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Ally Simcock defects from Labour to The Tories?


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Without wishing to take sides, what Ally has done is no different to what many previously staunch Labour voters in the city did at the last election.  That said, I firmly believe that as an elected re

As it stands, as a councillor, I may, as you correctly point out, vote against my party if I feel it goes against the interests of my constituents.  I don't need to switch my party allegiances to do t

She signed up to represent Labour and the policies they had. If she wanted to be on the council as an individual, she had that choice. So no you are wrong. Resign then put the seat up for re election.

21 hours ago, Smallthorne Dog said:

 

If true she has lost all respect from me, and I'm sure plenty of others. For someone who was the daughter of a striking miner that is some serious treachery.

 

She’s only a Councillor so who gives a <ovf censored>?

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9 hours ago, JRC said:

Legally is 100% true. Reflects a general lack of interest in the UK if people are only voting based on the personality of the PM. For the most parts politicians below MPs live in the local community so its not that hard to find out what they are like as people. The problem is a lot of people turn even local elections into a referendum on the Prime Minister in power at that particular time. What people should be doing is finding out who the best people are to deal with local issues. Ironically the competence and integrity of a politician is probably more important at a local than national level. A bog standard MP has little influence on policy whereas a Councillor  has far more influence on local spending decisions.

This doesn’t answer your original point. The fact is that normally voters tend to vote for a political ideology over a personality.  In this case Ally Simcock has changed her stance, and should therefore resign from her position on the council and allow her constituents to decide whether, or not, her views still represent those shared by the majority of voters in her ward.

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1 hour ago, Guitar Ray said:

This doesn’t answer your original point. The fact is that normally voters tend to vote for a political ideology over a personality.  In this case Ally Simcock has changed her stance, and should therefore resign from her position on the council and allow her constituents to decide whether, or not, her views still represent those shared by the majority of voters in her ward.

You may vote for an ideology many of us vote for the person we believe best suited to manage the entity we are electing them to run. I very much doubt she has changed ideology. I know no more about the woman than has been posted on here but I would guess her views are probably quite close to the centre. For democracy to function properly it needs citizens to actively engage in making decisions over governs them. 

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On 29/08/2020 at 09:25, Iron Curtain said:

This is a bit like the fact that tomatoes are a fruit.

It may be a fact but in reality it’s widely accepted that it just doesn’t work like that and I would suggest the vast majority of people that voted her in did so in the basis that she represented the labour values.

After all... Knowledge is knowing that a tomato is a fruit... wisdom is not putting one in a fruit salad.

Yes,but sometimes there are sour grapes?

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10 hours ago, Smallthorne Dog said:
14 hours ago, philpvfc said:
She’s only a Councillor so who gives a ?

Most people who care about the democratic process?

Agree if she was an MP but does it really matter when they are a councillor?. If it was the other way round you wouldn’t bat an eye lid, it’s only because of your hate for the Tory party. 

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Agree if she was an MP but does it really matter when they are a councillor?. If it was the other way round you wouldn’t bat an eye lid, it’s only because of your hate for the Tory party. 
Not true. Well the bit about hating the Tory party is , but I believe if you are elected representing a particular party and it's values and ideology, you shouldn't simply be able to switch sides. It's undemocratic. Any defection to another party should automatically trigger a bi-election. I'd be saying that even if it was the other way round.
I'm more incredulous about her having been quite vocal on social media regarding inequalities created by the Tories, and her historic links to the miners strike for her to then go and join the very party responsible for all her previous angst.

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8 hours ago, JRC said:

You may vote for an ideology many of us vote for the person we believe best suited to manage the entity we are electing them to run. I very much doubt she has changed ideology. I know no more about the woman than has been posted on here but I would guess her views are probably quite close to the centre. For democracy to function properly it needs citizens to actively engage in making decisions over governs them. 

It’s politics though, be it local or national. Are you suggesting voters pay no regard to a candidates political views and their party manifesto? If this is the case why is the SNP so strong in Scotland.  It’s because the voters up there predominantly agree with the political views expressed by the party and it’s members.  Naturally they then expect those views to transfer into the decision making process.

