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Vale Park Capacity


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On 02/05/2022 at 08:32, robf said:

They are targeting the PA system this summer as that's a vital safety element so it may be that they can't do the work on the turnstiles and exits this summer but I would imagine it's certainly there on a long list of improvements. I'm also confident that unlike some former owners they will be working with the council to find out exactly what does need to be done to see every seat in the stands filled and the capacity increased. Realistically, we're not going to get 10,000+ attendances that often during seasons in either L2 or L1 so it's only an occasional inconvenience and one I am sure they will address given time.

Good. We sat in the Bycars yesterday and couldn't understand a word of what the announcer was saying. It was like the PA on Phoenix Nights!

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21 minutes ago, valefan16 said:

Love their ground and its probably around about the right fit size wise for us really. Maybe 15,000 for the big games.

VP has a huge capacity for away fans which reduces the amount of home seats. I'm not sure we'd need that in any new stadium in which case a 12,000 capacity would probably be fine (especially as a lot of the new builds have the chance to expand stands at a later date). 

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26 minutes ago, ValeFanInBrum said:

Good. We sat in the Bycars yesterday and couldn't understand a word of what the announcer was saying. It was like the PA on Phoenix Nights!

It’s the same in the RP now yet it was clear earlier in the season. Temporary speakers appeared which you can only hear if your close by them. I’m assuming work is ongoing to the stadium PA and the temps are only there to adhere to safety certificate

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I’ve said before, the ideal site would have been the old doulton site on Nile street, it’s too late now they are building houses on it.

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It’s the same in the RP now yet it was clear earlier in the season. Temporary speakers appeared which you can only hear if your close by them. I’m assuming work is ongoing to the stadium PA and the temps are only there to adhere to safety certificate
It's being fitted at the moment they have been putting the cables in for the last couple of weeks
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1 hour ago, Conrad said:

I’ve said before, the ideal site would have been the old doulton site on Nile street, it’s too late now they are building houses on it.

no, behnd mcguiness where the new road s being built, straight off the d road.

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2 minutes ago, geoff1 said:

no, behnd mcguiness where the new road s being built, straight off the d road.

I was meaning still keeping it in Burslem.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, ValeFanInBrum said:

Good. We sat in the Bycars yesterday and couldn't understand a word of what the announcer was saying. It was like the PA on Phoenix Nights!

Must’ve been where you were sat.  We sat in the Bycars and could hear everything, albeit with a little distortion at times.

On Monday one of the lads noticed some “horn” type speakers dotted along the front of the roof of the Lorne Street Stand.  Not sure I’ve ever seen these before so they’re either new/recent additions or just another example of me walking round with my eyes shut.

Edited by Guitar Ray

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6 hours ago, valefan16 said:

Are the mineshafts still a problem? I know it cost a fortune with the Lorne Street but Smurf looked into building on the site?

Smurfwaite ultimately looked into anything that lined his own pockets. 

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People discuss moving to a new ground, but would it really be worth it in the end? It's unlikely that we'd be able to build one in Burslem and as a result, all the local businesses (that have already been struggling in recent times) would see the final nail in the coffin. Carol has said that she wants Port Vale Football Club to ensure that Burslem is put back on the map and she is doing fantastic work in the community to ensure that this is the case.

 

Recent grounds that have been built for teams at a similar level to Vale include:

- Burton Albion: a soulless stadium which isn't even an all seater with a very poor away end

- Walsall: a stadium with a very poor atmosphere with one of the only pros being it's easy accessibility. Not many pubs or local shops nearby for supporters

- Colchester United: another modern stadium with no character or atmosphere

 

Would it really be worth leaving VP? Issues which many thought were to do with Vale Park itself (e.g. the huge queues to get into the ground which we saw against Rovers) were solved for the Newport game. Carol and Kevin are investing in the ground and although it will take time, we will have a stadium which we can all be proud of. We've already seen huge improvements with the 'completion' of the Lorne Street Stand (which will hopefully be in full use in the near future) and the promise of a new PA system this summer.

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People discuss moving to a new ground, but would it really be worth it in the end? It's unlikely that we'd be able to build one in Burslem and as a result, all the local businesses (that have already been struggling in recent times) would see the final nail in the coffin. Carol has said that she wants Port Vale Football Club to ensure that Burslem is put back on the map and she is doing fantastic work in the community to ensure that this is the case.
 
Recent grounds that have been built for teams at a similar level to Vale include:
- Burton Albion: a soulless stadium which isn't even an all seater with a very poor away end
- Walsall: a stadium with a very poor atmosphere with one of the only pros being it's easy accessibility. Not many pubs or local shops nearby for supporters
- Colchester United: another modern stadium with no character or atmosphere
 
Would it really be worth leaving VP? Issues which many thought were to do with Vale Park itself (e.g. the huge queues to get into the ground which we saw against Rovers) were solved for the Newport game. Carol and Kevin are investing in the ground and although it will take time, we will have a stadium which we can all be proud of. We've already seen huge improvements with the 'completion' of the Lorne Street Stand (which will hopefully be in full use in the near future) and the promise of a new PA system this summer.


You only picked a few there ans Walsall was over 30 years ago so is not a new stadium.

Burton was built when they were non league so not comparble. Rotherham etc is more the level of Vale.


