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Climate Change. Threat to the World?


Paul6754
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10 hours ago, ginge said:

Something like half of the global emissions are created by the richest 1 percent. Capitalists and the climate crisis goes hand in hand. And for those who aren't worried about it, have a look at what's going on in Greece at the moment.

In 2019 China produced 27% of the world's greenhouse gas emissions, the USA 11%, India and EU27 about 6%. At the Paris Climate Accord China committed to increasing its carbon emissions up to 2030 then try and reduce them after (or something similar) whereas I believe the USA and most European countries have reduced their carbon emissions over the last 5-10 years.

Is China a Capitalist country?

China and 4 other Asian countries, India, Indonesia, Japan and Vietnam have committed to a program of building many coal fired power stations to enable the production of cheap(er) energy to improve their economies and pull more of their people out of poverty. 

Do you think these countries are going to reduce Carbon emissions during the next 10 years irrespective of what they commit to at Paris or any other upcoming Climate forum?

It's mainly the west and the English speaking world who are making commitments and actually doing something to reduce the carbon footprint. This so called Climate Crisis is being driven by a load of ill-informed politicians, left wing socialists and do-gooders intent on introducing a form of Marxism in the west and making us all poorer. 

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2 hours ago, Paul6754 said:

 

This so called Climate Crisis is being driven by a load of ill-informed politicians, left wing socialists and do-gooders intent on introducing a form of Marxism in the west and making us all poorer. 

I was kind agreeing with what you said until this. What do you mean? I don't think you are an idiot, but;

*ill-informed politicians

*left wing socialists

*do-gooders

*intent on introducing a form of Marxism

*making us all poorer. 

As you as a scientist know. The question is, we are dumping a shed  load of CO2 in the atmosphere. And have been doing for a long while. That is fact. Measurable.

Should we worry about it?

I would say so. Very much so. Based on very basic science.

If you disagree that all is fine

 

 

 

 

Edited by toyahw

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13 hours ago, Paul6754 said:

In 2019 China produced 27% of the world's greenhouse gas emissions, the USA 11%, India and EU27 about 6%. At the Paris Climate Accord China committed to increasing its carbon emissions up to 2030 then try and reduce them after (or something similar) whereas I believe the USA and most European countries have reduced their carbon emissions over the last 5-10 years.

Is China a Capitalist country?

China and 4 other Asian countries, India, Indonesia, Japan and Vietnam have committed to a program of building many coal fired power stations to enable the production of cheap(er) energy to improve their economies and pull more of their people out of poverty. 

Do you think these countries are going to reduce Carbon emissions during the next 10 years irrespective of what they commit to at Paris or any other upcoming Climate forum?

It's mainly the west and the English speaking world who are making commitments and actually doing something to reduce the carbon footprint. This so called Climate Crisis is being driven by a load of ill-informed politicians, left wing socialists and do-gooders intent on introducing a form of Marxism in the west and making us all poorer. 

CO2 stays in the atmosphere for at least 300 years. So looking only at 2019 is wrong. You'd need to look at cumulative emissions over the last 300 years if you want to apportion blame.

Over to you.

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2 hours ago, hillmanhunter said:

CO2 stays in the atmosphere for at least 300 years. So looking only at 2019 is wrong. You'd need to look at cumulative emissions over the last 300 years if you want to apportion blame.

Over to you.

Correct but Paul is right, the western world has done huge damage but are looking to correct a lot of the damage they have done and move to negative CO2 yet China and the developing world are the ones who are tipping us over the edge and the more they develop and throw in African countries who will follow suit, we are well and truly screwed.

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18 minutes ago, philpvfc said:

Correct but Paul is right, the western world has done huge damage but are looking to correct a lot of the damage they have done and move to negative CO2 yet China and the developing world are the ones who are tipping us over the edge and the more they develop and throw in African countries who will follow suit, we are well and truly screwed.

Paul is wrong. He's cherry picked a year to support his political view. I've closely followed climate science for a number of years and see this all the time. I could give you a list of the handful of "scientists" he'll quote to support his view. It falls over at the slightest scrutiny.

https://ourworldindata.org/contributed-most-global-co2

Without even getting into the fact that a large amount of China's emissions are for products demanded by the west. We've decided to outsource manufacturing and he'd like to wash his hands of any of the consequences. 

Africa are responsible for less than .1% of total CO2 emissions.  

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10 hours ago, hillmanhunter said:

CO2 stays in the atmosphere for at least 300 years.

So looking only at 2019 is wrong. You'd need to look at cumulative emissions over the last 300 years if you want to apportion blame.

Over to you.

CO2 is removed and put back in to the atmosphere all the time so you need to be more specific about what you're trying to get at with that statement.

Who's looking at just 2019 and I'm not interested in apportioning blame as what's done is done, what's important is the future 'cause that's the concern.

 

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On 08/08/2021 at 05:22, WV said:

I doubt that those you talk about even contribute to global warming. You don't just not do something because its difficult and demanding.  This is more important than a few strugglers in the countryside.  The world will move on with or without them 

Meanwhile,Greta Thunberg condemns the fashion industry over its "huge" contribution to climate change.The United Nations also says the fashion industry is "widely believed to be the second-most polluting industry in the world"?

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22 hours ago, toyahw said:

I was kind agreeing with what you said until this. What do you mean? I don't think you are an idiot, but;

It doesn't take long for you to start the abuse and it does make you come over as very immature and insecure.

I'm still waiting for you to post the graph you referenced showing a 100% correlation between the rise in CO2 levels and rise in earth's temperature.

