value' of both being the increased chance of remaining in this league. I believe the drop off in EFL consolidation payments is around 700k from league one to league two. Gotta sell a lot of pizza in the fanzone to fill that hole. It's a shame the club have prioritized investing in infrastructure with an incredibly low ROI versus making the right call on the pitch, where the real money is to be made and lost.

Perhaps a little dim, but also leveraging my first class degree in economics to question your claims. Your theory only works if the demand previously outstripped supply. Are you really implying that previously the club were turning away corporate business over the summer months because we didn't have enough function suites? Are you also saying that on multiple occasions this summer we'll have a packed Robbie's on the same day as packed function suite? I struggle to believe that. Totally get that it brings in an extra £90k/season through extra corporate bums on seats (although a % of that will have been coming into the club as these fans sat in other stands previously) but to suggest that Robbie's will be a major driver of revenue (doubling, in fact) over the summer is far-fetched.

I think the absolute pits for me was Dean Glovers team. Midfield pairing of Neil McKenzie and Ross Davidson with Klye Perry and Danny Glover up front, Chris Slater at the back. We were so lucky that season as it was only Luton starting on -30. Rotherham and Bournemouth on -17 and Chester being truly horrific that kept us up.

The only way to get any trust back with the supporter base is for DF to be no where near Port Vale in any capacity.

I think we're a fantastic bet to go down again, you'll probably get half-decent odds too. Our success in L2 previously has come from having physical players and leaders in the team, Griff, McCombe, Richards, Pope and even recently with the likes of Conor Hall. We won't recruit those kind of players though, it'll be "nice lads" to fit this rubbish passing it sideways style of play. Sign a big b*stard up-front, some quick wingers, and get it in the box to him. Bring back Dinosaur football!

The person who was in the coffin is starting ahead of Loft on Tuesday.

Danny Sonner mentioned wages at Vale about 20 years ago.....so what do we do pre-season, bugger off to Spain and have zero match condition pre season friendlies. Point being, Vale will always be Vale, and for the second season running the prep for the new season has been an absolute shambles.

Flitcroft is not up to the job, the last 18 months and our current league position prove that, fact not opinion. So why should the person responsible for everything the ball touches be trusted with the same job next season. Trust me the "Process" has failed .

Even though many players are contracted for next season it is possible to move them on. Simply tell them that they will not get 1 minute on the pitch next season so look for another club and if they find one the contract can be terminated by mutual consent. You would imagine that most of them would want away from the disaster that is Port Vale, some of them might even be decent players elsewhere like Benning. Once the deadwood is cleared sack flitcroft and get someone who actually knows what they are doing in to recruit some players that can do the absolute basics and have a spine. That's what should happen, but with Carol totally under fraucrofts spell god alone knows what will happen. Almost certainly nothing good. Dark days indeed.

Flitcroft clearly one of the 32% who voted no

If Carol thinks that Flitcroft built a promotion team once and he can do it again. Well, I'd point out that that promotion came after a fifth place finish in League Two. Clarke and Crosby were an excellent manager and coach respectively who pushed the players to play at the best of their abilities. Then the confidence and connectedness of the play-off success got them to a decent point tally in League One, securing a place in the division before a drop off that, barring a short Arblaster and Devine inspired run, has continued to this day. Wembley 2022 was fantastic but it was following a fifth place finish. Four teams were better than us over the course of a 46 game regular season. The director of football didn't get us through the play-offs.

I'm not sure if you're exactly aware of this Valiiant, but this thread is indeed for the "Happy Clapper clique" - I'm fairly sure the thread title is a bit of a givaway. Also, you don't need to name us, we know who we are thanks. I think you will also find there were over 5000 fans there today, some were Happy Clappers, some weren't but they all have been "accepting utter crap" for the majority of this season and last - are those that aren't Happy Clappers also to blame (in many ways) ?

Said it here lots of times. This forum has a Happy Clapper clique, and I don't need to name them, and them constantly accepting utter crap and also patting Carol on the back along the way no matter what she does, they're as much to blame in many ways for this absolute <ovf censored> show.

The first and only thing that should be on the club's league two preparation list is giving Flitcroft his P45. Everything else is irrelevant until that's happened.

Why does Flitcroft have to be part of this. He messed up Bury. He’s now hellbent of messing up Vale