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2 hours ago, Guitar Ray said:

It’s politics though, be it local or national. Are you suggesting voters pay no regard to a candidates political views and their party manifesto? If this is the case why is the SNP so strong in Scotland.  It’s because the voters up there predominantly agree with the political views expressed by the party and it’s members.  Naturally they then expect those views to transfer into the decision making process.

I'm not suggesting some voters don't vote purely on the grounds of party allegiance. Our electoral system was set up before there were parties, so the process legally has nothing to do with political allegiance. I would suggest that more (many already do) consider what candidates offer to the local community before putting their cross on the ballot paper. I've quite frequently voted for 3 different parties candidates (National, Parish, Borough and County elections). I've always, at least in part, considered carefully what I know about the candidate. I have never voted for someone I have reason to believe is incompetent or dishonest.

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6 hours ago, Smallthorne Dog said:

Not true. Well the bit about hating the Tory party is emoji1.png, but I believe if you are elected representing a particular party and it's values and ideology, you shouldn't simply be able to switch sides. It's undemocratic. Any defection to another party should automatically trigger a bi-election. I'd be saying that even if it was the other way round.
I'm more incredulous about her having been quite vocal on social media regarding inequalities created by the Tories, and her historic links to the miners strike for her to then go and join the very party responsible for all her previous angst.

I would agree with you if she was an MP. The switching of parties by MPs especially around the Brexit period was a joke but in all honesty it doesn’t really matter too much what party a councillor is on, they all tend to be crap and crooked. I tend to vote on the person when it comes to councillors and by the party when it comes to general elections , I’m sure I’m not the only one but I do see your argument.

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8 hours ago, JRC said:

I'm not suggesting some voters don't vote purely on the grounds of party allegiance. Our electoral system was set up before there were parties, so the process legally has nothing to do with political allegiance. I would suggest that more (many already do) consider what candidates offer to the local community before putting their cross on the ballot paper. I've quite frequently voted for 3 different parties candidates (National, Parish, Borough and County elections). I've always, at least in part, considered carefully what I know about the candidate. I have never voted for someone I have reason to believe is incompetent or dishonest.

Even if, as you suggest, more voters, which is debatable, "consider what candidates offer to the local community", the fact is that some voters will have based their decision weighted more towards which political party said candidate represents, and quite possibly may have cast their vote based entirely on the party rather than the candidates other credentials, which are usually no more than sketchy details on an A4 flyer.  For this reason any standing councillor, or MP, who switches sides, as is the case in this topic, can no longer be said to represent all of the voters who elected them into the position they hold.  They should, therefore, stand down and a new bi-election be held to test whether their decision to switch is backed by a majority of voters.  Anything less is undemocratic.

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3 hours ago, Guitar Ray said:

Even if, as you suggest, more voters, which is debatable, "consider what candidates offer to the local community", the fact is that some voters will have based their decision weighted more towards which political party said candidate represents, and quite possibly may have cast their vote based entirely on the party rather than the candidates other credentials, which are usually no more than sketchy details on an A4 flyer.  For this reason any standing councillor, or MP, who switches sides, as is the case in this topic, can no longer be said to represent all of the voters who elected them into the position they hold.  They should, therefore, stand down and a new bi-election be held to test whether their decision to switch is backed by a majority of voters.  Anything less is undemocratic.

So we have to go through a bielection because some people are too lazy to find out the basis on which English democracy is founded. No elected representative is voted by all the electorate once selected they are expected to serve as the representative of all the electorate for a specific term.

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6 hours ago, JRC said:

So we have to go through a bielection because some people are too lazy to find out the basis on which English democracy is founded. No elected representative is voted by all the electorate once selected they are expected to serve as the representative of all the electorate for a specific term.

People being “lazy”? 
Nobody suggested an elected representative is voted for by all the electorate, rather that many of those that did vote for that individual will have done so based purely on their political allegiance and would quite reasonably expect that their elected representative wouldn’t be swapping and changing political parties during their term in office 

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