Brexit again...

[Davebrad]

There’s a good reason why Roosevelt didn’t include CDG in any post war talks. He was dead.

 

in 1943 when Churchill and Roosevelt met at Casablanca, they invited him to attend, he was very upset because he thought he should have been a automatic choice...

On 23/10/44 he was officially recognised as head of the French govt. but as a bit player he was not invited for the big 3 meeting of Churchill, Roosevelt and Stalin at Yalta and Potsdam, to discuse post war matters...

He was not a happy bunny!, and so when Britain applied to join EEC he vetoes us twice, and complained about the US involvement in Vietnam after france had been beaten there, and that the dollar was the top world currency...Russia he had no effect, so he had a long memory.

[philpvfc]

You cannot say a country with a good GDP is a stable economy, Libya has a GDP over 50% but I wouldn’t say that was a stable economy. The Eastern European countries are fairing far better than countries like Germany, UK and France.

 

If you are going to judge how well a country is doing by their GDP you must surely agree we are far better removing ourselves from the EU because it fairs very poorly against smaller emerging markets.

 

https://www.gfmag.com/global-data/economic-data/countries-highest-gdp-growth-2017

[Erniemossrules]

Labour deciding on a customs union supported by Remainer Tory MPs. This could see either May ousted or another general election.

 

How is Comrade Corbyn going to persuade the EU to accept his proposals.If we are in the customs union we will have to accept their rules and be unable to negotiate deals with other countries for trade.

We will be outside the EU with no say on trade and still be expected to contribute billions to prop up the EU budget.

The best deal would be same as Turkey who have free trade with the EU and don't contribute any money.

In fact they receive payments from the EU.

[Santa]

Your point?

Self evident in the context of yours.

[philpvfc]

Self evident in the context of yours.

 

Wasn’t being funny.

[Jacko51]

 

The fundamental fact of the whole brexit vote is you need a pretty up to date knowledge of international economic law to really understand the implications for the UK. Not many people know that in great detail - which is why so many lies were published throughout the build up to the referendum. Which were interpretted by people as the truth.

 

Exactly. Which is why we should never have had the bloody Referendum in the first place.

[Regal Beagle]

So you don’t oppose my opinions. Ok, that’s fine.

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

Only just seen this

 

You've abandoned the definition you posted now? Attacking is merely disagreeing with an opinion?

 

If you are right then isn't every person in this thread (and every other thread on this site) likely to be an attacker? Am I more of an attacker than you, despite us disagreeing with each other?

[Regal Beagle]

A miss? It's a fact mate. Categorically and the polls can prove it.

 

Various polls prove it. A recent being British Social Attitudes who identify 75% of leave voters being immigration.

 

Well, when May became home sec in 2011 she promised to curb immigration and since then we've had more immigration than ever before. So if you voted leave and put it in the hands of people who've actively encouraged immigration to suppress wage growth then more fool you.

 

The fundamental fact of the whole brexit vote is you need a pretty up to date knowledge of international economic law to really understand the implications for the UK. Not many people know that in great detail - which is why so many lies were published throughout the build up to the referendum. Which were interpretted by people as the truth.

 

I bet you any money on this planet, had the real facts and implications of leaving the single market being disclosed (more so than leaving the EU) and people realise the price of their daily products will increase, no one would ever vote for it. People say "Germany need our car business" - about 90% of cars on British roads are on financex, owned by massive companies, not the person. I've been to Germany and the consensus there is we don't even pay for our cars anyway, so an additional cost will be eaten up by more debt from British consumers. Just means they make the same or even more, but no benefit it the British people - just a bigger finance deal! And why wouldn't they do it? If your prepared to take a £15/20k finance deal on a new car, you'll take a £17/22k finance deal won't you!

 

Well firstly, you claimed that there is one reason people voted for brexit (immigration) and anyone who said otherwise is clueless. You are quite clearly wrong.

 

You've proven yourself wrong by using a poll result stating 75% of people voted for brexit because of immigration. What about the 25%? That's a significant number. Your effectively trying to say that if I acknowledge your evidence that 4.35 million people voted for brexit for reasons other than immigration, then I'm clueless?

 

If you are trying to say that immigration was the main reason, yes I don't think anyone would disagree with you. But that isn't what you said.

