Ukraine v England

[Hagrid]

0-0 draw against Ukraine.

 

Roy claims we should be satisfied.

 

The likes of Germany, Spain and Belgium (my top 3 European teams) are destroying everyone in their path and we have drawn twice with Ukraine, who had no players I recognised in their side.

 

Centre halves don't inspire me with confidence, Hart looked very dodgy when he let a ball bounce when he came out to collect, aging midfield, toothless attack.

 

Should we qualify for Brazil, we have 0% chance of winning it.

[soothsayer]

Hart - 6, not much to do but give me Neal any day!

Walker - 3, beaten time and time again, lucky not to give away a pen.

Cahill - 8, one of the few to play to his potential.

Jagielka - 7, solid & made few mistakes.

Cole - 6, got done a couple of times but stuck at it.

Milner - 4, what does he offer? Yes he's a trier but so would I be if picked for England.

Lampard - 6, ok first half but not in it second half bar his late chance.

Gerrard - 6, saw a lot of the ball but gave it away a lot too.

Wiltshire - 5, was he fit? Looked to be running through treacle at times.

Walcott - 6, was Walcott loads of pace no end product.

Lambert - 6, ok 1st half but didn't hold it up as well 2nd half.

Subs: Young - 4, first four touches were passes to the opposition. Cleverly - n/a, no time to make an impact.

[Dr Winston O'Boogle]

What are you banging on about? Seen nothing of Wilshere to get overly excited by, that's when he's even fit...............

 

Shawcross is better than Cahill spiel that always come out.

 

A very gifted footballer who is trying to get back into his stride after a long term injury, will be a fine footballer but shouldn't be with the seniors to take this kind of criticism. Only due to a shocking lack of depth of players and talent is he given this expectation.

 

If you don't see that potential, stick to Rugby.

[Hagrid]

Chiles, Keane and Dixon trying to make out it's a good result.

 

It's Ukraine.

 

They don't even have Shevchenko anymore.

[For Us All]

I'll take a point away from home with the players available,the end justifies the means.

[Dr Winston O'Boogle]

There's one person banging on about Shawcross here and it's not me. Seen plenty of players with potential over the years, in Germany, Spain, Italy etc. these players actually turn potential into consistent performances.

 

Yeah because the Stoke fans have now seen what the rest of us have seen, so there's no mention of it any more thankfully.

 

That's because people in Spain and Germany understand football.

 

We are very conservative and we may spring a few surprises like teams have in the past - a huge turnaround in the playing staff would be throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

[For Us All]

Does it though? What's the point of limping over the line and making the World Cup and then making up the numbers. Get shot of the old guard and pick a young team and give them time to gel. If that means missing out on a couple of tournaments but the standard of our international team improves only then will the end justify the means in my opinion......

 

I think the objective tonight was not to lose and then perhaps win our remaining two games to qualify for Brazil.If we get humiliated next year,then perhaps someone will wake up and decide that our system wants radical change.

[For Us All]

So stop droning on about Shawcross then on a Ukraine v England thread.

 

A huge turnaround of playing staff wouldn't be the end of the world, we'll crawl over the line to the World Cup, scrape our way into the knockout stages before being despatched by one of the big boys. The Germans ripped up their squad, went totally for young up and coming players and gave them a chance and they are now reaping the rewards....

 

So did Belgium who are my outsiders for next year.

[Dr Winston O'Boogle]

So stop droning on about Shawcross then on a Ukraine v England thread.

 

A huge turnaround of playing staff wouldn't be the end of the world, we'll crawl over the line to the World Cup, scrape our way into the knockout stages before being despatched by one of the big boys. The Germans ripped up their squad, went totally for young up and coming players and gave them a chance and they are now reaping the rewards....

 

I wanted you lot to stop droning on about Shawcross for about 3 years so I might decide to carry on about it for the same amount of time.

 

But the Germans understood why they were ****, rectified the problem and built it from the ground up - we haven't done that.

 

We've just said we are ****, put the kids on then we will have a better future, what the Germans did when they realised they weren't very good they kept their old guard - Frings, Worns, Hamann then gradually increased the youngsters - Lahm, Schweinsteiger, Podolski etc.

 

It wasn't done overnight.

[Dr Winston O'Boogle]

We're treading water, it's a pointless exercise. May as well have next summer off and watch it on the telly.....

 

We would be doing it with your team with no experience.

 

Look we aren't very good, the kids below them aren't very good, let's just be pragmatic and realise our limitations be organised and see if what happens - like Greece 2004.

 

I know it isn't pretty but this situation we've sleepwalked into and will take years to come out of.

[For Us All]

I wanted you lot to stop droning on about Shawcross for about 3 years so I might decide to carry on about it for the same amount of time.

 

But the Germans understood why they were ****, rectified the problem and built it from the ground up - we haven't done that.

 

We've just said we are ****, put the kids on then we will have a better future, what the Germans did when they realised they weren't very good they kept their old guard - Frings, Worns, Hamann then gradually increased the youngsters - Lahm, Schweinsteiger, Podolski etc.

 

It wasn't done overnight.

 

It wasn't,after the Germans poor showing in Euro 2000 they decided to do something about it and restructured their academy's to ensure that the majority of the players would play for Germany,approximately 60% of the intake,twice that of England's.

This link is a good read.

 

http://pitchinvasion.net/blog/2010/07/04/inventing-the-new-germany-youth-development-and-the-bundesliga/

[chrissy_g]

This has a draw written all over it. Both sides will settle for that

 

I really should back my instinct with a bet

[Guppy 4 England]

Ukraine were the worst side i have ever seen for diving. Hope they dont qualify for being cheating *****s.

[For Us All]

Hodgson seems annoyed with Lineker's comments?

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/ukraine-0-0-england-gary-lineker-2265986

[JOHNNYAITCH]

I don't blame Roy.....players just cannot do the basics well enough. We try to play a short passing game but the players aren't good enough to do it.

 

Woeful performance but we got the point