Gunmen kill 12 in terrorist attack - Paris

[For Us All]

"Defend the right to offend".

[Bea Smith]

My problem with your post (and genuine apologies for any perceived sanctimony - this shouldn't be a thread for point scoring) was that I felt it put the onus on the 'muslims' to almost prove their innocence (or at least their anger) in all this. All day I have read people writing about 'muslims' and Islam, when, in reality, this has **** all to do with that; the act of this gang of maniacs today may have been done because of their twisted interpretation of Islam but it had nothing to do with the religion or hundreds of millions of people who practice the religion.

 

 

Despite the fact we have clashed on views on other subjects, I agree this thread should not be one for competing or slanging matches.

 

I have to disagree though that this is nothing to do with Islam, simply because it has been done in the name of Islam. However misguided or far way from the Koran it may be, however twisted the interpretation, these people will claim it is for Islam.

 

Which is why I think it would be good for the mainstream, majority, decent Muslim people in Western countries to be angry and to show it, and disown, dissociate themselves from these murderers.

 

Sadly, by the choice of target and what they say after these outrages, it does tend to make some people want revenge against anything Islamic. This could be defused before it gets started by a genuine show of condemnation and sympathy for the victims and their families by our muslim population.

[carl]

A sad state of affairs, and you have to wonder if Glasgow was a cover up.

[mr.hobblesworth]

^What a character!^

 

 

Which is why I think it would be good for the mainstream, majority, decent Muslim people in Western countries to be angry and to show it, and disown, dissociate themselves from these murderers.

 

 

Ah, you see, I completely agree with you here, especially the angry bit. I just interpreted your original post as being more about some kind of apology or mea culpa, particular with the money raising thing.

[bookworm]

condem in public and sympathise in private,but they can't even do that as the end justifies the means,at least the taxi drivers have been forced to remove the you have your queen but we have your country stickers out of the cars. and that has been noticed just by being observant.

[JOHNNYAITCH]

The reaction in France has been remarkable and just right.."we are not afraid and you will not change us".

[mr.hobblesworth]

In the face of such abhorrent violence, such a vast outpouring of grief and sadness, when times are so troubling and when the possible repercussions of this apalling attack are so bleak, it takes a special kind of person to start banging on about cover ups in Glasgow, taxi drivers and car window stickers.

[For Us All]

Another two police officers shot in France,one policewoman killed,the other seriously injured.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30721677

[For Us All]

Salman Rushdie has his say - "Respect for religion has now become a phrase code for fear of religion".

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2900976/Salman-Rushdie-condemns-Charlie-Hebdo-attack-sign-deadly-mutation-heart-Islam.html

[CambridgeDon]

Horrible. Just awful. Thoughts are with the families and friends of the victims of today's terrible events.

 

 

 

That's really good of you, being "prepared to believe" that 'most muslims' (out of the estimated 1.6 billion on the planet) are against this but I fail to see why they should take to the streets and raise money. Why should they have to prove their disgust at what happened today? Would you say the same of white people, Christians, men? (Totally agree with your first paragraph though.)

 

Why should they have to prove their disgust? Well, they don't have to but after three of their number had committed such an appalling atrocity in the name of their religion against totally innocent journalists, you'd think, wouldn't you, that they'd want to. You'd think that they would absolutely want to disassociate themselves from such vile behaviour. For their own credibility, they need to do it.

[mr.hobblesworth]

I've already addressed this in post #19. The post you've quoted was more to do with my belief that this heinous act was committed by 3 individuals misappropriating a religion for their own psychopathic ends, rather that being seen as symptomatic of the religion and it's 1.6 billion followers. (Having said that, I do wonder if Muslims weren't predominantly darker skinned whether there would be such a clammer for outward shows of remorse, regret or anger.)

[Houston Valiant]

My problem with your post (and genuine apologies for any perceived sanctimony - this shouldn't be a thread for point scoring) was that I felt it put the onus on the 'muslims' to almost prove their innocence (or at least their anger) in all this. All day I have read people writing about 'muslims' and Islam, when, in reality, this has **** all to do with that; the act of this gang of maniacs today may have been done because of their twisted interpretation of Islam but it had nothing to do with the religion or hundreds of millions of people who practice the religion.

 

It has everything to do with the religion. That's why these three went to Syria, to be versed in it, and then go and do the cowardly deed.

 

surah 2 verses 190-191 Koran " and slay them where you will find them"

[bookworm]

In the face of such abhorrent violence, such a vast outpouring of grief and sadness, when times are so troubling and when the possible repercussions of this apalling attack are so bleak, it takes a special kind of person to start banging on about cover ups in Glasgow, taxi drivers and car window stickers.

 

Perhaps some of us aren't as sensitive and pious as you

[mr.hobblesworth]

Yeah, nice one, more discrimination, prejudice, racism and islamophobia will certainly bring about a rapid end to such heinous acts.

 

It has everything to do with the religion. That's why these three went to Syria, to be versed in it, and then go and do the cowardly deed.

 

surah 2 verses 190-191 Koran " and slay them where you will find them"

 

Bull. It is to do with their interpretation of the religion, not the religion itself. 1.6 billion people follow Islam. The Qur'an doesn't kill people, words don't shoot innocent satirists, Allah didn't jump down from a cloud and give them the wink.

 

Your quote is taken out of context by the way. The Qu'ran has a cluster**** of different interpretations and reading the original text will only reveal a small part of understanding Islam. It's a complicated multi headed hydra of a religion, and any one who ascribes it as being a singular violent (or, indeed, peaceful) dogma is clearly ignorant. Equally, anyone droning on about "Muslims" or Islam in the wake of this attack, rather than condemning the attackers as a murderous gang (full stop) is at best displaying their ignorance and, at worst, their bigotry and xenophobia.

 

The entire goal of extremists like this is to spur Western hatred of Islam to further the perceived culture war that gives their groups' existence meaning.

[mr.hobblesworth]

Perhaps some of us aren't as sensitive and pious as you

 

Or maybe you're just a nasty bigoted onanistic dunce. Yoreet with tha marmate?