Summer transfer targets/rumours, retained list etc

[Phantom Lord]

30 minutes ago, Bob Newtonian said:

Better than Jim Gannon🤔👍😌

Yeah I'm drunk on rum but I've decided I prefer him to JR. Now that's massive ( prepare for a massive load of flack - bring it on )

[Guppys left peg]

See Marcus Harness has been sold to Ipswich. Surprised me how well his career has gone since his loan spell at Vale as I never thought he was any better than average. Suppose always have to note that anyone who played for the club at that time was not exactly set up to succeed though.

[Guitar Ray]

As this is the transfer thread I’d say that after watching the video with Carol, DC and DF in Spain, focussing just in the recruitment content, either we are struggling to get players through the door or the three interviewees are being extremely cagey, or both.  Clearly we’re still talking to potential signings but it sounds like we’ve knocked a few back as not being a good fit.

[Guitar Ray]

14 minutes ago, Guppys left peg said:

See Marcus Harness has been sold to Ipswich. Surprised me how well his career has gone since his loan spell at Vale as I never thought he was any better than average. Suppose always have to note that anyone who played for the club at that time was not exactly set up to succeed though.

He was quite young when he came to us.  I thought he looked OK at the time.  His time with us was obviously beneficial. 

[LancyTony]

6 hours ago, smithie said:

A handful of people on a fans' forum doesn't equal "a lot of fans". How did those people manage pre-internet? I can tell you - fans just read The Sentinel and listened to the radio for news, there was no expectation to be kept informed of all developments all summer. 

 

 

And having to listen to the radio, and read The Senile was way more boring than this close season! 

[darren1810]

7 hours ago, Guppys left peg said:

See Marcus Harness has been sold to Ipswich. Surprised me how well his career has gone since his loan spell at Vale as I never thought he was any better than average. Suppose always have to note that anyone who played for the club at that time was not exactly set up to succeed though.

Romaine Sawyers and Jay oshea two more loanees who went on to better things but didn't set the world on fire here.

Harness had something but looked physically weak. He's improved loads and is a good player. 

[Warren]

I think producing a video is good relationship management with the supporters. It further shows the sporting, business and ownership components are in unison and they have plans that appear realistic. In the transfer market it is right to keep silent on individuals until they are certain of arriving or departing. With arriving that is signing the contract. The only reason to vary re departing players may be the objective of influencing the player to stay by promoting a show of fan support on here or preparing the fans for the grief to come. Neither of those hold much water! So it's pure professionalism. 

For me, success this season is to improve team performance to the level where we sit comfortably in upper mid table. Exceptional performance would be improvement to where we are contending for the playoffs.

To be title challengers we need to be able to compete with much bigger supported clubs. That has been done in the past with the likes of Burton and Wycombe being promoted. Those clubs improved their support base as a result and Wycombe in particular has grown. But not enough to be a sustainable Championship side on promotion. Slightly bigger clubs like Rotherham and Peterborough have become yo yo teams.

The Championship is a complex place to survive with nutcase clubs like Stoke City (needing to write off £200 million to stay solvent and within financial fair play even after their relegation compensation payments) mixed with yo yo clubs (Norwich, Fulham, Watford) from the Premier League coming down with compensation payments to assist their promotion again. Then the Championship has a cadre of clubs bigger than Port Vale who have stayed pretty fixed such as Preston. 

For Port Vale to be promoted to the Championship and sustainable at that level it needs to grow support and off field income considerably. The journey has been started with current season ticket sales and investment in the stadium. Long way to go but all I can do is be 100% behind this enterprise and spend money at the club. 

[Portvale4]

I really enjoyed DC, Flitcroft and Carol chatting last night. The chapter on recruitment should settle one or two nerves for some on here. They aren’t daft, they know what they need but, as you can obviously make out, they are going to settle for the first thing that comes around. It’s a breath of fresh, in my opinion.

[Trumpingtonvale]

It was also nice to see and hear how much they obviously rated and liked Dean Whitehead but saw his move as a positive example of how talent on and off the pitch can use Vale as a valuable stepping stone in their careers.

[Warren]

4 hours ago, darren1810 said:

Romaine Sawyers and Jay oshea two more loanees who went on to better things but didn't set the world on fire here.

Harness had something but looked physically weak. He's improved loads and is a good player. 

