Middlesborough (H) FLC QF Match Thread 19th Dec

[Guppys left peg]

6 minutes ago, Devine intervention said:

I do not get it at all .

A quarter final a chance to keep the folk who rarely go interested in the club .

What did Vale do to keep anyone interested in attending again .

Even folk who go all the time we're coming away from the ground going what the hell was that .

That's what's really annoyed me today.in after match reflection 

Surely the players knew how important it was to play well and come of that pitch knowing they had ran harder than they ever ran .

Did you get the feeling they had ?

Didn't they come off with clean shirts ?

A disgraceful performance and damaging to the club .

Thing is was it a lack of effort or (as I think is more the case) were they trying to work to the game plan and not overcommit with the pressing in case they got picked off? Either way it didn’t work and we got beaten comfortably anyway.

[JoeB2]

A lot of random thoughts about it today.

Crosby said the players were prepared to play 'the game, and not the occassion'. It was transparent in our approach. We played an identical system and style to every league game, which hasn't been massively successful. We treated a major QF like a League 1 game, with similar levels of fight. We played passive possession football, got ourselves in all sorts of bother, and never properly ruffled any feathers.

Sometimes, you do have to play an occasion. You come out and you go aggressive. You tear up what Boro would have prepped for. You hit it into the channels and you rough them up. You press a bit higher than the philosophy dictates. You go with emotion and gut instinct and common sense.

Being clinical and analytical has its limitations when the talent gap exists. You're going to struggle to out-possession and philosophise an obviously better team who are doing similar things to yourself. You have to win on emotion, by creating a nasty atmosphere and making teams uncomfortable, by riding momentum and 'vibes'.

DC played his daughter's favourite song in the dressing room at Wembley. Players crying. They went out and delivered one of the best performances in recent PVFC history. Sometimes there is an occasion, and there are emotions, and you have to play up to it.

[EricHamesis]

“In football everything is complicated by the presence of the opposite team.” Jean Paul Sartre

[smithie]

1 hour ago, jjvale_03 said:

Still really deflated from last night. 

We're a club that's (intentionally) lost its edge. On and off the pitch. We sacked a manager who used to fight opposition players over a throw-in and replaced him with a PE teacher. The way we play is horrifically boring and unproductive. To be so arrogant to think that we can be better than all the other teams who employ this fashionable way of playing is astounding. Needless passing for the sake of passing with no ruthlessness to put the ball in the net, and no nastiness to keep it out of ours. The only player capable of playing the new 'Port Vale way' is on loan from Sheffield United and likely to be on the sidelines for some time. 

Off the pitch, the atmosphere is completely dead and Vale fans are miles away from eachother. The Lorne Street on its own silent island, the Railway still a mile from the pitch and the emptiest it's been in years and the Hamil a weird mix of Bycars-pensioners, day-tripper families, coked up teenagers and 30/40/50 somethings hoping for a reincarnation of the early 90s Bycars. On top of that, you don't see an away fan at all and any interaction between fans has disappeared. 

I think what will happen from now until the end of the season is the following: on the pitch, one step forward and two steps back under a manager clearly not cut out for the role. One win in five will continue to just keep his head above water as we slip into a relegation battle and they'll wait until it's too late before making a change. We gamble with something we worked so hard to achieve. Off the pitch, attendances will dwindle and the remaining decent fans in the Hamil will start slowly migrating back to the Railway - with many choosing to renew STs in the Stand/Paddock for 24/25. Personally, I'd like to see 300 nutters stood at the far end of the Paddock near the screen having running battles with away fans in the bottom section of the old family stand. That would signal to me that we've regained our edge as a football club. Alternatively, one of our players getting his shirt dirty in a domestic cup quarter final would've sufficed in the short run.

Some people actually bought the guff that the move was purely to enable the seamless fanzone/Hamil thing. I'd always suspected it was more about separating home and away fans, eventually leading to a sanitized family-friendly experience with no swearing, gesticulating or any other behaviours that don't fit the owners' vision of what we should be about. I'd like to hear their thoughts on how the move has gone as l suspect they'd be at odds with most people's perceptions. 

Trying to be more charitable about it, we could say they at least tried something and they should be applauded for that. But by any measure it hasn't worked - the Hamil Tussaud's is now a mishmash of statues, families and a handful of people trying to sing a bit. 

Sadly l can't see the move being reversed and it's hard to see how the current situation will attract new fans. 

[Vtid]

15 minutes ago, JoeB2 said:

A lot of random thoughts about it today.

Crosby said the players were prepared to play 'the game, and not the occassion'. It was transparent in our approach. We played an identical system and style to every league game, which hasn't been massively successful. We treated a major QF like a League 1 game, with similar levels of fight. We played passive possession football, got ourselves in all sorts of bother, and never properly ruffled any feathers.

Sometimes, you do have to play an occasion. You come out and you go aggressive. You tear up what Boro would have prepped for. You hit it into the channels and you rough them up. You press a bit higher than the philosophy dictates. You go with emotion and gut instinct and common sense.

Being clinical and analytical has its limitations when the talent gap exists. You're going to struggle to out-possession and philosophise an obviously better team who are doing similar things to yourself. You have to win on emotion, by creating a nasty atmosphere and making teams uncomfortable, by riding momentum and 'vibes'.

DC played his daughter's favourite song in the dressing room at Wembley. Players crying. They went out and delivered one of the best performances in recent PVFC history. Sometimes there is an occasion, and there are emotions, and you have to play up to it.

love this 💙

[CambridgeDon]

3 hours ago, sheffieldclayhead said:

Last night we had no fight in us.

Before the match Port Vale Legends - Sir John, Grewie, Bernie and Ray the stalwarts of the greatest era in Port Vales history who would run through brick walls in a Vale shirt watched that inept lacklustre display. What must they have thought.

If a manager can’t motivate and players get motivated for an historic night like that then they should not be at the club.

Never mind Boro are a league above I would have not been bothered to lose 0-5 if we had just had a go at them. Once they were gifted the 2nd then it was all over.

Even Boomer had his head in his hands on the corner flag at the Hamil end.

Very disappointed in last nights display. Since my first visit in 84 I’ve never expected to win every match and be Premier league. I have expected fight, determination and belief none was on show last night.

Move onto Saturday and go again as they say.

 

 

 

And it wasn’t just the former players - or Boomer - who had their heads in their hands. During the second half the coverage focussed on Kevin and Sir John sitting together in the Directors’ box. They looked totally grim, completely stony-faced at what they were watching. And who could blame them - for the second time in a week watching Crosby tip potential six-figure earnings into the cut.

Then the camera panned onto Crosby who looked totally clueless and desperate, flailing his arms about and yelling for all he was worth in a vain attempt to motivate his players. He looked completely out of his depth. 

Last Saturday we had our best performance for a while and Crosby needs to build on this against Wycombe because judging by the reaction of the top brass they’re not enjoying what they’re seeing. Perhaps he’s not as secure as it appears. 

[Soul Intent]

Still really deflated from last night. 
We're a club that's (intentionally) lost its edge. On and off the pitch. We sacked a manager who used to fight opposition players over a throw-in and replaced him with a PE teacher. The way we play is horrifically boring and unproductive. To be so arrogant to think that we can be better than all the other teams who employ this fashionable way of playing is astounding. Needless passing for the sake of passing with no ruthlessness to put the ball in the net, and no nastiness to keep it out of ours. The only player capable of playing the new 'Port Vale way' is on loan from Sheffield United and likely to be on the sidelines for some time. 
Off the pitch, the atmosphere is completely dead and Vale fans are miles away from eachother. The Lorne Street on its own silent island, the Railway still a mile from the pitch and the emptiest it's been in years and the Hamil a weird mix of Bycars-pensioners, day-tripper families, coked up teenagers and 30/40/50 somethings hoping for a reincarnation of the early 90s Bycars. On top of that, you don't see an away fan at all and any interaction between fans has disappeared. 
I think what will happen from now until the end of the season is the following: on the pitch, one step forward and two steps back under a manager clearly not cut out for the role. One win in five will continue to just keep his head above water as we slip into a relegation battle and they'll wait until it's too late before making a change. We gamble with something we worked so hard to achieve. Off the pitch, attendances will dwindle and the remaining decent fans in the Hamil will start slowly migrating back to the Railway - with many choosing to renew STs in the Stand/Paddock for 24/25. Personally, I'd like to see 300 nutters stood at the far end of the Paddock near the screen having running battles with away fans in the bottom section of the old family stand. That would signal to me that we've regained our edge as a football club. Alternatively, one of our players getting his shirt dirty in a domestic cup quarter final would've sufficed in the short run.

