After Vale moved worryingly into the relegation picture, some serious questions are being asked about how to address the slump. Here’s the views of Rob Fielding.
Rob Fielding writes…
Consistently select your best XI
The game at Bolton was a case point in what can infuriate Vale fans. Ruari Paton fresh from two goals at the weekend (albeit against a non-league side) was dropped. George Byers, who has contributed very little this season, was not.
Vale have given games to well over thirty players this season. That’s a ridiculous situation. We are not a Premier League side rotating their squad and some consistency in selection allows players (for instance Paton and Cole upfront) to develop a partnership.
I feel for Devante Cole – since joining he has played upfront with Paton, Brown, Faal, Curtis, Stockley, George Hall and now Headley and Garrity.
Just like last season, it’s time to ignore “rotating” just pick your best eleven consistently and get on with it.
Play players in their correct position
Following on from that Devante Cole remark – with such a large squad why is Darren Moore still playing people out of position. It’s acceptable in an injury crisis (for example, playing George Hall at wingback when Kyle John dropped out) but not when there are players who are natural fits for that position.
What am I talking about? Well, in this game it was playing Jaheim Headley and (perhaps to a lesser extent) Ben Garrity as part of a front three. I’m talking about earlier in the season when Ronan Curtis was played upfront.
Once you’ve decided your XI play them in the right place. That’s Cole down the middle, wingbacks on the flanks and captain Ben Garrity (if selected) as an attacking midfielder.
Play two upfront
And on that note on playing people out of position… Vale have a plethora of natural central forwards – Cole, Stockley, Brown, Paton, Faal and Waine. Even when some of them start games (which didn’t happen on Saturday) they play out of position. For example, Paton deployed as an advanced midfielder or more astonishingly Devante Cole played wide on the right.
For me, the best way to get goals into this side is to play two upfront. Pick your two best – right now I’d argue that was Cole and Paton and have the next best two on the bench. For me that would be Stockley and Brown, the latter bizarrely not even in the squad, as replacements. That leaves the likes of Faal and Waine out of the squad.
Trim the bloated squad
And on that note – the fact that some players should not even make the squad is deeply worrying. After all, this is the first Vale side in living memory with three senior keepers meaning that one (usually Marko Marosi) is not even in the squad. He’s still picking up his wages though.
The huge squad just doesn’t make sense to me. We’re completely bloated in some areas – upfront, central midfield, in goal – and need to try and offload some in January. But then again, showing the inbalance we’re short of numbers at the back. Unlike the rest of the side, the back three is usually the same three and two of them (Debrah and Hall) are not consistent at this level. So, ironically, despite the huge numbers elsewhere, Vale are short of cover and competition in their backline.
The Valiants need to play it smart in the January window, get rid of deadwood and strengthen at the back. With a host of players on long contracts it seems like a tough task.
The manager is ultimately to blame
So who’s to blame for all this. The answer is clearly Darren Moore. Just as he takes credit for the promotion last season, he has to be responsible for all the above.
Moore seems a likeable chap and I’d love him to implement some of the above and turn the club’s form around. However, he seems completely stuck on some things – such as the constant tinkering with selection and formation.
It begs the question – would a change at the top be in order? The problem there is that Vale have bet the house on Moore with his lengthy contract and any change would be costly. So, if Moore is here to stay, let’s hope he learns to adapt before it’s too late.
If he doesn’t perhaps it’s time for a change.
Agree? Disagree? Have some other suggestions? Post a comment below.
Moore should have credit in the bank after last season but patience is running thin, not helped with his scatter gun approach to team selection.
In my eyes he has to pick up 4 points at least from the next games or we are toast.
5 league one wins from 34 is starting to look as though weirdly he is out of his depth.
Maybe the Doncaster and Huddersfield fans were correct.
I doubt very much Carol will sack him so we are probably heading from Bolton to Boreham Wood.
It’s obvious to a dumb deaf and blind man he’s way out of his depth. Just why she chose an inexperienced so called ” manager ” beggars belief. But there again she bought the club out of vanity not sanity and just a touch of luck given by others work did he gain promotion last season. Unfortunately were you are at Christmas is usually were you finish.If these owners want to gamble I’mafraid the bookies odds are already against and it’s good odds to win a packet on going down. I and my friend travel from East Anglia every home game, until he’s gone we’ll watch the slow demise on the TV. Carol wake up and smell the dubbin before it’s too too late.
