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Vale Park Capacity


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1 minute ago, robf said:

I think that's going to be the problem for my "pipedream" - I think most new stadia are built at least partly from the funds generated by the old ground being sold. The problem with the VP site is that it's got no value really as it's listed as a sporting site and even then, you couldn't build on it due to the mineshafts/subsidence. i guess we can always hope the council will help with a stadium for the other team in the city but I'm not holding my breath...

I guess you could say you could build a "new" VP by levelling some of the stands and building new ones but it's the very ground the stadium is on that's the problem - the mineshafts caused the LS stand to go massively over budget while the clay isn't great for the playing surface. 

never a "pipedream" Rob 🙂. Just have to knock it all down, raise the pitch a bit, perhaps change the layout, turn it 90 degrees, Steeper stands. I think we have the space. Play away for 2 seasons, ground share with a decent local club....... Oh there is only us. Well perhaps its a "pipedream".  Thats one option.

We do have the space to do steeper stands , Railway and Bycars knocked down. Lift the pitch by 1-2 metres, use a desso grassmaster pitch. I am unsure if we have the funds though. 

The Lorne Street has to be the focal point if we stay and start a rebuild, if I had the money I would knock down the Hamil, Railway and Bycars and make a oval from that. 

Main thing is the team, no good having a nice ground but poor team.

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1 minute ago, valefan16 said:

Are the mineshafts still a problem? I know it cost a fortune with the Lorne Street but Smurf looked into building on the site?

Amateur answer here but I think there's a world of difference between some of the recent developments (the club shop) and proposed builds (a small four storey block of flats) and a huge stand which presumably needs much deeper footings (if that's the right term)...

I think it's also that the flats were to be on the LS stand where recent survey work had taken place and shafts capped (or whatever they do).

Three of the stands have had relatively recent work so surely that would have involved surveys but my concern would be what will be revealed if the 60-odd year old Railway stand is demolished?

Quite apart from the mineshafts, we may even find the gate receipts for the Arsenal tie buried there.

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I know it's very much a pipe dream but I do think we missed opportunities in the past.
But what did alarm me was when Carol said (soon after taking over) that there is no intention to leave VP. By all means stay at VP now but I don't think you should stop looking elsewhere just in case something does come up. 
By all means, right now the priority has to be VP but I do think you shouldn't rule a new site out just in case the right one turns up one day.
This has always concerned me as a fan is that there has regardless of ownership always been this mindset it has to be Vale Park. Teams have left much more historic stadia for new ones.

We should not be confined to just remaining die to attachment issues. Life changes and moves on. We all love VP however new memories can be created ay a newer one even. It is a pipe dream atm but it is always possible a decade ago teams like Brentford were at a similar level and have since made the premiership and built newer stadia.

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38 minutes ago, valefan16 said:

Are the mineshafts still a problem? I know it cost a fortune with the Lorne Street but Smurf looked into building on the site?

It’s a problem for anyone sane looking to build on the site

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24 minutes ago, Gallifreyan Valiant said:

This has always concerned me as a fan is that there has regardless of ownership always been this mindset it has to be Vale Park. Teams have left much more historic stadia for new ones.

We should not be confined to just remaining die to attachment issues. Life changes and moves on. We all love VP however new memories can be created ay a newer one even. It is a pipe dream atm but it is always possible a decade ago teams like Brentford were at a similar level and have since made the premiership and built newer stadia.

Where would you prefer to move to? Close to the A500 or Festival Park near to the old Cobridge Ground?

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Where would you prefer to move to? Close to the A500 or Festival Park near to the old Cobridge Ground?
In all fairness not a 100 percent certain. It can be done. If it had been festival park near the old cobridge ground that offer was in the 90s and would have been well over 20 years by now.

I guess the Festival Park idea with a link road to Burslem would not be a bad idea. Other clubs cope with change surely Vale could one day.

Its not going to happen amy time soon however.

Not sure if that land is stll empty near that vodafone contact centre.

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We were offered the Festival Park site (on what terms I have no idea) at a time when Walsall and Scunthorpe were the two newest grounds in the Football League. 

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We were offered the Festival Park site (on what terms I have no idea) at a time when Walsall and Scunthorpe were the two newest grounds in the Football League. 
So probably more like 30 years would been there by now.

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There may be a million and one issues with Vale Park, but it needs explaining how it differs from other stadiums in the EFL.

The access and facilities in three of the four stands at Crewe are worse than any at Vale. Sutton United is essentially Leek Town. At Harrogate there was two turnstiles and a small gate as an exit for Vale fans spread across two sides of the ground. Luton has already been mentioned. Southend is/was the same story. Apparently Barrow was laughable.

