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9 hours ago, Joe B said:

Main Squad of 23

New GK1

Scott

Gibbons

New FB1

Legge

Smith

Brisley

New CB1

New FB2

New FB3

New DM1 (Griff type)

New DM/CM2 (more cultured deep lying player)

Oyeleke

Conlon

Burgess

Taylor

Worrall

Amoo

New Winger1

New AM1

Rodney

New S1

New S2

 

Release: Brown, Crookes, Joyce, Pope, Montano, Cullen, Guthrie, Mills, McKirdy, RCG, Fitzpatrick, DTS, Chambers, Hurst, Lennon, Bailey, Visser, Collinge

Olagunju and Swan return to parent clubs

Mutual Termination of Whitehead and Robinson

Sign

1 GK

3 FB

1 CB

2 DM

1 W

1 AM

1 S

 

22 out, 11 in. Supplement with a couple of loans and U23 lads picked from Category 1 Academies. Get a reserve team running to ensure minutes, and guarantee development players a % of minutes across the season in their contracts, providing we are above 18th.

Some of the released list hurts; Brown, Monty, Joyce, and especially Pope, but its win + promotion at all costs now and sentiment cannot blind us. The above 4 will be costing us loads. I'm trying to be as ruthless as possible.

Complete reset of the club, after what is arguably the worst (and, at best, 2nd worst) 5 year spell in postwar history.

I've just checked the updated EFL rules for 2021/22 season and it still says we are only allowed a squad of 20. You may need to revisit your list.

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Retained List

The main reason s for the Vale team not performing to the levels of last season are the newly introduced rule limiting squad size to 21 and the compression of the season leading to more mid-week fixtures.  Once the heavy pitches came then the older players i.e. Joyce, Legge and Pope couldn’t sustain their standard of performance.  This was exacerbated by having several players whose injury records are suspect i.e. Montano, Cullen and Amoo.  I hope and pray that Gibbons is not going to fall into this category.

Next season the squad cap falls to 20 and Hurst, who was classed as Under 21 this season, will count as an Over 21 player.  Because of this we must recruit players who are capable of playing  mid week games over a sustained period without injury or performance dropping off.

Contracted                          Renew/New                                      Release              

1 Smith                                  10 Brown                                          Legge?

2 Gibbons                             11 Crookes?                                     Fitzpatrick

3 Conlon                               12 Oyeleke?                                     Brisley

4 Taylor                                13 McKirdy?                                    Montano

5 Burgess                              14 Hurst?                                          Visser

6 Worrall                              15 Right Back                                  Cullen

7 Amoo                                 16 Left Back                                    Trickett-Smith

8 Rodney                              17 Central Defender                       Guthrie

9 Robinson                           18 Defensive Midfielder                Mills

Whitehead                            19 Defensive Midfielder                Campbell-Gordon

                                               20 Centre Forward                          Pope & Joyce

 

Notes

This leaves 6 spaces for DC to fill before hitting the squad limit of 20.

Whitehead contract terminated by mutual agreement.

Oyeleke only offered 6 month contract if completes this season without further injury.

Scott, who will still be classed as under 21 next season, to provide cover for Brown without taking up a squad place.

Recruit 10 under 21 outfield players from the pool of players released from Premiership/Championship sides to make up the Academy e.g. Swan and Olagunju will both still be classed as Under 21 for the 21/22 season.    Under 21s to play regular fixtures together with squad players who are not getting regular games.

Amoo only included because he is under contract.

? indicates players who are vulnerable to being released if DC feels there are players available who represent better value for money or who would give the squad a better balance.

The 3 new defenders must be adaptable across the back.

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1 hour ago, KingRay said:

 

Retained List

The main reason s for the Vale team not performing to the levels of last season are the newly introduced rule limiting squad size to 21 and the compression of the season leading to more mid-week fixtures.  Once the heavy pitches came then the older players i.e. Joyce, Legge and Pope couldn’t sustain their standard of performance.  This was exacerbated by having several players whose injury records are suspect i.e. Montano, Cullen and Amoo.  I hope and pray that Gibbons is not going to fall into this category.

Next season the squad cap falls to 20 and Hurst, who was classed as Under 21 this season, will count as an Over 21 player.  Because of this we must recruit players who are capable of playing  mid week games over a sustained period without injury or performance dropping off.

Contracted                          Renew/New                                      Release              

1 Smith                                  10 Brown                                          Legge?

2 Gibbons                             11 Crookes?                                     Fitzpatrick

3 Conlon                               12 Oyeleke?                                     Brisley

4 Taylor                                13 McKirdy?                                    Montano

5 Burgess                              14 Hurst?                                          Visser

6 Worrall                              15 Right Back                                  Cullen

7 Amoo                                 16 Left Back                                    Trickett-Smith

8 Rodney                              17 Central Defender                       Guthrie

9 Robinson                           18 Defensive Midfielder                Mills

Whitehead                            19 Defensive Midfielder                Campbell-Gordon

                                               20 Centre Forward                          Pope & Joyce

 

Only ones I would consider to renew -:

Monty. Good back-up option at LB and LW IF we can reduce his salary to reflect a reduced role.

