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Transfer rumours, targets & new signings


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We could potentially end the season with all 5 loans starting, doing well and then leaving and then we’re back to square 1 needing to sign another 5 to replace them. 
2/3 loans are fine, i think 5 is over the top. 
 
 


But that's not the case is it? Of the 5 loan players we now have, 2 are replacing other loans (which we would have to replace anyway), 1 is a stopgap whilst Proctor gets fit, and 1 is to provide GK cover. Once everybody is fit and behaving, I can see only Cass needing to be replaced without question. All of the others, you would think, are unlikely to get into our fully fit 18.
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1 minute ago, philmpv said:


 

 


But that's not the case is it? Of the 5 loan players we now have, 2 are replacing other loans (which we would have to replace anyway), 1 is a stopgap whilst Proctor gets fit, and 1 is to provide GK cover. Once everybody is fit and behaving, I can see only Cass needing to be replaced without question. All of the others, you would think, are unlikely to get into our fully fit 18.

 

100%

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For me, I am looking forward to the midfield addition. I feel we need more guile/ creativity to spark us into life. 
Saying that, the forward line are required to show and look to get into dangerous areas with some anticipation of what MAY happen to create a goal scoring opportunity.

On the season overall, I feel we are moving forward and we have had a disappointing injury crisis. Twenty plus games to go and I hope we give it a real go.

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33 minutes ago, valiant_593 said:

Tin hat on….

Great another loan player… This tactic never works. If they play well they go somewhere else

I don't really agree. I think if you sign someone in the first-half of the season you can lose them (such as Politic or Tom Anderson) in January but these are January to end of season deals. They won't be able to move anywhere till the summer so they are here till the end of the season.

By that time, we may well have our injured players back so - if the loanees haven't worked out (and that can happen, they are a gamble) then they can be replaced by our own players - if they have worked out then great, it's going to add competition in the closing stages of the season. It also means we shouldn't have to rush any injured players back too early.

I get that at the end of the day if any are massive successes then they aren't our players but I can't see what else you can do without breaking the wage bill. To be fair to Vale, in addition to the four January loans, we've also added two permanent deals in Hussey and Hall. 

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31 minutes ago, Iron Curtain said:

I would have liked Tyree Simpson… but we can’t afford him either.

I totally understand you preferring not to have loans. But please tell me you can see the logic behind the decision?

 

Yeah 100%. As I say I just think having 5 on loan, 4 of which signed in 1 window is a bit excessive. 

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10 minutes ago, valiant_593 said:

Yeah 100%. As I say I just think having 5 on loan, 4 of which signed in 1 window is a bit excessive. 

Sometimes life doesn't deal you the cards you were hoping for... making sensible plays based on those is the best way forward.

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I don't get why anyone would have an issue with loan players in January. We've got a large outlay of wages currently injured (Conlon, Gibbo, Proctor) suspended (Cov) or unfit (Wilson). If we are rigid with this wage structure situation, surely cheapish loans to cover these boys (who have gotten us to 2nd in the league before it all started falling to bits) is the way to go?

Edited by Walka003

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45 minutes ago, Iron Curtain said:

That’s doing the same thing 3 times.

I get it… it’s frustrating and he needs to sort his head out.

The point made was that he has a problem and will keep doing it, I’m suggesting he won’t because there isn’t a “thing” he keeps doing…His 2nd and 3rd sending offs were completely different issues.

I agree with this. The first two were the same issue, directly resulting from his transition to playing at a higher standard while also doing something that helps the whole team play further up the pitch. Covolan clearly worked on this and has looked good in this area since his opening day red card.

The third red was appalling. Terrible timing in a big game we were lucky still to be in (actually lucky in part thanks to Covolan's saves) and completely unnnecessary and brainless. He deserved the strong criticism, and might have to do more to win his place back with Stone looking reasonable, or with Holy getting a shot - if so, Covolan could have no complaints. Personally, I would be happy to see him back in the team, since his better, faster distribution can help us create more and his sweeping means we're less likely to sit too deep.

I do think Stone looks a good signing though - he definitely has potential, especially if he can increase his composure on the ball. It would be good if he could get a lot of game time on loan somewhere, assuming Covolan or Holy gets the start ahead of him, though it doesn't sound like that will happen based on Clarke's comments.

Edited by valeitup
correcting a preposition
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Yeah 100%. As I say I just think having 5 on loan, 4 of which signed in 1 window is a bit excessive. 
I personally don't see an issue with it. The club will have both a long term strategy, and short term goals. One of the short term goals, for every season we remain in L2, will be to win promotion. The long term strategy is one of financial responsibility, improving the infrastructure, sustainability and continual improvement. Signing loan players, in theory, fits with the short term goal without compromising the long term strategy. If these loan players help us to win promotion this season, then great. If they don't, then we go again next season without the additional burden of having overspent and stretched our resources for next seasons squad upgrade. Stupid money changes hands in January for bang average players.
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1 hour ago, Iron Curtain said:

The Ale and the Vale pod made a great point on Cov.

His sending off are not all the same thing... its not a systematic issue he has.

1. Wasn't a sending off

2. Caused by trying to be too clever coming off his line... as he was being asked to play

He then ABSOLUTELY stopped doing that, he got his head right, adjusted his risk appetite and was putting his foot through the ball when he needed to

3. Laid one on a bloke that most fans were praying would have one laid on him.

 

He isnt repeating the same mistake over and over and over again.... he doesnt have a career littered with sendings off.

