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Taylor signs!!!


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31 minutes ago, Joe B said:

Taylor is evidence for me that there are a plethora of talent at Category 1 academies who just need minutes and some trust in professional football. We got a bit lucky stumbling across him originally (Sproson link, trained with us, didn't start consistently immediately), so we need to make this a standard signing.

Get a Chief Scout like George Foster and send his men out to the PL2 games every week. Have a list of players whose contract is up in the summer in each position. Highlight the good ones. Give 2 a contract on buttons. Hope one pays off. Profit. Repeart.

Plethora is without a doubt hyperbole! There are some but you only need to watch EFL trophy games to see many are over rated and look at the percentage who don't go on to make it in the lower leagues. Players like Clark are on big money for league one and two clubs. Yes there are some who turn out as good league 1 and 2 players. A few even make it back to the big bucks and of course we should try and find them; something all clubs are trying to do. With squad limits reducing further and top clubs having under 23 teams it's becoming harder to gamble on a chancer from bigger clubs as released players tend to be older than 20 years ago. There's not a lot of point bringing in a 22 year old to loan out at non league level, because to progress they need to be playing at our level. 2 players in a squad of 20 next year is 10% so the club needs to be 100% sure they can play 25 games when they sign. 

What the club really need to find is a supply line of under 21s who are good enough to supplement a 20 man squad. That will be the Holly Grail over the next couple of years. That either means players not deemed good enough for PL 2 squads at 18, or looking at the Alex Hurst route of 18 year olds contracted to part-time teams. Long-term that was the motivation for bringing in the coaches at the younger levels.

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2 minutes ago, Jacko51 said:

This signing is a prime example of how a club can benefit from respected owners. Players can now see that they will be looked after properly which was not the case under our previous owner. Not only have the Shanahans saved the club, they have restored its reputation in the football world. 

Sproson claims Salford were sniffing, too, but had to move a player on first (a sign he's well rated in this division).

I imagine most at this level would previously have taken the risk and waited for the extra money/prestige at Salford than go to Port Vale. The fact he's chosen us, whilst partly down to a 3.5 year contract, is also reassuring that we are attractive to a young baller looking to start his career. 

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Have say this is a massive statement from the owners.  No signing is ever “free” and to sign the guy on a long term contract, whilst I assume at the same time we still have to pay the deregistered McKirdy, who hopefully will move on in this window, just shows the commitment of the owners. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

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50 minutes ago, Joe B said:

Taylor is evidence for me that there are a plethora of talent at Category 1 academies who just need minutes and some trust in professional football. We got a bit lucky stumbling across him originally (Sproson link, trained with us, didn't start consistently immediately), so we need to make this a standard signing.

Get a Chief Scout like George Foster and send his men out to the PL2 games every week. Have a list of players whose contract is up in the summer in each position. Highlight the good ones. Give 2 a contract on buttons. Hope one pays off. Profit. Repeart.

But incredibly difficult Joe to weed out the rough from the smooth. The problem is these players are stockpiled and just because they play for such and such doesn't make them any good necessarily .

Locally i can think of Oliie Shenton who was at Lard for years as the next big thing, now plying his trade at Chorley.

It is incredibly difficult to spot these rough diamonds and some of the results in The Pizza trophy confirm such, some have had terrible tonkings.

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Just now, JRC said:

Plethora is without a doubt hyperbole! There are some but you only need to watch EFL trophy games to see many are over rated and look at the percentage who don't go on to make it in the lower leagues. Players like Clark are on big money for league one and two clubs. Yes there are some who turn out as good league 1 and 2 players. A few even make it back to the big bucks and of course we should try and find them; something all clubs are trying to do. With squad limits reducing further and top clubs having under 23 teams it's becoming harder to gamble on a chancer from bigger clubs as released players tend to be older than 20 years ago. There's not a lot of point bringing in a 22 year old to loan out at non league level, because to progress they need to be playing at our level. 2 players in a squad of 20 next year is 10% so the club needs to be 100% sure they can play 25 games when they sign. 

What the club really need to find is a supply line of under 21s who are good enough to supplement a 20 man squad. That will be the Holly Grail over the next couple of years. That either means players not deemed good enough for PL 2 squads at 18, or looking at the Alex Hurst route of 18 year olds contracted to part-time teams. Long-term that was the motivation for bringing in the coaches at the younger levels.

I think it's harsh to judge players on EFL Trophy games, as they're inexperienced and surrounded by inexperience, usually against 11 far more experienced footballers, in a game no one really wants to be playing in. I think young players with superb technique/physical attributes are being produced at a better rate than ever, but simply aren't afforded the path to proper competitive action. 

Players get better with consistent minutes at competitive level, surrounded by experienced players and good coaches. Look at Romaine Sawyers - never played for the Vale but dropped down, got minutes, and is now in the Premier League, for example. 

I don't advocate we be daft but U21s don't count towards the registration, and with a good scouting system and a bit of patience when they inevitably make mistakes, two-three signings of this nature per season gives you a decent chance one of them is decent and can contribute. I'd prefer to have young squad players with potential than some of the late 20s squad players we've got now. My issue is that since the days of Cummins, Bridge-Wilkinson, Goodlad, Pilkington, McPhee, we've rarely gone for this sort of signing. Pleased we're doing it now. 

