The club they deserve?

[Timothius]

You say that like it's unlikely but I would guess over half of our fans do just go for the footy. I would guess that Vale fans that do just go for the football do not even frequent this site.

 

I had that thrown at me also yesterday, "i only come to watch the team". My simple response is "who will you go and watch if we go bust"?

[valiantms]

As with any protests, at some point frustrations may make people react in a way that is out of character or not what's really needed. On the whole protests have been peaceful, a fact backed up by The Police, stewards and Bill Lodey who is responsible for ground safety. Yesterday even whilst this altercation was being sorted, a woman thought it neccesary to start having a go and blame protesters saying "there are f****** kids present", the irony was lost on her!

 

That is sadly brilliant :D

[Birdy]

To me it's about personal accountability which is not exclusive to this football club.

 

In life you must invest time and effort be it in a personal relationship, career, family and friends relationships and the wider community in which you live. If you do never invest in the above achieving a content sense of well being, satisfaction and success will be difficult in life.

 

I understand the comment and also realise that many may find it hard to grasp especially the people who only want to watch the football but it is frustrating to see people watch their club die. Would you do this to your career, relationship or happiness without fighting for it?

 

Communities and individuals who have a sense of involvement and empowerment tend to be happier and achieve a great deal more. This empowerment is also let prevalent in lower economical-social groups and they feel powerless to take on the powers that be. Make of that what you will but we have seen many struggles in football ownership over the years and I wonder if Port Vale were ever that chosen club to be franchised to Milton Keynes, would you fight for it or just go to watch the football?

[SuperValiant1876]

I had that thrown at me also yesterday, "i only come to watch the team". My simple response is "who will you go and watch if we go bust"?

 

 

I think you struggle to comprehend that some people really do go just for football. If we go bust they will go and watch someone else.

 

You only have to look at Stokes attendances now they are in the Prem. Do you think if Stoke were on the brink of going bust any of their new fans that have appeared since they were promoted would stand and fight for their club?

[FAMILY STAND ROWDY]

ive been saying for some time vale fans are getting the team we deserve,due to the people at the top the team is starved of investment,we need 5/6 new faces in very department.but this isnt going to happen while lloyd and co cling onto power,until vale fans wake up and try to do domething about it then "we are where we are".as for saying you go to relax it just depresses me nothing relaxing in watching 11 pros argue over a corner the hit ti to there defender

[Timothius]

I think you struggle to comprehend that some people really do go just for football. If we go bust they will go and watch someone else.

 

You only have to look at Stokes attendances now they are in the Prem. Do you think if Stoke were on the brink of going bust any of their new fans that have appeared since they were promoted would stand and fight for their club?

 

Some of these fans I have seen at Vale going back 40 years, they are Vale fans and like me wouldn't start to go and watch anyone else

[SuperValiant1876]

Whether you stay after and protest or you just go home should be irrelevant to what sort of club you deserve. If you have paid your money then you deserve just as good a club as the next football fan. Most other football fans are only expected to commit themselves financially but at Vale even when you pay your way but then go home, that is not enough for some.

[NLVMalc]

Even so nobody deserves a club they love to be wound up.

 

You are right no Vale fan deserves the club they support to be wound up. If it happens though it is the responsibility of:

Lloyd

Oliver

Miller

Deakin

Bratt

Jackson

Meigh

 

They are the ones who have brought us to the position we are at today.

 

They are the ones who turned down investment opportunity after investment opportunity, including the last one of £1.2m of REAL MONEY.

 

They are the ones who issued £500,000 worth of nil-paid shares.

 

It was under their watch that Peter Miller was appointed as chairman with a remuneration package of around £170,000.

 

It was under their watch that Peter Miller remortgaged the ground to probably pay for his own shares and Deakins.

 

You are right no fan deserves their club to go into administration.

 

Personally if the choice is admin or any of the above directors being anywhere near our club then I would choose administration. They simply can't be trusted.

 

To have any prospect of avoiding admin the directors need to allow a smooth transition of power through an interim board. This must be done via the Supporters Club.

 

The resolution of the current situation can either be done the easy way, or the hard way. The decision is the directors.