Gauci needs to be signed if at all possible 16 of the squad who are not up to scratch keep Cole Paton G.Hall OjoClark Gordon Johnson Heneghan Amos get Shorrock back ASAP let Walters go to one of the so called Premier clubs (can’t believe the interest he does not effect games at all looks the part delivers very little & a fee would be most welcome)Brown Lawrence Lomax Richards we not seen enough of to decide stay or go & the manager & coaching staff need to massively up their game or do the honourable!!! I often wonder what Sir John Rudge thinks about the situation Oh Well UTV
Gauci needs to be signed if at all possible 16 of the squad who are not up to scratch keep Cole Paton G.Hall OjoClark Gordon Johnson Heneghan Amos get Shorrock back ASAP let Walters go to one of the so called Premier clubs (can’t believe the interest he does not effect games at all looks the part delivers very little & a fee would be most welcome)Brown Lawrence Lomax Richards we not seen enough of to decide stay or go & the manager & coaching staff need to massively up their game or do the honourable!!! I often wonder what Sir John Rudge thinks about the situation Oh Well UTV
Management is simply , do as Rod field said pick a Settled squad with players I correct position’s. And earn your five year contract and Board’s somewhat misguided backing …
A common characteristic of teams that struggle against relegation is using too many players. The consequence is inconsistent team selection, formations, tactics, and results. It works against establishing effective team partnerships, reliable form, and a clear team identity. This is the Vale’s problem. It’s only November but Moore has already used 32 players across League & Cup games. He’s been permitted to stockpile players to a level that’s impractical for a League 1 club. And, let’s not forget those sent out on loan. The squad’s bloated to the extreme, but still lacks proper defensive full backs and orthodox wingers. All this, and with the club being League 1’s lowest scorers it flounders in the drop zone. Better results and form consistency will only be achieved by settled match day squads and familiar tactical formations. Can Moore do this ? He did last season for the promotion run in. This time he’s in a more precarious position, having clearly shown that he doesn’t learn from increasing defeats. It’s a pity that Ian Evatt has been snapped up to manage Blackpool, because I would otherwise have him as the contender to successfully take the Vale job and end the “muddled and jumbled” management style.
Why would you not pick your best team? Surely winning points is the name of the game and 50 points are usually the number to guarantee staying up. Carol needs to take Moore to one side and quietly explain what he needs to do. If he does that and we still look like relegation candidates then he should do the honourable thing and resign, since he seems to be the one who had the major influence in bringing in his choice of players in the summer.
Enough is enough! The results for this manager at this level for us and recent previous clubs shows he is failing. Time is up! Yes he got us promoted after failing to stop us from relegation, but let’s be honest that only happened when he woke up one morning , got out of bed and thought you know what the fans may have a point. Shall I play my best players constantly in their best positions and see what happens.Result promotion. This chap is clueless and needs to do the decent thing and leave because I don’t think Carol will do the correct thing and sack him. Too many players in the squad and unbelievably in my book the most creative player with huge potential Rico Richards allowed to go on loan. WTF! A new manager is needed now immediately or we can all look forward to dropping back to league 2 football next season. Not the 150 years celebrations we were looking for. MOORE OUT!!!!!!!NOW
Constant changes means that the team has no pattern to their play. Players come in and impress and then are rewarded by being dropped for the next game. The manager is clueless. If he sees out his contract Carol should be looking to make the Vale ‘National League ready’.
Disjointed in defence as we time and again switch off when concentration should be at optimum and completely agree darren just does not know his best eleven not sure garrity and byers can be on the pitch at the same time and gotta go with cole paton hall start up front
Carol has done a lot for the Vale but I’m afraid she is on the got to go list as well , the Bycars has gone and so has the spirit of Port Vale, we will have a great ground and no team, there is no bottle or guts at the Vale and Carol shows it by keeping the worst manager we have ever had, his so called football is vile to watch, he does not know his A-s-from his elbow.If Vale go down again it WILL BE NONE LEAGUE FOOTBALL the year after, you Carol run the club NOT the manager, the buck stops with YOU.Get rid of Mr Moore or get rid of Port Vale, you are both killing the club
>> Carol has done a lot for the Vale but I’m afraid she is on the got to go list as well …
Dear Vale fan
Be careful what you wish for!
In the latest accounts filed at Companies House, for the year to 30/06/24, the club owed £14.9m (FOURTEEN POINT NINE MILLION POUNDS!!) in unsecured loans to the Shanahans and their business!
She may or may not be doing a good job (I would not have appointed Moore on the first place, and certainly not on that length of contract), but we’re truly sunk without her.
Darren Moore every game he’s changing formation and playing players out of position defentialy needs two best strikers up front and I think four defenders at the back but as I say he’s got no clue .When he’s doing interviews it’s the same story everytime I’m sorry Moore but it’s not good enough it’s just excuses he’s not good enough for a league one manager . We need a new manager or it’s back down to league 2 where we started after David Flintcroft
Spot on post from start to finish Here’s hoping DM takes note ⚽
Find your best team to suit our style and stick with it, stop changing to nullify the opposition. Let them worry about us. Arsenal rarely change their personnel and they are currently the best in England.