22 hours ago, toyahw said:

As you as a scientist know. The question is, we are dumping a shed  load of CO2 in the atmosphere. And have been doing for a long while. That is fact. Measurable.

Should we worry about it?

I would say so. Very much so. Based on very basic science.

If you disagree that all is fine.

That's not the main question at all.

The climate has always changed and always will, the earth's temperature has warmed by approx. 1oC since 1875 and the rise in the level of CO2 since 1875 to present is about 200ppm so an increase of 2 molecules of CO2 for every 10,000 air molecules.

Given that CO2 isn't a very good absorber of IR radiation and hence not a very potent greenhouse gas you should be asking the question, How can the addition of just 2 molecules of CO2 into the atmosphere since 1875 suddenly lead to CO2 now being the main driver of climate change and cause the earth to be on the brink of a so called crisis?

You may also wish to ask, What happened to all the other processes and factors that changed the climate before the industrial revolution and before the rise of CO2 levels, have they just mysteriously gone away or stopped?

The main $64 dollar question is however, How much of a role, if any, does man made CO2 play in the warming of the earth and in climate change?

 

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2 hours ago, Paul6754 said:

It doesn't take long for you to start the abuse and it does make you come over as very immature and insecure.

I'm still waiting for you to post the graph you referenced showing a 100% correlation between the rise in CO2 levels and rise in earth's temperature.

That's not the main question at all.

The climate has always changed and always will, the earth's temperature has warmed by approx. 1oC since 1875 and the rise in the level of CO2 since 1875 to present is about 200ppm so an increase of 2 molecules of CO2 for every 10,000 air molecules.

Given that CO2 isn't a very good absorber of IR radiation and hence not a very potent greenhouse gas you should be asking the question, How can the addition of just 2 molecules of CO2 into the atmosphere since 1875 suddenly lead to CO2 now being the main driver of climate change and cause the earth to be on the brink of a so called crisis?

You may also wish to ask, What happened to all the other processes and factors that changed the climate before the industrial revolution and before the rise of CO2 levels, have they just mysteriously gone away or stopped?

The main $64 dollar question is however, How much of a role, if any, does man made CO2 play in the warming of the earth and in climate change?

 

This may help

https://www.wwf.org.uk/updates/10-myths-about-climate-change

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2 hours ago, Coyney Valiant said:

I don’t much about all this global warming and climate change but it seems to me that the media has now moved on from all the scaremongering about COVID and now jumped on global warming with ridiculous headlines you read in the daily rags 

Clearly you don't. Climate crisis is a far bigger danger to us than covid ever was or will be. 

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5 hours ago, Doha said:

Please don't 

This was in reference to people encouraging Paul’s deranged climate change denialism which has since been moved to a new thread.

Edit:  Sorry about that, the little tiddler missed the first trawl in the Thread split,  re-united again.

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3 hours ago, Coyney Valiant said:

I don’t much about all this global warming and climate change but it seems to me that the media has now moved on from all the scaremongering about COVID and now jumped on global warming with ridiculous headlines you read in the daily rags 

More Diretripe to split public opinion and keep the status quo of hate imo

Brexit, Covid now Climate 😳 

Edited by KEV.WILLIE

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28 minutes ago, ginge said:

Clearly you don't. Climate crisis is a far bigger danger to us than covid ever was or will be. 

Agree. Read the other day that counties such as Bangladesh could be completely under water soon. Liverpool as well! In my line of work we are already considering the environment and climate change when lending money / security (where a property is located ect)  Anyone that thinks climate change / global warming isn’t a thing or is scaremongering is a completely nutter that probably thinks the world is flat. 
 

On 08/08/2021 at 21:54, Paul6754 said:

In 2019 China produced 27% of the world's greenhouse gas emissions, the USA 11%, India and EU27 about 6%. At the Paris Climate Accord China committed to increasing its carbon emissions up to 2030 then try and reduce them after (or something similar) whereas I believe the USA and most European countries have reduced their carbon emissions over the last 5-10 years.

Is China a Capitalist country?

China and 4 other Asian countries, India, Indonesia, Japan and Vietnam have committed to a program of building many coal fired power stations to enable the production of cheap(er) energy to improve their economies and pull more of their people out of poverty. 

Do you think these countries are going to reduce Carbon emissions during the next 10 years irrespective of what they commit to at Paris or any other upcoming Climate forum?

It's mainly the west and the English speaking world who are making commitments and actually doing something to reduce the carbon footprint. This so called Climate Crisis is being driven by a load of ill-informed politicians, left wing socialists and do-gooders intent on introducing a form of Marxism in the west and making us all poorer. 

I agree it’s the Western countries looking to change rather than these developing countries. However, surely that is to be expected? They are just doing what we did a number of years ago. I’d argue the original damage was done by the developed nations, now developed they are now able to attempt change and put policies in place. China and other counties will surely just argue and believe they are following what western counties have done previously. 
 

It’s not fair to focus on 2019. There are tens and hundreds of years to look at prior to that where I imagine China will be much lower. Same for India. It makes sense for them to want cheaper energy, just as we and other countries did. It’s not good as we as a world drastically need to change but it makes sense. 

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18 hours ago, Paul6754 said:

CO2 is removed and put back in to the atmosphere all the time so you need to be more specific about what you're trying to get at with that statement.

Who's looking at just 2019 and I'm not interested in apportioning blame as what's done is done, what's important is the future 'cause that's the concern.

 

Specifically, I’m differentiating between natural carbon sequestration/release and the rapid man made burning of carbon that has been stored over millions of years. Let me know if this still isn’t clear. 

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