Should Vale move quickly and appoint from within?

[robf]

Rob Fielding wonders if Port Vale should replace the seemingly departing Rob Page with an internal appointment. Rob Fielding writes… If the press are to believed, the appointment of Rob Page as new Northampton Town boss is pretty much a done deal. So who should replace him? As I have said before in these musings, […]

 

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THIS IS AN AUTOMATED FEED OF A STORY FROM THE OVF FRONTPAGE

[stupers]

I like the appointment of Brown for a number of reasons:

 

- It's clear the other players like and respect him

- I think a few of the players would sign on for next season as a result of his appointment

- He has a good reputation outside of the club, could be good for bringing new players in

- He probably, like Page has fresh ideas about running a football club. I have reservations about bringing a manager in who has been there, not done it

- If he manages in the same way as he plays, then we'd be extremely hard to beat (although we may have a poor disciplinary record)

 

That all being said, I think he (or anyone for that matter) would be crazy for taking the job at the moment. Nobody has a clue what's going on at this place, us included. All the hear'say is that the club is a complete mess, the players offered contracts aren't going to sign them and the ones on contract want out.

 

16 hours from news breaking that the manager has agreed to join another club, and still no official response from Port Vale. That in itself is shocking. We deserve to know what the hell is going on.

[PVTony]

No! We don't want another three year plan, we need a proven manager of success who can get the club promoted quickly.

[robf]

I like the appointment of Brown for a number of reasons:

 

- It's clear the other players like and respect him

- I think a few of the players would sign on for next season as a result of his appointment

- He has a good reputation outside of the club, could be good for bringing new players in

- He probably, like Page has fresh ideas about running a football club. I have reservations about bringing a manager in who has been there, not done it

- If he manages in the same way as he plays, then we'd be extremely hard to beat (although we may have a poor disciplinary record)

 

That all being said, I think he (or anyone for that matter) would be crazy for taking the job at the moment. Nobody has a clue what's going on at this place, us included. All the hear'say is that the club is a complete mess, the players offered contracts aren't going to sign them and the ones on contract want out.

 

16 hours from news breaking that the manager has agreed to join another club, and still no official response from Port Vale. That in itself is shocking. We deserve to know what the hell is going on.

 

I think the key for me is continuity. It worked when we brought in Page for Adams, why not Brown for Page. The danger of a new manager is it rips up all the retained list work if he wants to bring in his own players. Can we afford to bring in a load of new players?

 

However, I don't think you can blame the Vale for no statement. Firstly, it's only the press saying it (no official announcement from Northampton) and even if it sounds 99.9% true the club shouldn't respond to press rumours. Secondly, if the move has been agreed I would imagine there will be simultaneous announcements on the Northampton and Vale websites with club statements on the appointment/departure. I would imagine the agreement is that the club say nothing till the contracts (for things like compensation) are signed and sealed.

[robf]

No! We don't want another three year plan, we need a proven manager of success who can get the club promoted quickly.

 

I felt we were going somewhere with the three-year plan. I also don't think the club can afford a "proven manager of success". An extreme example but look at someone like Jim Gannon who joined us when he still had a decent reputation. He clearly wanted to bring in all his own players and his own staff and that probably cost a fortune.

 

I'm not saying an outside appointment wouldn't work but I think if we do appoint an outsider he's got to work with what we've got and get the best out of them and I can't see any big-name manager doing that (unless Norman changes his mind and opens up some funds that is).

[Yukon]

One thing that is for certain, the club is being run absolutely disastrously at the moment.

[PVTony]

 

Rob,

That's the key point, we're stuck with an owner who has no interest in the future of the club, but only in retrieving some if not all of his intial investment.

Only because finances dictate, he is likely to appoint Brown.

[Shropshire_Valiant]

No for me. I actually think we need to move away from the whole pally act we've had under Page. I just don't like it and it makes me cringe when the players are saying Pagey this and Pagey that. I'm not saying you shouldn't be friends with your boss etc but he's the man in charge and someone to be respected. Lets be honest some of the best managers in the games history, some of the players who played under them couldn't stand them as a person but respected them as a good manager who knew what they were doing.

I'm not saying Page has done badly, I just don't subscribe to the media view that Radio Stoke are peddling that's he's done a marvellous job. He's done roughly what's expected imo. Mid-table in League One with the gates that Vale get is about right. The season before he nearly took us down from a side on the verge of the playoffs to one that scraped a win(1 in 11) at mightly Yeovil(did our best to draw that game too) to stay up.(The season ticket sales before the season just gone back that up!) Far too often this season the players have proved they bottle it in big games(2-3 points off the playoffs and they put in an abject performance, Exeter in the cup also springs to mind). And the standard of football well for me it's dire, far too many games(mainly away) we didn't look like scoring.