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5 minutes ago, darren1810 said:

But incredibly difficult Joe to weed out the rough from the smooth. The problem is these players are stockpiled and just because they play for such and such doesn't make them any good necessarily .

Locally i can think of Oliie Shenton who was at Lard for years as the next big thing, now plying his trade at Chorley.

It is incredibly difficult to spot these rough diamonds and some of the results in The Pizza trophy confirm such, some have had terrible tonkings.

Accrington are 5th in League 1 and had a midfield the other night which had 3 players 24 and under who had, in the last couple of years, been released by a big club.

Good coach, some consistent minutes, and look what happens. We could do the same. 

Edited by Joe B

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6 minutes ago, Joe B said:

Accrington are 5th in League 1 and had a midfield the other night which had 3 players 24 and under who had, in the last couple of years, been released by a big club.

Good coach, some consistent minutes, and look what happens. We could do the same. 

I agree, i'm not disputing it just saying it's very difficult.

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Like the lad welcome back Jake Taylor hope you develop into a diamond for the Vale .

As for the owners that's terrific stuff signing the lad on a 3 and half year deal ,a good few days for the Vale fans his goalv Leyton Orient away and the strike at home v Swindon a beautiful strike as I was at that game and they went on be promoted tells you all you need know about how talented this lad is .

Looking forwards to seeing the lad in action on ifollow very soon UTV 

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4 minutes ago, Joe B said:

I think it's harsh to judge players on EFL Trophy games, as they're inexperienced and surrounded by inexperience, usually against 11 far more experienced footballers, in a game no one really wants to be playing in. I think young players with superb technique/physical attributes are being produced at a better rate than ever, but simply aren't afforded the path to proper competitive action. 

Players get better with consistent minutes at competitive level, surrounded by experienced players and good coaches. Look at Romaine Sawyers - never played for the Vale but dropped down, got minutes, and is now in the Premier League, for example. 

I don't advocate we be daft but U21s don't count towards the registration, and with a good scouting system and a bit of patience when they inevitably make mistakes, two-three signings of this nature per season gives you a decent chance one of them is decent and can contribute. I'd prefer to have young squad players with potential than some of the late 20s squad players we've got now. My issue is that since the days of Cummins, Bridge-Wilkinson, Goodlad, Pilkington, McPhee, we've rarely gone for this sort of signing. Pleased we're doing it now. 

PL clubs rarely release good players who will count as under 21s in the following season. The main point, though, is from my understanding of the rules only McPhee would count as an under 21 when signed with the current squad rules. Goodlad was 20 when signed but 21 in the September, so I think he would be classed as 21. The other 3 were 21 or 22 when we signed them. With under 23 teams now at bigger clubs how many of those 5 would have been released at that age if they were playing now?

Taylor on last seasons performances is a good signing. But the point remains a manager has to be very cautious about bringing 2 or 3 players with little mens football into a 20 man squad; which will be the case next season. Stoke spend a fortune on their youth set up yet 7 or 8 never get heard of again after a brief mention in The Sentinel when they get released.

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Every signing is a risk but Jake has done well for us in the past so hopefully the odds are more in our favor.

He is potentially a superb signing, I've not seen an attacking midfield player as good as him at Vale for many a year, he's the sort of player who gets you on the edge of your seat when he gets the ball. 

Well done to the Shanahans for making this happen, no doubt they played a role in making this happen outside of the money as has been said above.

A quality center back next plz if possible.

 

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19 minutes ago, darren1810 said:

I agree, i'm not disputing it just saying it's very difficult.

Very difficult. Will take a few years to get right. Worth getting the wheels in motion, though.

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1 hour ago, Joe B said:

Taylor is evidence for me that there are a plethora of talent at Category 1 academies who just need minutes and some trust in professional football. We got a bit lucky stumbling across him originally (Sproson link, trained with us, didn't start consistently immediately), so we need to make this a standard signing.

Get a Chief Scout like George Foster and send his men out to the PL2 games every week. Have a list of players whose contract is up in the summer in each position. Highlight the good ones. Give 2 a contract on buttons. Hope one pays off. Profit. Repeart.

Surely that's the plan of many however be mindful of salary expectations. What many earn as apprentices or whatever far outweighs our top earners. Timing is a real key.

Edited by CAVALIER
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Very difficult. Will take a few years to get right. Worth getting the wheels in motion, though.
I agree. But I can't see any manager of ours ever being given enough time to see it through. And therein lies the fallacy of continually changing managers just because a few results, or a season, don't go as planned. Crewe had a plan, stuck by DA, and are now reaping the rewards

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58 minutes ago, philmpv said:

Wouldn't it be ironic if the only manager who could get the best out of JT was JA?

Pugh was a witness to how it was done,  Taylor is aware that Askey is no longer there, so not critical to his signing. There  are no guarantees in football though.

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1 hour ago, Jacko51 said:

This signing is a prime example of how a club can benefit from respected owners. Players can now see that they will be looked after properly which was not the case under our previous owner. Not only have the Shanahans saved the club, they have restored its reputation in the football world. 

Exactly.

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