3 in 20 isnt great... but he has some excellent qualities and throwing him away because of it doesnt feel like a sensible approach. Feels a bit overly emotional.

Until that incident he was MOTM having pulled off two fantastic saves. Says a lot for how poorly the team played when your looking at your keeper before my MOTM.

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49 minutes ago, Iron Curtain said:

That’s doing the same thing 3 times.

I get it… it’s frustrating and he needs to sort his head out.

The point made was that he has a problem and will keep doing it, I’m suggesting he won’t because there isn’t a “thing” he keeps doing…His 2nd and 3rd sending offs were completely different issues.

Ultimately the recurring " thing " is that he gets sent off. Not really a stat man, but im sure there are wiser heads on OVF, it is unusual for a goalkeeper to be sent off in the football league whatever the issue. Interesting to know how often it happens in a season. The point being that if DC thinks likewise he probably thinks he can fill the position with a similar quality player who will remain on the pitch. Games can hinge on split decisions, DC may want a goalie who he can trust to make better ones. 

Whatever our opinions it wont be mine or your decision IC

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5 minutes ago, philmpv said:
20 minutes ago, valiant_593 said:
Yeah 100%. As I say I just think having 5 on loan, 4 of which signed in 1 window is a bit excessive. 

I personally don't see an issue with it. The club will have both a long term strategy, and short term goals. One of the short term goals, for every season we remain in L2, will be to win promotion. The long term strategy is one of financial responsibility, improving the infrastructure, sustainability and continual improvement. Signing loan players, in theory, fits with the short term goal without compromising the long term strategy. If these loan players help us to win promotion this season, then great. If they don't, then we go again next season without the additional burden of having overspent and stretched our resources for next seasons squad upgrade. Stupid money changes hands in January for bang average players.

It does yeah. I wasn’t suggesting we spend stupid money on players at all. January is always a mess for clubs but deals are out there (Hall) 

My issue is that we have gone down this route numerous times before and been burned with it. I have much more faith in DC than I did Brown but I still and will always think signing 4 loan players in Jan is a bit over the top. 

I understand these loans might not be on much and in some cases the parent club may pay the majority of the wage, but I still think it would have been beneficial to maybe only sign 1 forward on loan, stick with Stone / give Covalon one more chance and put that money into signing someone permanently that will improve the starting 11 (like hall and hussey) rather than cover someone whilst they’re injured. 

I completely understand the signings - it’s just not something I think is the best route for us to go down. I’d much rather us try a couple of our own young players to be honest, give Bailey a go on the bench and don’t bring in Edmonson for example. 

I posted in another thread, I think because we had such a brilliant start to the season, expectations change, and some fans (me) feel like this could be our best opportunity to get out of this division for a while, given the teams in the league below and their spending power. i just would have liked us to push the boat and sign someone proven up top, just like we have will Hall and Hussey who are brilliant signings. Not break the bank or put the club at risk but just something more given the opportunity. 

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11 minutes ago, valiant_593 said:

 give Bailey a go on the bench and don’t bring in Edmonson for example.

DC would have been absolutely crucified on that facebook group and to a lesser extent on here if came out in a press conference and said Proctor's injury replacement is 1 senior appearance Eden Bailey.

The Eden Bailey who also has been off injured.

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1 hour ago, Iron Curtain said:

The Ale and the Vale pod made a great point on Cov.

His sending off are not all the same thing... its not a systematic issue he has.

1. Wasn't a sending off

2. Caused by trying to be too clever coming off his line... as he was being asked to play

He then ABSOLUTELY stopped doing that, he got his head right, adjusted his risk appetite and was putting his foot through the ball when he needed to

3. Laid one on a bloke that most fans were praying would have one laid on him.

 

He isnt repeating the same mistake over and over and over again.... he doesnt have a career littered with sendings off.

3 in 20 isnt great... but he has some excellent qualities and throwing him away because of it doesnt feel like a sensible approach. Feels a bit overly emotional.

I disagree. I don’t think the issue with the league ones is that they are all separate things, because I think one thing ties them together and thats the fact that he’s felt the need to get himself involved in the game by doing something stupid for no reason. First one if he launches it as he should then he doesn’t get caught trying to be clever on the ball. Second one if he just catches it as normal then he stays on the pitch.  But now opposition  managers will look at both incidents and say to their players that they need to press him when he is coming to claim the ball with his hands or if he’s coming to kick it because he’s liable to do something out of the ordinary instead of doing the basics. 

Edited by PV1973
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2 interesting signings on paper. Cooper looks straight swap for Politic - understandable.

The keeper I expect in straight from the start. I can’t see him dropping a league just to go from nb.3 to a nb.2. 

Really hope money is left in the coffers to sign a creative AM. Feel we need that spark in the midfield to open teams up at home when plan a is not working.

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New 11:

                        Holy

    Smith   Hall   Jones   Hussey

  Worrall   Pett   Garrity   Cooper

               Wilson   Harratt

Subs: Stone, Martin, Cass, Benning, Walker, Amoo, Edmondson

 

Let's put a few past Scunthorpe tomorrow and get the good vibes back!

 

Edited by Beech
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