 

Sorry but it's a clean break for me!

[robf]

Rob,

That's the key point, we're stuck with an owner who has no interest in the future of the club, but only in retrieving some if not all of his intial investment.

Only because finances dictate, he is likely to appoint Brown.

 

But my worry is - we have had three clean breaks in recent years. Micky Adams resulted in a promotion. Lee Sinnott resulted in a relegation. Jim Gannon resulted in us being a laughing stock. So two out of three external appointments clearly didn't work perhaps due to the people making those appointments.

 

On the other hand internal appointments - Dean Glover was a disaster, Martin Foyle's was mixed but did have the odd high point, Rob Page's was OK perhaps better than expected.

 

For me then, an internal appointment allows for continuity and less risk. But that does come with a big caveat. If Norman appointed a well-known manager and backed him financially then I would definitely change my mind but I can't realistically see that happening.

[stupers]

I think the key for me is continuity. It worked when we brought in Page for Adams, why not Brown for Page. The danger of a new manager is it rips up all the retained list work if he wants to bring in his own players. Can we afford to bring in a load of new players?

 

However, I don't think you can blame the Vale for no statement. Firstly, it's only the press saying it (no official announcement from Northampton) and even if it sounds 99.9% true the club shouldn't respond to press rumours. Secondly, if the move has been agreed I would imagine there will be simultaneous announcements on the Northampton and Vale websites with club statements on the appointment/departure. I would imagine the agreement is that the club say nothing till the contracts (for things like compensation) are signed and sealed.

 

I disagree slightly on the announcements. Maybe not last night, but a response this morning even to say that they were aware of events with Rob Page and will respond in due course would have been appropriate. Again it looks like we're clueless, had no idea anything was going on and have been caught completely off-guard. Not a great look.

 

As you said though Rob, I do want a 3-year plan. I don't mind the manager being pally with the players, as long as the boundaries are drawn. Page had that in place and it was working. I expected a top-half finish as I thought that would have been a good season, so in that sense he did a good job, not spectacular but good. He was building something and I was confident for next season. I want someone to do the job and do it well, I don't give a toss if they have experience or not.

[Shropshire_Valiant]

I suppose it's swings and roundabouts as Rob says you can foul up with external or internal appointments. Although I'd hope some of those mentioned were down to our infamous previous owners not having a clue what they were doing.

But does Smurf know what he's doing? I guess that's the big question!

I'm not as big a critic as some of the current chairman but I have to admit he's one of those that could appoint a complete plonker or suddently announce he is breaking the bank to get a good experienced manager! Who knows?

[stupers]

I think you're right. We could go and break the bank and still muck it up. That's why I never get this necessity to have experience. You pay extra to have the experience, but most of the time they just repeat the mistakes they made that got them sacked 1st time round! I'd rather have someone who has fresh ideas and a positive outlook, instead of someone who is in fear of failure because they didn't like it last time.

 

In that respect I think Brown is a good appointment. He's not someone I'd say who is afraid of making mistakes, judging by the amount of red cards he picked up over his career.

[PVTony]

But my worry is - we have had three clean breaks in recent years. Micky Adams resulted in a promotion. Lee Sinnott resulted in a relegation. Jim Gannon resulted in us being a laughing stock. So two out of three external appointments clearly didn't work perhaps due to the people making those appointments.

 

On the other hand internal appointments - Dean Glover was a disaster, Martin Foyle's was mixed but did have the odd high point, Rob Page's was OK perhaps better than expected.

 

For me then, an internal appointment allows for continuity and less risk. But that does come with a big caveat. If Norman appointed a well-known manager and backed him financially then I would definitely change my mind but I can't realistically see that happening.

 

Spot on.

Just a pity that the manager has gone and not the owner.

[stupers]

Spot on.

Just a pity that the manager has gone and not the owner.

 

I will say that prior to the last few months I've been mainly in support of Smurf. But his bizarre Q&A night bludgeoned any support to pieces and this latest debacle isn't any better. My understanding is the players are furious with him, the manager has quit and nobody is buying any season tickets. I don't expect him to put money in, but I do expect him to run the club in a responsible manner with the supporters best interests at heart. He is clearly failing to do this and should either sell up at a price that doesn't refund him for all the mistakes he's made in the last 3 years or get someone in to the run the club for him and leave us alone.

[bookworm]

and micky adams flies in from tibshelf.