It doesn't make sense or add up. There needs to be transparency between the club and supporters on something as serious as this. It's not great if the perception from fans is that the stadium manager is more interested in creating 'away day playlists' than ensuring we can get fans into the ground.

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I'm always at a disadvantage having lived out of the area for over 30 years but are there any "brownfield" areas that may be possibilities?

The Rotherham stadium gets a lot of plaudits as a new build still in the centre of the city and that was built on the site of a former brewery.

I do think the Rotherham one is an interesting comparison and they had no ground to sell to finance the move (they were tenants at the Don Valley).

Their new 12,000 capacity stadium cost £20m but they immediately struck a five year naming deal with AESSEAL for a "six figure sum" each year. So conceivably in 20 years it would pay for itself just by that sponsorship deal alone.

 

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1 hour ago, Gallifreyan Valiant said:

This has always concerned me as a fan is that there has regardless of ownership always been this mindset it has to be Vale Park. Teams have left much more historic stadia for new ones.

We should not be confined to just remaining die to attachment issues. Life changes and moves on. We all love VP however new memories can be created ay a newer one even. It is a pipe dream atm but it is always possible a decade ago teams like Brentford were at a similar level and have since made the premiership and built newer stadia.

I have always been hugely pro Vale park for emotional reasons but given that based on yesterday we only have 8,700 useable home seats, maybe it is time to move? 
 

 

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48 minutes ago, robf said:

I'm always at a disadvantage having lived out of the area for over 30 years but are there any "brownfield" areas that may be possibilities?

The Rotherham stadium gets a lot of plaudits as a new build still in the centre of the city and that was built on the site of a former brewery.

I do think the Rotherham one is an interesting comparison and they had no ground to sell to finance the move (they were tenants at the Don Valley).

Their new 12,000 capacity stadium cost £20m but they immediately struck a five year naming deal with AESSEAL for a "six figure sum" each year. So conceivably in 20 years it would pay for itself just by that sponsorship deal alone.

 

Think you've got your sums a bit wrong there, Rob.

100k x 20 = 2m (not 20m)

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1 hour ago, robf said:

I'm always at a disadvantage having lived out of the area for over 30 years but are there any "brownfield" areas that may be possibilities?

The Rotherham stadium gets a lot of plaudits as a new build still in the centre of the city and that was built on the site of a former brewery.

I do think the Rotherham one is an interesting comparison and they had no ground to sell to finance the move (they were tenants at the Don Valley).

Their new 12,000 capacity stadium cost £20m but they immediately struck a five year naming deal with AESSEAL for a "six figure sum" each year. So conceivably in 20 years it would pay for itself just by that sponsorship deal alone.

 

Love their ground and its probably around about the right fit size wise for us really. Maybe 15,000 for the big games.

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There may be a million and one issues with Vale Park, but it needs explaining how it differs from other stadiums in the EFL.
The access and facilities in three of the four stands at Crewe are worse than any at Vale. Sutton United is essentially Leek Town. At Harrogate there was two turnstiles and a small gate as an exit for Vale fans spread across two sides of the ground. Luton has already been mentioned. Southend is/was the same story. Apparently Barrow was laughable.
It doesn't make sense or add up. There needs to be transparency between the club and supporters on something as serious as this. It's not great if the perception from fans is that the stadium manager is more interested in creating 'away day playlists' than ensuring we can get fans into the ground.
Sutton and new clubs to the FL have 3 years to bring their grounds upto 5000 capacity, the rules for grounds above 10,000 capacity are more stringent. Vale's current restrictions are probably a matter of priorities since home crowds above 6,000 have been a rarity, away capacity is adequate.

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40 minutes ago, jjvale_03 said:

Think you've got your sums a bit wrong there, Rob.

100k x 20 = 2m (not 20m)

Sorry I was reading "seven figure" sum even when it said "six figure" not sure why. Oh well...

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, robf said:

I'm always at a disadvantage having lived out of the area for over 30 years but are there any "brownfield" areas that may be possibilities?

The Rotherham stadium gets a lot of plaudits as a new build still in the centre of the city and that was built on the site of a former brewery.

I do think the Rotherham one is an interesting comparison and they had no ground to sell to finance the move (they were tenants at the Don Valley).

Their new 12,000 capacity stadium cost £20m but they immediately struck a five year naming deal with AESSEAL for a "six figure sum" each year. So conceivably in 20 years it would pay for itself just by that sponsorship deal alone.

 

There is land Just off Reginald Mitchell way.There was talk / rumour about the posibility of building a new stadium in that area before. Most grounds tend to be built just outside the towns now.Just off Reginald Mitchell way would work in with that.

 

Edited by melv

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