With Harness he possibly has improved simply by becoming a more effective team player. At PV, admittedly at a bad time, he seemed to be a player who dribbled off on his own and didn't contribute much defensively. I thought O'Shea looked a really good prospect but he has had a committed journeyman type career. I say committed because he has stuck with the main clubs he has been with including Chesterfield. Now in Australia and 33 years old. Time flies. 

I think it's good to keep players who are at their max career level of say League 1 if as a club that is where the club sees it's ambitions. We have a few players who stick around and the only reason to swap them or require them to try to really improve much more is because the club is ambitious to get to a step change higher level. 

[Warren]

Sorry I stray off subject. But there is one bit of O'Shea's career worth recanting from Wiki. I wondered what we might make of this!

"He was named as EFL League One Player of the Month for November 2016 after scoring four goals and providing two assists, including a brace against Bristol Rovers that won him a place on the EFL team of the week.^[54][55] On 24 January 2017, O'Shea joined League One rivals Sheffield United on loan to the end of the 2016–17 season.^[56] He scored three goals in ten appearances to help the "Blades" win promotion as champions, and was hopeful that manager Chris Wilder would sign him permanently in the summer; ironically his parent club, Chesterfield, were relegated in last place.^[57] He was released by Chesterfield upon his return to the Proact Stadium in May 2017.^[58]"

[SFBT]

1 hour ago, Trumpingtonvale said:

It was also nice to see and hear how much they obviously rated and liked Dean Whitehead but saw his move as a positive example of how talent on and off the pitch can use Vale as a valuable stepping stone in their careers.

Something that has been spoken about and needs to be part of the bedrock of progress I think.

Players and agents will be keen to come to Vale.

[Trumpingtonvale]

13 minutes ago, SFBT said:

Something that has been spoken about and needs to be part of the bedrock of progress I think.

Players and agents will be keen to come to Vale.

Hopefully enough will be prepared to lower their wage expectations from us on the prospect of being developed and then having better future earnings elsewhere.  Supports the  narrative that we may have made offers but players/agents are weighing up whether it’s better for them to have jam today or jam tomorrow, before putting pen to paper (or e-signature to email!).

[Wrex]

1 hour ago, Warren said:

Sorry I stray off subject. But there is one bit of O'Shea's career worth recanting from Wiki. I wondered what we might make of this!

"He was named as EFL League One Player of the Month for November 2016 after scoring four goals and providing two assists, including a brace against Bristol Rovers that won him a place on the EFL team of the week.^[54][55] On 24 January 2017, O'Shea joined League One rivals Sheffield United on loan to the end of the 2016–17 season.^[56] He scored three goals in ten appearances to help the "Blades" win promotion as champions, and was hopeful that manager Chris Wilder would sign him permanently in the summer; ironically his parent club, Chesterfield, were relegated in last place.^[57] He was released by Chesterfield upon his return to the Proact Stadium in May 2017.^[58]"

I'd assume finances were behind that loan deal. Or perhaps just bad management. They did end up falling into non-League after all

[Warren]

15 minutes ago, Trumpingtonvale said:

Hopefully enough will be prepared to lower their wage expectations from us on the prospect of being developed and then having better future earnings elsewhere.  Supports the  narrative that we may have made offers but players/agents are weighing up whether it’s better for them to have jam today or jam tomorrow, before putting pen to paper (or e-signature to email!).

I get what you are saying. But overall I think there is only 'now' in football for most players. The career is short and wages matter most.

There is another issue of family background and geographical preferences. Regional, national and international. 

Players and agents can act strategically and Taylor moving to Morecambe is an example of a player who wanted greater assurance about playing consistently in the first team. But what is that judgement? It's a judgement by the player that he isn't confident he can break into the first team at Port Vale. So he is determining his own level won't improve that much by way of coming on as a sub putting in some barnstorming performances and making himself indispensable. He has gone to Morecambe to get a better chance; but is that just a better chance to play at this level and not really a better chance to make progress up the league hierarchy? 

I think there can be a defensive career aspect to this as well. If a player is prepared to accept playing a few games a season, then when the contract ends they are likely to be released. Their CV won't be positive enough maybe to even stay at the level they are at and their market place can become moving downwards. They can find they may need to move down one, two or three tiers to get a regular place. At that level earnings opportunities are greatly reduced unless they end up at a club being bankrolled to reach higher levels.