[Santa]

The worrying statistic there in the UK figure is post-brexit the UK could become a tax haven for big business

This is exactly what the ERG (a party within a party, the Militant Tendency of the right) and think tanks like Legatum are pushing for.

[Regal Beagle]

This is exactly what the ERG (a party within a party, the Militant Tendency of the right) and think tanks like Legatum are pushing for.

 

And exactly why Brexit is a huge win for everyone.

 

It doesn't stop the day we come out. It means that we actually have a say on the country we want now. We're not a European franchise anymore.

 

If Labour want to increase corporation tax and the Tories want to become a tax haven for big businesses, then lets go to the polls in the next general election and exercise our democratic rights.

 

There's a common trend recently of people using an end of the world argument in politics as if it is all permanent, brexit is the exact opposite of that.

[Santa]

If Labour want to increase corporation tax and the Tories want to become a tax haven for big businesses, then lets go to the polls in the next general election and exercise our democratic rights.

How does the EU prevent this from happening currently?

[philpvfc]

How does the EU prevent this from happening currently?

 

Ask Switzerland what was the biggest reason they didn’t join the EU in the first place.

 

I don’t think we will be a tax haven but I think we need to be very attractive for big businesses to come to the UK to compete with the EU and other markets, is that a bad thing?

[Santa]

Ireland already sets a low level of corporation tax while being a member state.

[Thevalefan]

And exactly why Brexit is a huge win for everyone.

 

It doesn't stop the day we come out. It means that we actually have a say on the country we want now. We're not a European franchise anymore.

 

If Labour want to increase corporation tax and the Tories want to become a tax haven for big businesses, then lets go to the polls in the next general election and exercise our democratic rights.

 

There's a common trend recently of people using an end of the world argument in politics as if it is all permanent, brexit is the exact opposite of that.

 

A huge win? We are a country operating a feudal system still with Lords of the Realm, Dukes, Barons, Kings and Queens - as the common man we are literally at the bottom of the pile. If you look right throughout British history then you'll realise as indigenous people to this island we've been treated abysmally by our own establishment for as long as the history books can record. So why you think we are suddenly going to run the place and call all the shots, I do not know. Do you really think our Governments going to let the British people vote on our fiscal policies, our economic laws etc? Of course not, because we didn't join the boys club at the elitist Eton school paying 100's of thousands on our educations did we! Those kind of schools, and just look at how privileged almost every member of the Tory party is, are the emphasis of my point.

 

Brexit is just a massive cost to the UK. The legal costs will be astronomical, getting it implemented into different kinds of business will threaten many financially as the reality is cash-flows just are not there in general to support re-training, educating and mobilising people within our new trade agreements, the Govt won't subsidise it because all we get is austerity... because in 2016 we had a national debt of 88% of our GDP... not to mention personal debts of UK citizens currently around £12,000 PER PERSON, before you've even got a mortgage! The cost of living IS and WILL continue to increase, while wage growth remains terrible... in fact, we are predicted to have the lowest wage growth on the OECD wage growth index.

 

Within the EU we are an attractive market to join, outside of it we basically create new competition against 27 other member states... who collectively can offer a much better deal we can, inside a much bigger market with millions and millions more consumers (a lot within growing economies too) to sell products and services too.

 

I genuinely hope I am wrong, but logic suggests it's going to be a disaster. In fact, I'm sure it will be. We've already lost our AAA rating, the pounds been damaged significantly and almost any economic expert's (the peoples opinions who count a lot more than ours) forecast no real value-adding benefit of leaving. We should have held the EU ransom and gained support of other countries to reform. We pay, call it £10bn (it's less than that) to be part of a market that gives our economy £240bn worth of value in it's exporting. The ironic thing about Brexit is, we probably have the best deal.

 

Without a new trade agreement, (DO you Brexiteers even know what trade-relationships you want, if the EU deal was so bad?) relative trade barriers will change such that trade with the EU will become relatively more expensive, resulting in trade diversion away from the EU and trade creation with the non-EU world. The balance between these developments will most likely be trade- and welfare-reducing, as trade barriers between the UK and the EU – the largest trading block in the world – increase.

 

We can agree to disagree, but without actually backing up any of your statements with what you're thinking it gives the impression you just assume rather than reason anything mate!

[Hagrid]

22 pages of discussion.

 

Brexit is very very silly.

 

Close the thread.