Summer transfer targets/rumours, retained list etc

[Iron Curtain]

48 minutes ago, Walka003 said:

1 hour ago, Portvale4 said:

One or two people saying we are going for Rory Holden from Smallsall. Injured for all of last season but played under DC, so he must highly rate the lad. 

If we binned gibbo for being injury prone this would be a bizzare signing.

Not at all. I’m genuinely struggling to understand how people are not getting this. 

We didnt “bin” Gibbo… we offered him a contract that factored in his injury and the risk of him missing games.

We would so the same for this lad. Genuinely what part of that are people not getting?

Gibbo himself clearly didn’t feel confident enough about his hamstrings because he took a sideways move 2.5 hours away from his new fiancé and their life together in Stoke. None of the big league 1 teams or championship club came in for him… why not?

His injury was potentially career ending… he would be on peanuts. But if we get his rehab right (we hired a new head of player fitness from Lincoln yesterday) he has then be potential to be a decent squad player. With 5 subs allowed, a creative number 10 might be very useful.

This won’t be our only signing … the matrix will see a player with potential and assign him a tiny portion of our budget for potential upside. 

Will it work… don’t know but to use the “bin Gibbo but sign Holden” line completely ignores all the context and detail around those deals.

KTF

UTV

[PortVale4Life]

Hope we’re not in for him. Whole season out, we already have one Cm coming back from a shocking injury don’t want another 

[PV1973]

1 hour ago, Portvale4 said:

One or two people saying we are going for Rory Holden from Smallsall. Injured for all of last season but played under DC, so he must highly rate the lad. 

WTF we’re signing a player who hasn’t played for a year? That’s a massive gamble. 
 

edit: just seen unofficial Vale have posted about It on Twitter too. 

[Iron Curtain]

2 minutes ago, PV1973 said:

WTF we’re signing a player who hasn’t played for a year? That’s a massive gamble. 
 

edit: just seen unofficial Vale have posted about It on Twitter too. 

Or a small gamble based on his wages?

If he’s on similar to Alex Hurst then he won’t have to do very much at all to contribute as much as Alex did… and his upside is significantly more.

[Walka003]

Not at all. I’m genuinely struggling to understand how people are not getting this. 
We didnt “bin” Gibbo… we offered him a contract that factored in his injury and the risk of him missing games.
We would so the same for this lad. Genuinely what part of that are people not getting?
Gibbo himself clearly didn’t feel confident enough about his hamstrings because he took a sideways move 2.5 hours away from his new fiancé and their life together in Stoke. None of the big league 1 teams or championship club came in for him… why not?
His injury was potentially career ending… he would be on peanuts. But if we get his rehab right (we hired a new head of player fitness from Lincoln yesterday) he has then be potential to be a decent squad player. With 5 subs allowed, a creative number 10 might be very useful.
This won’t be our only signing … the matrix will see a player with potential and assign him a tiny portion of our budget for potential upside. 
Will it work… don’t know. 
KTF
UTV

So considering this guy has missed a lot more games than gibbo (56 league games in his whole career) I'm assuming we will be offering him very little?

There always seems to be a way of spinning any potential move into the best possible light. IF we sign holden after not having gibbo on injury grounds, it will be a bit hypocritical.

[valiant_593]

A gamble not worth taking in my view. Be a huge step up for a league 2 player to then miss a full year and come and play league 1 football. We have Conlon and Taylor already who were out for the majority of last season. Last thing we need is another CM with a bad injury recently. Regardless of wages - not worth it. 

[Iron Curtain]

7 minutes ago, Walka003 said:

 

 

So considering this guy has missed a lot more games than gibbo (56 league games in his whole career) I'm assuming we will be offering him very little?

There always seems to be a way of spinning any potential move into the best possible light. IF we sign holden after not having gibbo on injury grounds, it will be a bit hypocritical.
 

 

Yes… that’s the point 🙄

We didn’t “not have Gibbo” on injury grounds! We offered him a deal… we didn’t get rid of him. We didn’t bin him. We factored in his injury and offered him what we thought was fair value.

Thats what we would do with Holden.

As a process I think that’s fair.

Im not saying it will be a good signing or a bad one… but I’m saying that a system where we offer people a fair wage based on what we think they can bring sounds good to me.

I genuinely trust the decision makers at the club to get these value calls right. I get everyone is allowed an opinion but they have proven success at doing this. 

The vacuum of no announcements is getting everyone on edge. 

If we offer Holden £2,000 a week flat wages I would be fuming and it would be an awful awful decision.

Will we do that? No.

 

[Walka003]

We could have had gibbo. He's been a very influencial member of this team, even if it is only 20 games a year. Every one on here seems extremely quick to dismiss him as an injury prone crock despite the fact that when he's fit he was one of the first names on the team sheet.

However, if that's what DF thinks is appropriate then it's done now isn't it.