RCG I would expect to stay given he's under 21 IF he shows enough potential in training.

Crookes IF he can show his worth as CB in a back 4.

Manny IF he can prove his his fitness between now and the end of the season.

I would try and move on Burgess and Whitehead even pay up the contracts to get rid. The rest of the squad who are out of contract I wouldn't pay in grass cuttings for next season given the contribution to this season.

Time to breakup the spine of the team and replace them with with players in their prime rather than coming to the end of the career.

New Era for real this time!!

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3 hours ago, JRC said:

I've just checked the updated EFL rules for 2021/22 season and it still says we are only allowed a squad of 20. You may need to revisit your list.

Scott will be U21, and then get rid of one DM signing and one FB signing. Rely on Smith filling in at RB and hope Gibbo's issues are behind him.

Keeping Scott as backup over Visser is a no-brainer if the 20 man rule stays in place.

Also highlights the importance of being proactive when the Category 1 Academies release their players. 5-6 of them could come in for pittance, not take up any registration spots, and if 1 is good enough then it's worked.

I hope the days of us having massive squads are done. Sick of it.

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Have been wondering this for a while, and have to ask:
Why have it become the sole responsibility of the 2 lowest leagues, to develop U21 players? 

The EFL realises it decreases competitiveness, as it rises to 25 players over 21 in the Championship. So once again, the sole responsibility falls on the lowest in the pegging order.

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10 minutes ago, Danish Valiant said:

Have been wondering this for a while, and have to ask:
Why have it become the sole responsibility of the 2 lowest leagues, to develop U21 players? 

The EFL realises it decreases competitiveness, as it rises to 25 players over 21 in the Championship. So once again, the sole responsibility falls on the lowest in the pegging order.

It's to cut wage bills. The clubs run the EFL. The clubs decided they wanted a wage cap and squad limits to help stop wage costs from putting clubs out of business.

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15 minutes ago, Wrex said:

It's to cut wage bills. The clubs run the EFL. The clubs decided they wanted a wage cap and squad limits to help stop wage costs from putting clubs out of business.

I know, but the wage cap was deemed illegal. And if they think the squads will become cheaper, they haven't heard of 'supply and demand'. What do they think happens with the U21 players wage demands, when they hold 95% of the cards? It takes an agent 2 seconds to find out, a club already has filled its 20 player cap. So the club REALLY needs this 20 year old. So what happens naturally? Up goes the wage demands. Clubs know they 100% can't complete a season with a squad of only 20 players. So now it's 'big game hunting' for U21s. And all other players demands will go up as well, for that matter. 

They hear the budget is the same, as has been stated at Vale, but there are fewer players around to take a cut. It's simple math really... And it's not like a good U21 player is free or plays for scraps. I'm sorry, but I fail to see the point of this exercise... 

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1 hour ago, Danish Valiant said:

I know, but the wage cap was deemed illegal. And if they think the squads will become cheaper, they haven't heard of 'supply and demand'. What do they think happens with the U21 players wage demands, when they hold 95% of the cards? It takes an agent 2 seconds to find out, a club already has filled its 20 player cap. So the club REALLY needs this 20 year old. So what happens naturally? Up goes the wage demands. Clubs know they 100% can't complete a season with a squad of only 20 players. So now it's 'big game hunting' for U21s. And all other players demands will go up as well, for that matter. 

They hear the budget is the same, as has been stated at Vale, but there are fewer players around to take a cut. It's simple math really... And it's not like a good U21 player is free or plays for scraps. I'm sorry, but I fail to see the point of this exercise... 

It's not the intention but it'll help the National League out as suddenly there will be a load of perfectly competent over-21 players that can't get a club in the EFL.

It is daft though. Now a player reaches aged 22 then he's considered "fully developed" and it doesn't matter that he might have a handful of appearances to his name, he has to compete with 28-year olds who have 300 appearances to their name. Rodney is close to 23 and has been given an opportunity this season, and taken it. But what if these squad limits were in place at the start of this season? He had one EFL start before this season started. Would we have signed him? Where would he have ended up?

ffs at the Euros nations selected 23 man squads for between 3-7 games over one month. League two clubs are supposed have 20 man squads supplemented by under-21 players to last them 50-60 matches and around ten months?!

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13 hours ago, Doha said:

The Sentinel reported it was 50% - https://www.burytimes.co.uk/sport/13312854.bury-linked-with-move-for-port-vale-striker-tom-pope/

I have too, industry's fcked. 