Yep, this was inevitable sadly. There needs to be some away/home fan interaction at Vale to get a decent atmosphere on a regular basis, so I'm hoping people will move back to the Railway to get that back, otherwise we're stuck with a graveyard atmosphere

Sent from my RMX2063 using onevalefan mobile app

[werstayinup]

3 hours ago, Guppys left peg said:

I can’t sit here and say you’re wrong in anything you’ve said there. I guess though to me just looking at what will happen rather than should I genuinely think the board believe he’s doing a good job in what they’ve asked from him which is change the style of play, promote youth and for now at least moderately higher than where we finished. Whether many would agree with that thinking is another matter.

With that said as I say I’m more coming across to the line of thinking in your post. A part of football management and probably the most important is adapting to different things situationally even if it goes against your “principles”. We are the definition of a one trick pony and it was either a hint of arrogance or delusion to think we could Crozball our way to victory against an admittedly really good team.

That's all fair enough mate and as i said it's taken me up until last night to think the way i posted

I agree with those saying how poor the atmosphere was last night but again it's been like that for a while now,even getting out sung by a couple of hundred away fans at times,i do in some part put that down to dire football on show at times,when we went at wigan the atmosphere was good until it went to 2-2 then it went flat again until we scored

[JohnDoe]

I don’t understands why people think the stand swap is the issue. We still have the paddock available perpendicular to a stand where the away fans go, and one where the home fans can go. Fans can still choose to go to the paddock (well you can’t currently due to the toilets fiasco but you get my meaning) and have banter with the away fans. Fans just need to choose to go there. It doesn’t need stand swaps. And I say this as someone who grew up going in the bycars and seeing away fans in there not feeling right. 

[Paul6754]

5 hours ago, Valiiant said:

 

Nah. We were rubbish, and Crosby got his tactics completely wrong. Nobody will deny they aren't a better side but it was a great time to be playing them and we absolutely stunk the place out. 

And they were the better side on the night, better players and better prepared for what Vale had to offer.

 

[Family Stand Terrier]

3 hours ago, tommytunstall said:

In my opinion support is generated by the on field performance, hence why it was like a graveyard 

A lot of Vale fans agree, clearly. Personally think it doesn't have to be exclusively just the team to get the fans going. Some clubs their support is the 12th man. Not at Vale it would seem.

[Family Stand Terrier]

3 hours ago, Guitar Ray said:

Our support is usually good.  In fairness there were literally thousands of day trippers there, all ready for an epic giant killing.  We sat in our usual seats in the Hamil and most folks around us barely sang even during those first 10 minutes.  Unfortunately from then on the script was ripped up as ‘Boro took the lead and the timing of the goals basically killed it stone dead.

I do agree, Boro played the perfect away performance in that aspect. At the times I mentioned though, after the 1st with all the corners, silence. After Masseys chance, silence. Start of the 2nd half, silence. Really disappointed. 

[Family Stand Terrier]

3 hours ago, Guppys left peg said:

That early goal just completely knocked the stuffing out of players and fans as a collective to be honest.

I didn’t have the best feeling about the whole thing though from about 2 minutes in I’d seen some chap in the block to my left on the Hamil get a bit of a pasting in an argument I believe over seating. The people who did it got removed but that put a downer on things for me early on.

In hindsight though I do want to thank everyone who left early. Made it really easy get off Synectics car park at the end of the game so every cloud has a silver lining 😂

I was to the left of that incident, couldn't see anything though with everyone standing to take a look. Stewards next to me were told, the guy just said, nothing we can do.

[Jacko51]

Loads of folks on here complained about the price of tickets then buggered off ages from the end. Can’t understand some folk. 

[smithie]

8 minutes ago, Family Stand Terrier said:

A lot of Vale fans agree, clearly. Personally think it doesn't have to be exclusively just the team to get the fans going. Some clubs their support is the 12th man. Not at Vale it would seem.

I think that's true of Pompey, Exeter and the Gas but apart from those I can't think of many others in our division. It's worth remembering that mid-table football at any level is hard to get excited about - sometimes a relegation battle is more exciting than safety (not saying I want ne of course!).