LABOUR learning lessons?

[Bycarsbill]

Agreed

 

 

 

It's already happened with hearing services (Specsavers now looks after all NHS patients). All opticians are now privately run and most dentists have now opted out of the NHS and in every one of these cases customer service has improved. It's not privatisation by the back door as public service unions keep banging on about--it's about a better service for the end users!

 

I don't claim that private companies aren't or won't be used to provide services but that's an awfuil long way from them taking over the NHS

[Birdy]

A better service, of course it is you're paying for it twice through taxation and at the counter!

[JOHNNYAITCH]

Who pays for NHS services twice (thru taxation and at the counter)? Prescription charges have been around since early 50s (labour proposed them I think) but most in the UK don't pay them

 

People who have private insureance pay twice..once so that they and other people can use the NHS free at the point of need and again for their

own private services. Millions pay for NHS services for others to use which they themselves rarely use..and rightly so

[mr.hobblesworth]

Who pays for NHS services twice (thru taxation and at the counter)? Prescription charges have been around since early 50s (labour proposed them I think) but most in the UK don't pay them

 

 

Really?

[carl]

Who pays for NHS services twice (thru taxation and at the counter)? Prescription charges have been around since early 50s (labour proposed them I think) but most in the UK don't pay them

 

People who have private insureance pay twice..once so that they and other people can use the NHS free at the point of need and again for their

own private services. Millions pay for NHS services for others to use which they themselves rarely use..and rightly so

 

Absolute rubbish. Most people earning over £15,000 have to pay- it is one of the reasons that defeats the object of being in lower paid employment- do you honestly think that people dont think about this when they consider taking poorly paid employment??

[Birdy]

Who pays for NHS services twice (thru taxation and at the counter)? Prescription charges have been around since early 50s (labour proposed them I think) but most in the UK don't pay them

 

People who have private insureance pay twice..once so that they and other people can use the NHS free at the point of need and again for their

own private services. Millions pay for NHS services for others to use which they themselves rarely use..and rightly so

Some chose to pay to go private (which is up to them), most cannot afford so. We all have to pay twice (should you want to have treatment that is) in certain areas of the NHS which will only become the norm in other areas.

 

I understand it is an ideological opinion but as stated above back bone public services (not industries as you suggested) should remain in public ownership.so that they remain a service first and foremost. I also understand that some don't mind the private sector becoming involved but we will be heading back to the pre-war era over a generation if these policies are followed up.

 

An emotional and thought provoking speech should you fancy a listen:

http://news.sky.com/story/1341399/mps-sob-at-keep-your-mitts-off-my-nhs-speech

[andy jones]

Labour are not Labour IMHO.

[Birdy]

Labour are not Labour IMHO.

You are right they are Tory albeit low fat.

[Bea Smith]

Channel 4 is saying that Ed actually forgot part of his speech today (the parts on the deficit and immigration). Not forgot as in stuttering over a few lines and having to refer back to his notes, but forgot as in totally forgot to read those bits out. That's not going to help matters!

 

I wish he'd opt out of these tedious games that party leaders are supposed to play nowadays, all this "I met someone today" and that pointy finger thing. HE should just sit there staring at Cameron and Clegg and Hague and IDS and all those other ****ers with utter and open contempt, regularly pointing out what they are doing for the sake of their private shareholders rather than in the public interest, and not holding back on constantly taking them to account and just calling them a bunch of ludicrous, immoral ****wits.

 

The problem is that he would then come across as mindless, unthinking, uncompromising, one-dimensional, ignorant, hypocritical, babbling halfwit like you do on here. I think he is a bit better than that, and we should all be thankful he won't take your carefully considered advice.

[JOHNNYAITCH]

Some chose to pay to go private (which is up to them), most cannot afford so.

 

I am well aware of that.My point was they and others readily pay into the NHS for others to have rteatement

 

We all have to pay twice (should you want to have treatment that is) in certain areas of the NHS which will only become the norm in other areas.

 

Can you highlight some of these areas please? I acknowledge dentistry but there are massively significant exemptions and dental charges have been around since the 1950s so are not new. Not sure when eye test charges started but again there are many exemptions and then there are charges for wigs which I am aware are charged for in some cases. Not sure what else is charged for 'at the counter'.

 

I understand it is an ideological opinion but as stated above back bone public services (not industries as you suggested) should remain in public ownership.so that they remain a service first and foremost.

 

You'll not be surprised that I don't agree that has to happen. It's all about how privatisation is done..it's not been done well in the past except in a few cases

 

I also understand that some don't mind the private sector becoming involved but we will be heading back to the pre-war era over a generation if these policies are followed up.

 

I don't believe so..people are much better informed, savvy and involved these days to allow thinmgs to go too far. I don't for example belive that core NHS GP and hospital servcies wil be privatised..people are far to aware of what is happening these days

 

An emotional and thought provoking speech should you fancy a listen:

http://news.sky.com/story/1341399/mps-sob-at-keep-your-mitts-off-my-nhs-speech

 

Just reinforces why I don't belive the people of the Uk will allow the privatisation that you fear (and which i don't want either)

[JOHNNYAITCH]

The problem is that he would then come across as mindless, unthinking, uncompromising, one-dimensional, ignorant, hypocritical, babbling halfwit like you do on here. I think he is a bit better than that, and we should all be thankful he won't take your carefully considered advice.

 

It should have occurred to him though that he hadn't mentioned the defecit, immigration and so on..I find it odd not that he forgot those sections of his speech, we're all human after all, but that he didn't at some point think "Hang on I haven't mentioned these massive issues of ummigration and the defecit...what was I going to say about them?"

 

As for the style of the speech..such an aproach is wonderful when it goes well..and it didn't. He wasn't making it up on the hoof, it was a carefully prepared speech with much preparation beforehand and due to how he chose to present it he messed up pretty badly..which is unfortunate as we need Labour to be presenting strong ideas in a confident persuasive manner.

 

I'll leave the Hobnobster to respond to comments on him

[mr.hobblesworth]

I'll leave the Hobnobster to respond to comments on him

 

Nah. Just like the sizzled schnauzers, I'm not biting.

[Warren]

It is always with some regret that its accepted that the capitalist economic system is the only one that works. But it has loads of problems, not least that it is inherently cyclical. There must be bust and renewal to bring about boom which declines to bust again. So it is that the capitalist system is tolerated provided it serves the social and economic needs of the community and regulated to avoid excesses that are seen as against these interests. Enter the politicians.

[andy jones]

The only privatised railway that might work would be to 're-introduce the pre-British Railways version of privatisation where the companies (GWR LMS etc actually owned the rails their trains ran on. The current system which requires tax payer subsidies way above pre-privatisation days is quietly accepted by this so called Labour Party.

[Birdy]

The only privatised railway that might work would be to 're-introduce the pre-British Railways version of privatisation where the companies (GWR LMS etc actually owned the rails their trains ran on. The current system which requires tax payer subsidies way above pre-privatisation days is quietly accepted by this so called Labour Party.

 

There have been billions more in subsidies not only to Network Rail but all the fragmented companies as well than there ever was under nationalisation.

 

Capitalism in its current guise is the only option for world order because those who run it, personally benefit from it so why would they change it? If you look at the western democracies those in broader power are deeply connected with industries, BigCorp and the powerful. No one wants North Korea style communism but I think a fairer version of capitalism that benefits all is something we should all be looking for.