I just think Darren's comment was unnecessarily harsh and not appreciative of the circumstances at the time. It wasn't like he did a Maynard and tried to hold the club to ransom to drum up a matching offer from Bury, he literally just turned down a significant cut from that Walrus bstard on the basis that, in his own words, he couldn't afford it. Mortgage still has to go out. 

You are right i'll hold my hand up i was a bit harsh on him. Also my posts will back up i'm no Pope basher, i sure wish he'd been fit since January.

It's going to be an interesting summer at Vale and we all have our own opinions. Fortunately for us only the opinion of Clarke and Flitcroft ultimately matters.

Pope has been brought back into the fold and travelled etc, there is less panic now to get him in the team. Clarke has talked him up, but he's also been bullish about Crookes, Brisley and Robinson to name but 3. 

Very very interesting summer ahead .

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3 hours ago, darren1810 said:

You are right i'll hold my hand up i was a bit harsh on him. Also my posts will back up i'm no Pope basher, i sure wish he'd been fit since January.

It's going to be an interesting summer at Vale and we all have our own opinions. Fortunately for us only the opinion of Clarke and Flitcroft ultimately matters.

Pope has been brought back into the fold and travelled etc, there is less panic now to get him in the team. Clarke has talked him up, but he's also been bullish about Crookes, Brisley and Robinson to name but 3. 

Very very interesting summer ahead .

Nice one. I don’t know if he’s done any of the UEFA badge courses (maybe he could start at the new Vale university under Flitcrofts football school plans...) but there might be a coaching role in him. He’s managed the Sneyd FC, you see him instructing the rest of the team constantly on the pitch. He’s had enough management qualities to regularly be captain. There might be something in Popey carrying on at the club as a coach starting with kicking the youth team into shape under Flitcroft and Rooneys top down philosophy. 

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I am sorry if this post hurts the players that are mentioned in it but it is my opinion what must be done to get the club moving up the leagues.First of all like to thank them all for playing for the club that i have supported for many years now but there is no sentiment in football there cannot be if you want to be a successful club.For far to long we have accepted through finance that we will just manage and if every 1 in 10 years we could get success that will keep the 4 0r 5 thousand regulars happy but now with the new regime in charge hopefully the vale can start at last to make sustained progress.My personal feeling for people to release are as follows  Brown, Mills, Legge, Fitzpatrick, Brisley, Joyce, Whitehead, Amoo, Cullen,Robinson,Tricket-Smith Pope simply because of age i thank him for his fantastic service to his boyhood club but time waits for no man perhaps he could do something in the coaching side of the club but thats up to them.On the recruitment side i'd like to see Visser given a chance 2 new centre backs, a proper left back [ Mitch Clarke] would do me he could play in a 3 or back 4 easily 1 df midfielder to play alongside Manny another attacking midfielder one wide player and 2 new strikers  who knows where the net is.

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11 minutes ago, hamilboy said:

I am sorry if this post hurts the players that are mentioned in it but it is my opinion what must be done to get the club moving up the leagues.First of all like to thank them all for playing for the club that i have supported for many years now but there is no sentiment in football there cannot be if you want to be a successful club.For far to long we have accepted through finance that we will just manage and if every 1 in 10 years we could get success that will keep the 4 0r 5 thousand regulars happy but now with the new regime in charge hopefully the vale can start at last to make sustained progress.My personal feeling for people to release are as follows  Brown, Mills, Legge, Fitzpatrick, Brisley, Joyce, Whitehead, Amoo, Cullen,Robinson,Tricket-Smith Pope simply because of age i thank him for his fantastic service to his boyhood club but time waits for no man perhaps he could do something in the coaching side of the club but thats up to them.On the recruitment side i'd like to see Visser given a chance 2 new centre backs, a proper left back [ Mitch Clarke] would do me he could play in a 3 or back 4 easily 1 df midfielder to play alongside Manny another attacking midfielder one wide player and 2 new strikers  who knows where the net is.

I think there is quite an issue with Visser in my humble opinion.

As you say football isn't sentimental. But Clarke will be unable to make any judgment on him at all due to his injury. No use just sticking on a few DVD's of the Trophy games. I think he needs to see him day in day out.

It's sad for Visser but i also didn't see him as the heir apparent to Brown , rather peculiar career he has had and i feel a young protoge is the way forward if we keep Brown.

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1 hour ago, darren1810 said:

I think there is quite an issue with Visser in my humble opinion.

As you say football isn't sentimental. But Clarke will be unable to make any judgment on him at all due to his injury. No use just sticking on a few DVD's of the Trophy games. I think he needs to see him day in day out.

It's sad for Visser but i also didn't see him as the heir apparent to Brown , rather peculiar career he has had and i feel a young protoge is the way forward if we keep Brown.

I think a reserve keeper needs to be taken up by someone under 21. There's no use taking up one of the squad places for someone who hopefully will barely feature. If we've seen something in Tom Scott then I'd try to keep him as a potential to be the next first choice.

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