However you are missing the bigger picture it is more than juat ques. It has so much more to do with the standarda of facilities on offer and also tgw cost of redeveloping VP could be a major issue. If you read further back you will see this.

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1 hour ago, FeedThePope9 said:

People discuss moving to a new ground, but would it really be worth it in the end? It's unlikely that we'd be able to build one in Burslem and as a result, all the local businesses (that have already been struggling in recent times) would see the final nail in the coffin. Carol has said that she wants Port Vale Football Club to ensure that Burslem is put back on the map and she is doing fantastic work in the community to ensure that this is the case.

In my view, it's actually entirely the opposite. 

First point - all the other clubs moving to new grounds are doing it because it is worth it. Whether that's Man City moving from Maine Rd or Rotherham moving to the New York stadium they are doing it for multiple financial reasons - to generate more money.

  • there's less maintenance costs due to the new build and up-to-date infrastructure
  • They are often in better locations (e.g. near a RW station or A road) for events such as concerts and conferences (with the exception of the RW concert we'll never get a license to have regular summer concerts and miss out on all that off-season revenue. There were lots of complaints from houses after the 1980 concert so it's never going to be something you can do regularly in such a residential area)
  • They can have better concourses, bars and shops (thus increasing the amount of matchday revenue you bring in)
  • They have better hospitality facilities so you can bring in revenue for the 300-odd days of the year there isn't a first-team game happening
  • You can factor in more modern innovations such as rail seating/standing into a new build
  • Not a financial reason as such but a less open stadium than VP may also generate a better atmosphere too - a brilliant, loud, vibrant new ground may be more appealing to young fans and may just help bring in a new generation of supporters

And you can build a new stadium, like Rotherham, that still exists in the heart of the town or city on a brownfield site. It's not like Stoke-on-Trent doesn't have a lot of those...

Second point - flipping it, with all the infrastructure work is it worth staying at VP?

  • It's £100k just to put a concourse in the LS stand - a stand still not fully open nearly 25 years after work started
  • £500k (I believe that's the amount) for a new PA system
  • Gawd knows how much for turnstile/exits/toilets improvements most of which were originally constructed seventy+ years ago.
  • A new Railway stand (at least) to replace the 60+ year existing one will be needed soon and would cost millions
  • There could also be improvements needed to the Bycars and Hamil stands which are both 30+ years old (the steelwork in the Hamil is older than that coming from the Chester ground)
  • Three of the stands have no hospitality boxes, two stands have very basic refreshment kiosks with no covered concourse. In an ideal world that would be addressed
  • Then there's the work needed on the pitch which is supposedly £500k plus, I suspect it would actually cost much more if it's to be a proper, long-term fix. 
  • Right now, we only have an approved capacity for less than 10,000 home fans. Not great if we are to aim for higher in the league and bigger crowds. Not great for matchday revenues for those potential big games either. 

I appreciate if it moved away from the immediate area it would impact the nearby businesses but the flipside of that is that it would benefit the local businesses and community in the area it moves to.

I know that's not a nice thing but I can't see how the long-term future of the club should be held back simply to appease local businesses. 

I don't think anyone is saying move it miles away anyhow. There's already been a suggested site a few miles away. Yes, that's not Burslem town centre but it's still in the same area of the city, the community can still benefit and in many respects may benefit more if we can provide them with a newer stadium with newer community facilities.

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2 hours ago, robf said:

There's already been a suggested site a few miles away

Out of curiosity, where is the suggested site (please say Biddulph, please say Biddulph, please say Biddulph🙏😁)

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21 hours ago, Fosse69 said:
22 hours ago, jjvale_03 said:
There may be a million and one issues with Vale Park, but it needs explaining how it differs from other stadiums in the EFL.
The access and facilities in three of the four stands at Crewe are worse than any at Vale. Sutton United is essentially Leek Town. At Harrogate there was two turnstiles and a small gate as an exit for Vale fans spread across two sides of the ground. Luton has already been mentioned. Southend is/was the same story. Apparently Barrow was laughable.
It doesn't make sense or add up. There needs to be transparency between the club and supporters on something as serious as this. It's not great if the perception from fans is that the stadium manager is more interested in creating 'away day playlists' than ensuring we can get fans into the ground.

Sutton and new clubs to the FL have 3 years to bring their grounds upto 5000 capacity, the rules for grounds above 10,000 capacity are more stringent. Vale's current restrictions are probably a matter of priorities since home crowds above 6,000 have been a rarity, away capacity is adequate.

Crewe's capacity is >10k. Ditto Luton.

I would still like to know how/why they are allowed 100% capacity yet we're restricted to 70% (?) in the Bycars and 60% (?) in the Railway. 

If you've sat in the side stand at Crewe or behind the goal at Luton, you'll know the reason cannot be turnstiles, emergency access or facilities. If we're saying that the structures of our stands are unsafe, then surely we wouldn't be allowing any fans in. 

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Out of curiosity, where is the suggested site (please say Biddulph, please say Biddulph, please say Biddulph)
For me if there is still space there would be near the Vodafone centre festival park. Potential raiway if the council would place it and access to A500 etc.
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57 minutes ago, Hoppers said:

Out of curiosity, where is the suggested site (please say Biddulph, please say Biddulph, please say Biddulph🙏😁)

There's a few suggestions earlier in the thread. Land off Reginald Mitchell Way was one of them.

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