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Match Thread: Port Vale v Southend United


Fosse69

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3 minutes ago, Joe B said:

Backups should be at least league standard, if you want to achieve anything. I don't think any of Crookes, Fitzpatrick, or Mills are, unfortunately. Hopefully we don't have to start them much again.

Backups are never the same standard as the players they replace. The issue has been having both of the fullbacks in the team at the same time. Crookes is a decent enough 4th choice centrehalf.  Mills and Fitzpatrick are good enough to be in a bottom half of the league side but light years behind Gibbons and Montano. 

I watched Joyce today. He's far more effective with fullbacks who push on as he drops into the space behind them. He's been useless recently because Mills and Fitzpatrick sitting has meant he's had more licence to get forward. He can't pass to his own player more than 10 metres into the opposition half. Joyce playing poorly has been as much of an issue in recent games as average players being average.

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2 minutes ago, Old fort said:

Taylors midfield positioning, particularly first half,  was different class, in terms of linking forward moves. Amazing the difference it made when Gibbo and Monty went off.

Sprosons lambasting of Rodney was a joke. Yes the lad made an error, but never heard anyone get dug out so much. Five minutes later,  he started on about it again.

A rare good day for the lads. Well done Pugh.

Sproson was praising Rodney during the match.  He picked up on the lazy pass which cost us a much needed clean sheet.  He was right to comment on that, and the fact that non of our players gave Rodney a b@ll@king.  In fact I'd say this is something that's missing on the park, sometimes the other players need to be far more vocal when a player makes a costly mistake.  Certainly in the games we've thrown away this season.

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Just now, JRC said:

Backups are never the same standard as the players they replace. The issue has been having both of the fullbacks in the team at the same time. Crookes is a decent enough 4th choice centrehalf.  Mills and Fitzpatrick are good enough to be in a bottom half of the league side but light years behind Gibbons and Montano. 

I watched Joyce today. He's far more effective with fullbacks who push on as he drops into the space behind them. He's been useless recently because Mills and Fitzpatrick sitting has meant he's had more licence to get forward. He can't pass to his own player more than 10 metres into the opposition half. Joyce playing poorly has been as much of an issue in recent games as average players being average.

They're a massive drop off, in my view. The difference between Gibbons and Mills, and Montano and Fitzpatrick, is monumental. It's a chasm. I get they're not going to be AS good, but we looked a different side with a couple of good full backs.

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Our squad isn't good enough but we have a best 11 to match any in the league. That means the new manager doesn't have to rip things up entirely and start again from scratch.

 

Brown

Gibbons

Smith

Oyeleke

Conlon

Taylor

Worrall

Rodney

 

These are absolutely fine to start every week next season and the remainder of this when fit and available. You could possibly also add Amoo and Guthrie to that. I'm not Smith's biggest fan, far from it, but with someone alongside him that has a bit of pace he would be fine. Usually when managers get appointed at this stage of the season it's because a football side has next to nothing going for it, with an extreme lack of good players. That's not the case with us despite the league position.

 

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1 minute ago, Guitar Ray said:

Sproson was praising Rodney during the match.  He picked up on the lazy pass which cost us a much needed clean sheet.  He was right to comment on that, and the fact that non of our players gave Rodney a b@ll@king.  In fact I'd say this is something that's missing on the park, sometimes the other players need to be far more vocal when a player makes a costly mistake.  Certainly in the games we've thrown away this season.

Mention it once, sure. I get that.

Lad was banging on for 10 minutes, and mentioned it after the game. The fact is, if Taylor/Crookes had done the same, he wouldn't have been so obsessive. Rodney didn't need a bollocking; players lost possession all day, his was punished by a wonder goal. Was hardly a stupid mistake in his own box.

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4 minutes ago, The Kalamazoo Kid said:

Spot on. If the squad size is down to 21 (or 20?) next season, then the "back-up" players can't be that much of a drop-off in standard from the "first-choice", as they're inevitably going to be called on to play a fair number of games throughout the season.

The three you mention are quite a bit below the level required IMO, if we've got aspirations of aiming to be a top 7 side next season, and therefore should be released this Summer.

The idea is a great one but the better players want first team football and/or more money.  We do have a budget.

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1 minute ago, Guitar Ray said:

Sproson was praising Rodney during the match.  He picked up on the lazy pass which cost us a much needed clean sheet.  He was right to comment on that, and the fact that non of our players gave Rodney a b@ll@king.  In fact I'd say this is something that's missing on the park, sometimes the other players need to be far more vocal when a player makes a costly mistake.  Certainly in the games we've thrown away this season.

Agree with you but Sproson only seemed to slam him.  What about the defenders and midfield for not putting a tackle in.  Nothing about them not putting a tackle in.  Sounded like a cracking shot by Ferguson tho.

It has been commented a lot about Vale being a quiet team and not many leaders on the pitch when needed.  This is the sort of incident that highlights this.  Rodney should be told that was wrong what he did.

But the commentators seemed to go over the top with their criticism of Rodney and not other players who should have tackled Ferguson.  

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1 minute ago, Joe B said:

They're a massive drop off, in my view. The difference between Gibbons and Mills, and Montano and Fitzpatrick, is monumental. It's a chasm. I get they're not going to be AS good, but we looked a different side with a couple of good full backs.

Liverpool look at different side without Van Dyck. On their days Gibbons and Montano are at least as good as any fullback pairing in this league. The other 2 are journey-men league 2 players.

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1 minute ago, Joe B said:

Mention it once, sure. I get that.

Lad was banging on for 10 minutes, and mentioned it after the game. The fact is, if Taylor/Crookes had done the same, he wouldn't have been so obsessive. Rodney didn't need a bollocking; players lost possession all day, his was punished by a wonder goal. Was hardly a stupid mistake in his own box.

Have you ever played football Joe?  There are times when your teammates will let you know when you've cocked up. Even at 4-1 up.

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20 minutes ago, Joe B said:

Backups should be at least league standard. I don't think any of Crookes, Fitzpatrick, or Mills are, unfortunately. Hopefully we don't have to start them much again.

We are certainly carrying to many players. Mills, Fitz, whitehead plus the crocks Cullen, manny, monty add to that Robinson, mckirdy and increasingly likely legg de-registered it’s all to obvious that summers recruitment was god awful and we weren’t ruthless enough with our current lot.

Personally, only monty would be here next season out of those above. And he would be the back up squad player because of his versatility. Harsh on Manny but the lad is another Walsh. Has some potential but will never play enough consecutive games.

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Just now, JRC said:

Liverpool look at different side without Van Dyck. On their days Gibbons and Montano are at least as good as any fullback pairing in this league. The other 2 are journey-men league 2 players.

If Gibbo and also Conlon can stay fit and keep putting in performances like today, then we will do well to hold on to them. 

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I’m not inebriated just because we have won today and have a new manager coming onboard, which should offer us more stability. I’ve taken into account that we’ve played more games than other teams,  but were 8pts off a play off position and 11 from the bottom two teams. Things can only get better.

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