 

That is: Administration or smooth transition of power.

[Valiant62]

To me it's about personal accountability which is not exclusive to this football club.

 

In life you must invest time and effort be it in a personal relationship, career, family and friends relationships and the wider community in which you live. If you do never invest in the above achieving a content sense of well being, satisfaction and success will be difficult in life.

 

I understand the comment and also realise that many may find it hard to grasp especially the people who only want to watch the football but it is frustrating to see people watch their club die. Would you do this to your career, relationship or happiness without fighting for it?

 

Communities and individuals who have a sense of involvement and empowerment tend to be happier and achieve a great deal more. This empowerment is also let prevalent in lower economical-social groups and they feel powerless to take on the powers that be. Make of that what you will but we have seen many struggles in football ownership over the years and I wonder if Port Vale were ever that chosen club to be franchised to Milton Keynes, would you fight for it or just go to watch the football?

 

I personally would focus on the very first line of this post and comment that my sense of personal responsibility is not exclusive to Vale. Vale is (at least potentially) an important community resource, a community "of interest" itself and I do feel a sense of responsibility to it...... but that's limited! I also have three children, a partner and a very frail and getting frailer mother to whom I have responsibilities. I also am a community worker in an area of deprivation dealing with people's deaths on a daily basis. I'm making all that sound perhaps more dramatic than it really is but the point is that it's quite legitimate for most people to put their responsibilities to the institution or community that is Port Vale somewhere down the pecking order of other responsibilities and with respect, it isn't really for anyone on here to be needing the details of that or feeling entitled to pass judgement on how anyone prioritise what they put their energies into.

[Family Stand Terrier]

I can relate to a number of viewpoints here. Growing up I always went the Vale with my Dad. We went the game, enjoyed it and returned week after week. Whilst I was fortunate enough to grow up watching the Vale through the best years of their existance to date, there were times when times weren't so sweet. I remember the protests against Bell, a night match against Crystal Palace spring to mind. My old man loves the Vale, but I just couldn't see him being the protesting type.

 

I share peoples frustrations at the moment, and nothing disappoints me more than to be so pi**ed off about the current goings on, read so much anger on here and when talking to friends, only to see 40 or so people protesting after thousands held up red cards.

 

To counter all of that I suppose I grew up watching the Vale at a different time when the Internet was in its infancy. Information was therefore only available to a small number of people.

 

Its a tricky one because emotions run high, people a frustrated and looking at who to pin the blame on. At times like that statements such as, "they'll get the club they deserve" are thrown at people. Knowing what I know now about the club and watching all of the ***** that is going on makes so mad its untrue, and at times I totally agree that people will get the club they deserve. Then other times I think of the bloke with a young family just taking their young un to watch the football, completely ignorant of whats going on at the club. If statements like they'll get the club they deserve are aimed at those sorts then I think its harsh.

 

The people who will get the club they deserve are those who, in the face of all the facts we now know, despite; the lies, the misleading fans, the poor performance, the lack of investment etc etc, still support V2001. Thats not me slating people because they have a different opinion to me, thats me making the point that Bill Bratt and V2001 completely lacked ambition, had no vision for the club, lost the club money, turned away investment etc etc all because they wanted to keep Vale a small time tinpot club....we are now a small time tinpot club, therefore, if you support Bratt you quite clearly have the club that you deserve, as it is the club that you have desired.

[Birdy]

I personally would focus on the very first line of this post and comment that my sense of personal responsibility is not exclusive to Vale. Vale is (at least potentially) an important community resource, a community "of interest" itself and I do feel a sense of responsibility to it...... but that's limited! I also have three children, a partner and a very frail and getting frailer mother to whom I have responsibilities. I also am a community worker in an area of deprivation dealing with people's deaths on a daily basis. I'm making all that sound perhaps more dramatic than it really is but the point is that it's quite legitimate for most people to put their responsibilities to the institution or community that is Port Vale somewhere down the pecking order of other responsibilities and with respect, it isn't really for anyone on here to be needing the details of that or feeling entitled to pass judgement on how anyone prioritise what they put their energies into.