My point is that it would be completely backwards to then go and sign someone like holden, who's played half the games at the same age due to his injury record. Unless he's happy on 350 quid a week then he's welcome (and probably a bit deranged)

[Iron Curtain]

32 minutes ago, Walka003 said:

There always seems to be a way of spinning any potential move into the best possible light. IF we sign holden after not having gibbo on injury grounds, it will be a bit hypocritical.
 

 

Let me explain my position… I’m not saying it would be an amazing signing, I’m saying I trust the football department who got us promotion on the back of their recruitment to recruit people.

Spin your point around… there always seems to be a way of doubting that they know what they are doing.

I don’t think he would be a first team player, I would guess at Alex Hursts replacement with potential upside that is far higher.

KTF

UTV

[Iron Curtain]

1 minute ago, Walka003 said:

We could have had gibbo. He's been a very influencial member of this team, even if it is only 20 games a year. Every one on here seems extremely quick to dismiss him as an injury prone crock despite the fact that when he's fit he was one of the first names on the team sheet.

However, if that's what DF thinks is appropriate then it's done now isn't it.

My point is that it would be completely backwards to then go and sign someone like holden, who's played half the games at the same age due to his injury record. Unless he's happy on 350 quid a week then he's welcome (and probably a bit deranged)

Do you trust DC and Flickers to get that decision and wage offer right?

[PV1973]

24 minutes ago, Iron Curtain said:

Or a small gamble based on his wages?

If he’s on similar to Alex Hurst then he won’t have to do very much at all to contribute as much as Alex did… and his upside is significantly more.

Time will tell, not every decision made is right, but he’s going to be taking up a valuable squad place and with conlon probably not making the start of the season too then that’s more pressure on the midfield. As things stand right now we are going into the preseason with a squad built for league two. So I think it’s a fair concern that we’ve rumoured to be adding a player who’s not played for a whole season. I think we need to sprinkle a little more league one experience on the squad with a couple of name signings. I had a forward, keeper, midfielder and a right back in my head. 

37 minutes ago, Iron Curtain said:

Not at all. I’m genuinely struggling to understand how people are not getting this. 

We didnt “bin” Gibbo… we offered him a contract that factored in his injury and the risk of him missing games.

We would so the same for this lad. Genuinely what part of that are people not getting?

Gibbo himself clearly didn’t feel confident enough about his hamstrings because he took a sideways move 2.5 hours away from his new fiancé and their life together in Stoke. None of the big league 1 teams or championship club came in for him… why not?

His injury was potentially career ending… he would be on peanuts. But if we get his rehab right (we hired a new head of player fitness from Lincoln yesterday) he has then be potential to be a decent squad player. With 5 subs allowed, a creative number 10 might be very useful.

This won’t be our only signing … the matrix will see a player with potential and assign him a tiny portion of our budget for potential upside. 

Will it work… don’t know but to use the “bin Gibbo but sign Holden” line completely ignores all the context and detail around those deals.

KTF

UTV

Not sure why you keep mentioning a player not moving to the championship as a negative against his quality. Every Vale fan knows how good he was for us and everyone knows you would have been well chuffed had he signed an extension, just like we all would have been. I think you’re lashing out in that upset angry love kind of way 😀 Maybe he has all the trust in the world in his hamstrings, but took a stand for himself (didn’t want to leave by all accounts) and so has moved to them to be able to move forward in his career (if that makes sense). No idea about the personal life digs though, that’s a bit stalky that. 

[Walka003]

Do you trust DC and Flickers to get that decision and wage offer right?

Hmm, do I trust them 100%. Do I think they've got this wrong (as they have with Hussey, Amos, Johnson till they sold him) yeah I do.

They can't get everything right.

[Iron Curtain]

16 minutes ago, valiant_593 said:

A gamble not worth taking in my view. Be a huge step up for a league 2 player to then miss a full year and come and play league 1 football. We have Conlon and Taylor already who were out for the majority of last season. Last thing we need is another CM with a bad injury recently. Regardless of wages - not worth it. 

Season over?

[Trumpingtonvale]

7 minutes ago, Iron Curtain said:

Yes… that’s the point 🙄

We didn’t “not have Gibbo” on injury grounds! We offered him a deal… we didn’t get rid of him. We didn’t bin him. We factored in his injury and offered him what we thought was fair value.

Thats what we would do with Holden.

As a process I think that’s fair.

Im not saying it will be a good signing or a bad one… but I’m saying that a system where we offer people a fair wage based on what we think they can bring sounds good to me.

If we offer Holden £2,000 a week flat wages I would be fuming and it would be an awful awful decision.

Will we do that? No.

 

Agree.  I’d imagine a very low basic which would then rise or have a bonus element based on appearances.  DC frequently says he wants players who are hungry to succeed and/or improve and this player may fit that mould especially wanting to prove himself coming back from an injury.  If the process has identified his pre-injury stats as showing potential then it may be seen a a relatively low cost gamble worth taking.

[valiant_593]

Just now, Iron Curtain said:

Season over?

Boring pal