Manager change is a talking point here. It deserves to be said that statistically Daren Moore is nowhere near the Vale’s worst. If comparing Manager win rate percentages in my 62 years following the club, Moore sits near the top alongside John Rudge & John Askey on 37%, but behind Micky Adams and Darrell Clarke who achieved just over 40%. Next come the likes of Gordon Lee, John McGrath, Brian Horton, Andy Crosby, Neil Aspin, Jackie Mudie who trail behind Moore’s win rate. Much further down are Lee Sinnott, Dennis Butler, Bobby Smith, Alan Bloor, Jim Gannon, and Dean Glover, all devoid of any success and presiding over very dark days for club followers. Consecutive defeats combined with his controversial selection and tactics have justifiably angered supporters, and there’s more to management than win rates. But, by no stretch of the imagination is Darren Moore one of the club’s worst Managers. I think he has “credit in the bank” and should have 6-8 games to lift the club clear of trouble. Meantime, the owners must have a contingency plan to make the change if 2needs,
DM has taken us right back to the position Vale we’re in when he took over! With a far better squad (if over blown) than he inherited. Massive questions over tactics, selection and motivation
Dear N you will find this at most clubs, they run in debt,Carol has made the WRONG decisions with Mr More and she knows it, when she first came to the Vale the fans were included, now we are not, nobody in there right mind would give a manager with Moores record a 5 year contract, he could not run a party a brewery, and yes the Vale, and especially the fans will pay the price ( like we always have at the Vale).I am sure even Carol will have put clauses in Moores contract to remove him, if he can’t do the job and HE CANNOT DO THE JOB. Moore out now before he kills PORT VALE FC.
I’ve finally worked out DM’s team selectiond it involves 3 bags marked defence midfield & forwards he picks 4 from defence & midfield & 2 from the attack bag and a keeper who was out the week before then he asks at least 2 to play out of position and tells the defence to lump the ball as far as possible in the hope that one of our players might get the ball before it comes back with a vengance it must have gone around the other managers that all you need to do is push up and that our central defenders have the turning circle of a chieftain tank I’m sick of commenting on the position of DM and the silence that is coming out of the club remember he was appointed to keep us in this division 18 months ago and he failed then if something isn’t done soon it will be too late if we go back down all the good work at the club will be gone less gates no more record shirt sales disgruntled fans who will be hard to get back please don’t give DM more money to waste in the window
Millions owed to the Shanahans a manager who is nearly two years into a five year contract a bloated squad with several out on loan a manager who doesn’t know his best team and makes constant pchanges to the 11 selected to play. 13 points from 15 league games is relegation form could a settled side transform the the fortunes of the club possibly? But any action has to take place sooner rather than later.
I seriously fear that if Mr Moore is in charge for much longer,I could end up on the next team sheet,such is his stupid rotation policy!!
He’s seriously out of his depth.Fans of both Doncaster and Huddersfield were right to pre warn us.
For God’s sake play the right players in their best positions.Play a consistent regular strongest 11.And stick to it.
And if he’s not capable of managing an immediate turn round, it’s P45 time,before it’s way too late.
No’s comment on the club having loans of £14.9 million to the Shanahans and their businesses is interesting. Why exactly do we owe this amount? Under Smurthwaite’s tendency, a time when almost everything profitable was taken out of the Vale’s hands and put into his own companies name, we only had a fraction of this sort of dept on half our present attendances. Our time under Bill Bell when yet again numerous rumours were doing the rounds of inappropriate misdoings, again depts were nowhere near the £14.9 million we appear to owe the Shanahans. How can this be? Carol has a history of choosing and sacking managers, we also had the fiasco with Flitcroft all of which have cost the club millions to pay off. The decision to replace our loyal and popular groundsman and secretary was also a financial disaster. The club is not only top heavy on the playing side but also behind the scenes which a club of our size can ill afford. It appears every time Carol or the Shanahans make a bad decision it just adds to the clubs dept to them. So whilst we are indebted to the Shanahans for their initial saving of the club, for me the running of the club has a lot to be desired, it’s just unsustainable to run the club with these sort of losses, What sort of debts would we have to them if our gates were similar to those of Accrington or Crawley ?
It’s quite simple, moore does not know is best team to pick, clueless when it’s not working does not have a idea how to change it. Far to many players in squad. Firstly he needs to address the defence hall deb not first div players. Needs to get better players in. To many midfielders to many attackers needs to trim down. Needs to play same players instead of changing all the time. Me personally think it’s time to go, get some one in now to give us a chance.
Sack Moore get experience Dividion one coach , get all loan players back at Vale including the. Get rid of at least 7 players leave to new manager to decide . Carole pay recritmrent company to decide the new coach not the Family .
Darren Moore has to take full responsibility for Vale’s lack of progress in League one.
Too many players signed that do not improve the promoted squad eg Waine, Marosi and Shipley.
He relies on wing backs to create chances but more skill needed in league 1?
The rotation of players even when they have put a good performance in must lead to squad frustration and discontentment.
I would rather be relegated and lose with our younger players eg Plant, Shorrock, Walters and John because I can see a future.
At present Vale have too many average players who will not get us out of trouble I can only envisage a disappointing season!
Hope I am wrong!,
Fully agree that Moore is a one trick pony with little idea of strategy.We were warned by previous club supporters of his limitations. The massive squad is totally unbalanced and his constant team rotation surely indicates his lack of a plan,or indeed how to change one when it isn’t working.
Next game is Fleetwood,a mid table league 2 team,most of the forecasts are that Vale will take another thumping…..at home ! What a state to be in,bottom of league 1 with little chance of survival by mid November.
The crazy length of Moores contract surely ties Shanahans hands on what to do about yet another failure but with Moore league 2 is a certainty and survival there far from assured.
Moore has to go….sorry Shanahans its both your fault and your problem. Make the change now,before it is too late for us.