Woolwich stabbing/machete attack

[Andyregs]

Jesus asked, "Will you never believe in me unless you see miraculous signs and wonders?"

 

Well at least it will make him stand out compared to David icke!

[Andyregs]

Though this circular logic. You have to believe the bible to have a chance I believing it.

And I'm not sure ethnic cleansing can be classes as a miraculous wonder.

[Tone]

Though this circular logic. You have to believe the bible to have a chance I believing it.

And I'm not sure ethnic cleansing can be classes as a miraculous wonder.

 

Or to put it another way, you have to have faith to be able to understand it.

[Andyregs]

Or to put it another way, you have to have faith to be able to understand it.

 

You have to have faith to believe every single religion. I don't believe in hundreds of gods. As don't you. I just don't believe in onerous than you.

Faith isn't understanding. In fact it's the opposite. It's choosing not to. It's literal definition is the belief without reason or evidence.

[Tone]

You have to have faith to believe every single religion. I don't believe in hundreds of gods. As don't you. I just don't believe in onerous than you.

Faith isn't understanding. In fact it's the opposite. It's choosing not to. It's literal definition is the belief without reason or evidence.

 

I repeat, I said you have to have faith to be able to understand (not to believe, which is what you said).

 

You have clearly read some scripture but you've read it as a non-believer, as one who has not accepted Christ.

 

Jews have been reading the Torah for centuries and they still don't understand that Jesus fulfilled over 300 prophecies.

[Avon]

JH constantly passes his time with dissecting posts/ being argumentative.

 

Tone's choice of location says it all; George W.'s murder state of unethical judgement...! Remind me Tone, what's the appeal rate against the death penalty in Texas?

 

Give it up Andy, absolute reason has no place with these two

 

I rarely post, but I've been reading this and previous threads for a while and that pretty much sums it up.

 

I have to say Andy, you have the patience of a saint (irony intended). Constantly banging your head against a brick wall / debating with JH and Tone (delete as appropriate) must drive you crazy. Just reading it is bad enough.

 

Give up and save what's left of your sanity.

[Andyregs]

I repeat, I said you have to have faith to be able to understand (not to believe, which is what you said).

 

You have clearly read some scripture but you've read it as a non-believer, as one who has not accepted Christ.

 

Jews have been reading the Torah for centuries and they still don't understand that Jesus fulfilled over 300 prophecies.

 

I know what you said, and I I disagreed. Blindly believing something (which is what faith is by definition) has nothing to do with understanding. The 'having to have faith' argument is always the last throw of the dice in an argument like this.

 

I rarely post, but I've been reading this and previous threads for a while and that pretty much sums it up.

 

I have to say Andy, you have the patience of a saint (irony intended). Constantly banging your head against a brick wall / debating with JH and Tone (delete as appropriate) must drive you crazy. Just reading it is bad enough.

 

Give up and save what's left of your sanity.

 

JH always makes me pull my hair out! Though I do enjoy a good argument (as you've probably noticed).

[Valenick]

Don't always agree with you andy but I've enjoyed this thread.youve been very balanced honest and fair throughout

[JOHNNYAITCH]

I'm out. You are impossible. I give you the actual reason, you don't accept it so what's the point.

 

That's a pity

 

Whatever the reason it's ridiculous of you to use a source that you consider a wothless rag unless trying to prove it's a worthless rag

 

As for the rest, just look back on everything I've put, instead of wasting more band width repeating myself.

 

Fairy nuff..yiou only have to keep repeating yourself cos you don't accept when you are wrong..it's just the same stuiff over and over again despite evidence to the contrary and holes in your arguments being proven

 

Whether there is a muslim on here or not is neither here nor there.

 

More nonsense..tour claim was that I had a particular attitude to one religion (Christinaity in thuis case) which was and is wholely incorrect cos I'd be the same whichever religion I was discussing this with. ..trying to understand it better before commenting. You just carry on ignoring what I actually posted

 

You argued the same points before they get involved.

 

Oh dear..you really have missed the point of my response to your comment.

 

You read things how you want,

 

Like we all do

 

I can't be bothered to waste any more bandwidth.

 

As i said, a pity

 

Ta ra and calm down dear, it's only a forum ;)

[JOHNNYAITCH]

JH constantly passes his time with dissecting posts/ being argumentative.

 

Yiou say that like it's a bad thing ;)

 

I'm nor argumentative just passionate about my beliefs, just like many on here are.

[JOHNNYAITCH]

Not all of it was sexually related. In fact a lot of it wasn't. And no answer for leaving the virgin girls but not boys?

And the Israelites sinned and so the Israelites killed them because of it? Interesting!

At least you don't hide from it. God didn't want them to mix, and so ordered ethnic cleansing. Sparing no man, woman or child unless they were a virgin which were given out as spoils of war.

Took us a while, but there we have it. Just need JH to tell you that you don't properly understand now.

 

 

I am in no position to contradict Tone as i don't know enough about this particular area..nor do I disagree with you for the same reason..see I admit when I don't know a subject well enough.

 

However, if God is a God then I see no reason why he should be judged in human terms, if he want ethnic cleansing then as a God, that's up to him

[JOHNNYAITCH]

Debates ended. Tone cleared it all up for us clearly. God ordered ethnic cleansing. For some reason I don't think JH will dissect his post and argue against it.

 

I won't and I've given the reason

 

I give reasons and you don't accept them instead you 'speculate' on my motives..what's the point in debating with you if you won't accept my honest reasons..very strange

[Andyregs]

More nonsense..tour claim was that I had a particular attitude to one religion (Christinaity in thuis case) which was and is wholely incorrect cos I'd be the same whichever religion I was discussing this with. ..trying to understand it better before commenting. You just carry on ignoring what I actually post

 

 

 

Being proven wrong? You have a funny way if doing that!

Obviously you have shown the same standards of debate to both sides. We were discussing both, but not one single argument against Tones obviously flawed logic. Only a pandering 'oh thats interesting'. No comment on his admitting that god did order ethnic cleansing, and misogyny either. Does he not understand it? Is it not too complicated? My argument was that all religions contain atrocities. And the promise of eternal life life makes them dangerous if people follow some of the blatantly awful stuff in them. However as long as people stuck to the law and therefore choose to ignore that stuff, and it doesnt affect anyone elses life, then they should be free to believe what they want free from persecution. On the other hand, others should be free to challenge those beliefs in the same way any other belief (in politics, Art or the supernatural for example) can be. You have proved any if that wrong.

[Andyregs]

However, if God is a God then I see no reason why he should be judged in human terms, if he want ethnic cleansing then as a God, that's up to him

 

So now we show atrocities in the bible it's now not an atrocity because its god.

[JOHNNYAITCH]

I know what you said, and I I disagreed. Blindly believing something (which is what faith is by definition) has nothing to do with understanding. The 'having to have faith' argument is always the last throw of the dice in an argument like this.

 

Totally agree that faith is flawed although your 'definition' is for me flawed.....one can have faith in something based on one's experiences of it whilst having no absolute proof. A true believer has something deep inside thast a non-believer cannot grasp. It's flawed and in Chirtianity's case based on a work of fiction but for them it puts the Bible etc in a context enabling understanding

 

Without faith then it's not possible to understand it..a bit like (on a much smaller scale) if I read a biography and didn't have faith that it was a true account of the person's life then it's just a story and nothing more (Not a good analogy)

 

 

 

JH always makes me pull my hair out!

 

Calm down dear, it's only a forum :rolleyes: