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Match Thread: Oldham Athletic v Port Vale


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5 hours ago, Biddulph_PV said:

The 3 CB system will always mean you get crosses into the box because you don’t have players in the full back areas to stop the crosses coming in. If we can’t deal with them when they come in then we have to ask whether this really is the right system for us because that how teams are/will target us and we’ve dropped 5 points in the last two games alone as a result. 

This would be right if any of the goals came from conventional crosses, but one was from a deep central cross on a second ball from a set piece, one was a shot from the edge of the box which was headed into his own net by Martin, and one was from a set piece. Nothing to do with 'wing-backs closing down crosses', as none of them were wide area crosses in open play. You've either misremembered the goals or you are just making up reasons to shift from a system which has worked very well for the vast majority of games.

Was anyone questioning the system when we were 1 defeat in 12 and scoring 4 every week? Or is it classic 'systematic overhaul needed' every time we lose, just like Sutton?

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30 minutes ago, darren1810 said:

Like to think I try to be balanced and not knee jerk. 

Still feeling numb, bemused and dumbfounded at losing that game.

Think it was Darren1810 the other day who said that Legge had got better and better and turned into Maldini in his absence, despite us yet to win a game this season when he's featured ! Everyone cried out that lack of height cost us at Sutton but it's more defensive acumen than necessarily height. Cass inexplicably seemed to keep the ball in for the equaliser ? 

There's definitely a case for Walker coming on rather than a defender if we are hanging on. Steel up the midfield and stop attacks further up the field instead of inviting pressure. 

We've now lost 15 points from winning positions. That simply cannot continue. 

Wilson or Proctor on we win that game as we'd of been 3 or 4-1 up. Attacking positional sense is not one of Rodney's best features. 

We can't keep saying it's one of those days. It has to be addressed now. 

I'd actually go to a back 4 myself and controversial here I'd have Benning in a flat back 4 with Gibbo as right back. 

Oldham were absolutely appalling there is no excuse whatsoever for the collapse. 

A huge opportunity missed and this is where DC earns his coin as our upcoming away run in particular is very difficult. 

Onto Tuesday. 

Gibbons was one of our main attacking outlets yesterday, we'd instantly lose that if we had a flat back 4.

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Good morning fellow Valiants,

One hopes you are all keeping well on what is a fine autumnal morning.

Jeff would just like to take the opportunity to ask the delightful people on this platform if anybody knows who is responsible for telling Devante Rodney that he is of a good enough standard to play professional football?

As the individual who made this evaluation needs to take a trip out to sea with Captain Jeff, where we will have a chat and reflect on the regrettable decisions we have made in life. Returning to shore as wiser folk.

All the very best,

Jeff.

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I stand by the view that if we play like that every week, we go up. We've played much worse than yesterday and scored 4 or 5. We were miles better for a larger part of the game yesterday than we were against Accrington for example, when we scored 4 in the last 20 minutes after a red card, after probably being 2nd best. 

Sometimes weird stuff happens, like Aaron Martin becoming prime van Basten in his own 6 yard box. The weirdness of it all was our inability to deal with crosses came when Leon Legge came on, the exact player many have been calling for to help us to sort out our inability to deal with crosses.

If we lose on Tuesday then maybe we do need to look at some larger changes, but until then I think some are engaging in pre-emptive 'this is it now, knew it was too good to last' after 20 years of something similar. Clubs who are more used to success are probably a bit more serene about bumps in the road - we're so used to things going wrong that people take anything amiss as a sign of apocalypse, as confirmation that the little bits of optimism you allowed yourself to feel were foolish.

"Just like last season!", I've read. Righto. Into these on Tuesday.

 

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1 minute ago, Joe B said:

This would be right if any of the goals came from conventional crosses, but one was from a deep central cross on a second ball from a set piece, one was a shot from the edge of the box which was headed into his own net by Martin, and one was from a set piece. Nothing to do with 'wing-backs closing down crosses', as none of them were wide area crosses in open play. You've either misremembered the goals or you are just making up reasons to shift from a system which has worked very well for the vast majority of games.

Was anyone questioning the system when we were 1 defeat in 12 and scoring 4 every week? Or is it classic 'systematic overhaul needed' every time we lose, just like Sutton?

I don’t think that is correct, because either way it amounts to the same thing,  expecting the ball to come into the box and having three CB’s rather than two to deal with it. If you play with conventional full backs, then surely you would expect these to work on the wingers to reduce the number of crosses coming in?? 

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Just now, Biddulph_PV said:

I don’t think that is correct, because either way it amounts to the same thing,  expecting the ball to come into the box and having three CB’s rather than two to deal with it. If you play with conventional full backs, then surely you would expect these to work on the wingers to reduce the number of crosses coming in?? 

Yes but none of the goals came from wingers crossing the ball. They came from set piece situations. It doesn't matter what wing-back/fullback set up you've got, your players are largely in the box. Yesterday was a set piece issue.

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4 minutes ago, Joe B said:

I stand by the view that if we play like that every week, we go up. We've played much worse than yesterday and scored 4 or 5. We were miles better for a larger part of the game yesterday than we were against Accrington for example, when we scored 4 in the last 20 minutes after a red card, after probably being 2nd best. 

Sometimes weird stuff happens, like Aaron Martin becoming prime van Basten in his own 6 yard box. The weirdness of it all was our inability to deal with crosses came when Leon Legge came on, the exact player many have been calling for to help us to sort out our inability to deal with crosses.

If we lose on Tuesday then maybe we do need to look at some larger changes, but until then I think some are engaging in pre-emptive 'this is it now, knew it was too good to last' after 20 years of something similar.

 

Not so weird as it hasn’t happen to us twice in the last 8/9 games and we’ve blown seemingly unassailable leads multiple time in the last 12 months. So yes weird first time around, yesterday probably ‘careless’ might be a better word for it??

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25 minutes ago, mr.hobblesworth said:

Gibbons was one of our main attacking outlets yesterday, we'd instantly lose that if we had a flat back 4.

Absolutely. However first and foremost he's a defender . He's often linked up well with Worrall previously. 

It won't happen anyway . 

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31 minutes ago, Biddulph_PV said:

I don’t think that is correct, because either way it amounts to the same thing,  expecting the ball to come into the box and having three CB’s rather than two to deal with it. If you play with conventional full backs, then surely you would expect these to work on the wingers to reduce the number of crosses coming in?? 

Watch the 3 goals back, and they’re nothing to do with us having fullbacks or not.  Also they didn’t get as many balls into the box that people seem to think they did. Also the WHOLE TEAM is virtually back in a defensive shape in and around the box because all 3 goals come from setpieces.

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18 minutes ago, Guitar Ray said:

Garrity gives us that and is far more mobile.

Haven’t seen BW enough to say that, and he is celebrated as high quality we haven’t given a run of games to show.

(worst sentence ever but all the bits are there)

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17 minutes ago, Biddulph_PV said:

Not so weird as it hasn’t happen to us twice in the last 8/9 games and we’ve blown seemingly unassailable leads multiple time in the last 12 months. So yes weird first time around, yesterday probably ‘careless’ might be a better word for it??

Yeah I think concerning parallels with Sutton and yesterday, though both had weird own goals. Sutton we immediately put right with an excellent run of form. Need to do the same from Tuesday. In League 2 football, strange stuff happens.

I'm not sure what unassailable leads with blown since Clarke came in. 12 months ago, maybe, but the entire club was different then. 

Amoo and Lloyd for me; Amoo was an excellent target man and Lloyd can scrap around the box. It's not ideal but it'll do until Proctor comes back. Yesterday showed that goals weren't the issue.

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38 minutes ago, Guitar Ray said:

Can’t see him being here past January if he carries on in this vein and stays fit.  He’s streets above this level.

Him and Conlon. January is going to be a key month, not only for getting in reinforcements but also to keep hold of 2 of our best players for the rest of the season at least. 

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