 

It's not about judgement, it's about being bothered and motivated to make a difference.

 

To hold a card up or spend ten minutes before or after a game is hardly time or finance consuming. It takes less than half a pints worth after all we come from all over to watch the game for two hours plus traveling, is ten minutes that much to ask?

 

I too have a wife, kids, career, ageing relatives and other voluntary responsibilities but I am active in all aspects of my life including Vale.

[rex]

Whether you stay after and protest or you just go home should be irrelevant to what sort of club you deserve. If you have paid your money then you deserve just as good a club as the next football fan. Most other football fans are only expected to commit themselves financially but at Vale even when you pay your way but then go home, that is not enough for some.

 

I completely agree! I don't usually comment on off the field matters on this site, but I don't understand how people who haven't attended a protest like myself are regarded as a lesser supporter, or love the club less. I've signed petitions, held up the red card and supported SEO. I have a season ticket after been led to believe all the crap about BSI. I go to away games as I enjoy the experience a lot more than I do home games. I enjoy supporting my team!!

 

Protests just don't make me feel comfortable. I have nothing against supporters who want to protest and applaud their efforts but I personally wouldn't feel comfortable doing it. If there was to be another organised march and I knew it was going to have an effect, then I will be there. I think it has to be organised properly though and not just through the likes of this site to notify more people of it.

[Tumbleweed_MVF]

I think you raise an interesting and overdue discussion point there.

I've been going for over 40 years, brought my son for over 14 years and daughters at various times. As a shareholder, I took the day off work and voted against the board at the EGM and I've done the red card thing the other week.

 

Am I a passionate fan for whom it's life or death....... no!

 

I also have various family responsibilities in life and troubles. I have a stressful job to hold down. I'm very clear that I go to Vale for recreation and that I'm entitled to keep doing so in that spirit.

I read this forum frequently and to use some people's somewhat patronising terminology I have been “educated”. I agree with the protests, I'm genuinely grateful that people with more passion than me (and maybe more time) are trying to get the club out of a serious situation AND I will not be joining protests. That's not because I don't agree or realise the seriousness of the situation, it's because hand on heart Vale aren't important enough to me to invest as much emotional and physical effort as some on here have.

I understand that in times of war emotions are high and opinions hard line but with respect, I think I'm probably part of a quiet majority here and that's a fanbase that hardliners might want to think about not alienating. Perjorative expressions like “happy clapper” and “burying your head in the sand” are a real turn off, frankly.

 

Well I have kids a stressfull job and bills and enjoy Vale on a sat home and away but to be frank if fans hadn't brought the club to the public eye and made us fans aware we would be in a worse place as they would hide and lie without us knowing if 3000+ fans stood outside and protested these clowns would be long gone....

 

But to many fans have a similar view to you, so we are now sinking fast......

 

We may not have a club to watch because of fans attitude to the situation simple as yes I will memtion it again I live in Portsmouth and travel to vale but still have time to stand against the cancer that is killing our club if I can find the time the other fans surly can to but they refuse to time and time again....

 

If the club folds I know I did my bit and hold my head up can you?

 

If the club rides the storm and comes though a stronger club I know I did my bit and again will hold my head up knowing I did my bit!!!!

 

I agree the head in the sand fans have the club they deserve beause they sat on there fat bums or walked home not giving a t***

 

NO SURRENDER TO THE EVIL CANCER!!

OR ARE THE MAJORITY OF VALE FANS JUST TO FICKLE OR WEAK!!!!

[KEV.WILLIE]

What does this even mean? I know people who have been going for 40 years but won't protest because they only go to enjoy a day out at football. What sort of club do they deserve?

 

I know people that go to the odd game and won't protest but still love Vale. What club do they deserve?

 

Why is it the ones who are in attendance at the game but not the protests who will "get the club they deserve"?

 

Most who say it are patronising little ****s, its the whole senario of 'if your not with us you must be against us'

[Birdy]

Most who say it are patronising little ****s, its the whole senario of 'if your not with us you must be against us'

 

I think it's more to do with frustration as it appears that no one gives a ****.