Companies House Documents

[Andy06]

accounts that go back the furthest i can see are 2004

[Andy06]

So just how much debt has Port Vale got....it is said to be 3.5 million and the

ground is valued at 3.5 million.....and what were the debts when V2001 came

in....before we were where we are....losses of 400k a year and their credit must have run out.....82% vote of no confidence from a shareholders poll...

turn down 5 million investment....."going reasonably well".

 

first accounts available for v2001 (which i can find)

 

Profit and Loss Account

for the period of 18th Feb 03 - 30th June 2004

 

Turnover £3,274,093

 

Cost of goods sold and match day costs -£731,269

 

Player and staff costs -£2,450,636

Depreciation -£38,277

other operating charges -£558,055

 

OPERATING LOSS -£504,144

 

Goodwill written off -£498,024

 

Interest recievable and similar income £2,950

 

at the mo that comes to a -£999,218 loss

 

interest payable and similar charges -£104,738

LOSS ON ORDINARY ACTIVITIES BEFORE TAX -£1,103,956

 

LOSS FOR THE FINANCIAL YEAR PERIOD AFTER TAX -£1,103,956

 

DEFICIT CARRIED FORWARD -£1,103,956

[Stevo]

Idly peered at HARLEQUIN MANAGEMENT SERVICES (SOUTH EAST) LIMITED

and noticed that their accounts for this year are almost 2 months overdue.

 

Not knowing a thing about these things, I was wondering how common this is?

[fairportnick]

Idly peered at HARLEQUIN MANAGEMENT SERVICES (SOUTH EAST) LIMITED

and noticed that their accounts for this year are almost 2 months overdue.

 

Not knowing a thing about these things, I was wondering how common this is?

 

The fines stack up very quickly so not too common.

£150 immediate, 375 1 month, 750 3month, 1500 6 months etc

[VantaaVale]

So we're £2 million in debt, the ground is realistically valued at £3.5 million and we're losing about £300K a year. Looks like a bed of roses to me!

 

Does this lot include the loans we have to pay, like to the council?

[Andy06]

the council loan stands just shy of 2m which if i heard right we have to repay this year?

 

how bratt can say the finances are ok is mind boggling

[Guest Aub]

Accounts can use an historic land value, depreciated over a long period. Sometimes 30 years, sometimes as long as 50-100 years. There must be a comment in there as to how the land is treated. The headline figure can be misleading.

 

Sometimes the bare site is deemed not to depreciate at all. Sometimes the buildings on that land are deemed to deteriorate over time and so are depreciated. The problem is, that if the club have gone for the alternative use basis, they might not be able to do this - and have to re-value every 5 years or so on the same basis. Leaving them susceptible to huge swings in the property market.

 

How much of the debt is an overdraft facilty and how much long term loans?

[Jacko51]

So we're £2 million in debt, the ground is realistically valued at £3.5 million and we're losing about £300K a year. Looks like a bed of roses to me!

 

 

£2 million? Where did you find that figure? It's nearer £3.5 million. Look at page 14 - the two lines of creditors.

[VantaaVale]

OMG I didn't realise it was that bad. I was just going on the deficit carried forward on 30/6/2010 posted by Andy06. So, is Vale actually insolvent now?

[Utch]

Accounts can use an historic land value, depreciated over a long period. Sometimes 30 years, sometimes as long as 50-100 years. There must be a comment in there as to how the land is treated. The headline figure can be misleading.

 

Sometimes the bare site is deemed not to depreciate at all. Sometimes the buildings on that land are deemed to deteriorate over time and so are depreciated. The problem is, that if the club have gone for the alternative use basis, they might not be able to do this - and have to re-value every 5 years or so on the same basis. Leaving them susceptible to huge swings in the property market.

 

How much of the debt is an overdraft facilty and how much long term loans?

 

Land & buildings are not depreciated in the Port Vale accounts. They use the alternative use basis for valuation and have to re-value every 5 years, like you say. Any differences in re-valuation will come out of the revaluation reserve, which currently stands at £3.7m. Port Vale have not done this due to the cost involved (apparently).

 

The overdraft was just £18,035 at 30 June 2010. The loan repayments due within one year were £204,269. Between one and two years £159,783. Between two and five years £423,462. Over five years £1,425,335.

[Utch]

£2 million? Where did you find that figure? It's nearer £3.5 million. Look at page 14 - the two lines of creditors.

 

I might be mising something here. Where are you getting your figure of £3.5m from? Page 14 is the first page of the notes for me - revenue, staff costs and operating loss.

[Loggerheads Sage]

the council loan stands just shy of 2m which if i heard right we have to repay this year?

 

how bratt can say the finances are ok is mind boggling

 

No, we have to restart paying the loan off in installments this year. It has to be repaid in total by 2026. Not quite as bad as you thought eh. Repayments will be circa £125,000 per year ( plus interest)=========

[melv]

No, we have to restart paying the loan off in installments this year. It has to be repaid in total by 2026. Not quite as bad as you thought eh. Repayments will be circa £125,000 per year ( plus interest)=========

 

Almost £2.5 pw (+ interest)

 

Where is that money going to be coming from,is it already budgeted for?

[Utch]

Almost £2.5 pw (+ interest)

 

Where is that money going to be coming from,is it already budgeted for?

 

It probably is, yes.

[melv]

It probably is, yes.

 

Only Probably ????

 

What if it hasn't,has this been revised taking into account the ST boycott?

 

Or is that expecting too much?