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14 minutes ago, Guitar Ray said:

What really makes me laugh is the certainty which some individuals seem to have that replacing the manager would instantly improve things...

 

6 minutes ago, PortVale4Life said:

What makes me laugh is the certainty that John Askey will turn this round.

we’ve been brilliant so far haven’t we. Great result and performances in the last 3 home games...

And there's the difference. Those advocating for change - please remember that Michael Brown and Alan Pardew are still available! And no - we haven't been brilliant - but we have been very decent in some of the (won) games against teams around us.

10 minutes ago, PortVale4Life said:

We’re dropping down the league... We can’t score we don’t create anything...

 

For crying out loud, man - we're out of the playoffs on GD, having spent most of this season in and around them - it's not like we're plummeting, helplessly, down the League! And yes - we do score goals and create things - you don't win unless you score goals and we have 6 wins from 12 games...we just haven't done great in 3 or 4 games, but, even there, with a bit of luck...and without some seriously awful refereeing decisions...we could have done better! Let's get some perspective - as has been said before, by others - and not start calling for change this early?

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Thought I’d start this thread so it doesn’t get lost in the match threads. Some of our fan base this season has been an embarrassment, calling for Askey to be sacked. We need to take a step back,

Bollox. If you mean 80/90% of posts, you may be close to the mark, but the vast majority of those posts were made by the same half dozen who pop up vociferously whenever we lose. You've fallen into th

I think that the counter attacking way in which we play is probably more to do with the last few seasons performance rather than the way the manager wants to play. We are not in a mid table existence.

11 minutes ago, LancyTony said:

So disappointing to hear some of the remarks on here, over the last couple of weeks. Contrary to what some of you are saying, we have definitely improved, maybe only marginally, on last season, with a couple more points at the same stage.  League and FA Cup campaigns have been disappointing but we are on course with the (oddly-)reviled FL Trophy, which has brought some much-needed cash into the club

Comparisons with clubs like Wycombe and Crewe ARE appropriate, with regards to size of crowds and income, but not managerial stability...or, even, the instability of our previous owner - very few teams have had to contend with a whackjob who threatened to put his own club into administration! Another comparison to use would be Accrington Stanley, especially under John Coleman, who has also been given time to do the job (and has 40%+ win rates for both his stints as Accy manager!).

It's absolutely typical that the criticisms come out after bad results - they are not so stupid as to criticise a team doing well! - are we doing well?...we've been in the top 7 most of this season, so far, with more good results against teams around us than poor results, and are in 8th place, but out of the playoff spots on GD only...so, I would argue that we are doing well! Obviously, a couple of bad results - and the manner of them - have been disappointing, but it's also fair to say we haven't had the first-choice line-up since the season started, through injury and isolation. And a couple of players are only now approaching match fitness. And some of the others appear to be having confidence issues, not reaching the form they did last season...these factors have to be considered and some players given time to regain confidence - which can be such a fragile thing - instead of constantly being nagged at, even when they're doing an ok job.

 

How have we improved?

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17 minutes ago, PortVale4Life said:

What makes me laugh is the certainty that John Askey will turn this round.

we’ve been brilliant so far haven’t we. Great result and performances in the last 3 home games, Harrogate, Carlisle, morcambe ect.  Things are brilliant. We’re dropping down the league. We can’t score we don’t create anything. We will get beat on Saturday but everyone seems fine with that. Why is everyone just accepting this mediocrity every season. 

Most the fans here will always have the bang average club they deserve. They're happy just as long as we're surviving in the football league. Pitiful.

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Just now, LancyTony said:

 

And there's the difference. Those advocating for change - please remember that Michael Brown and Alan Pardew are still available! And no - we haven't been brilliant - but we have been very decent in some of the (won) games against teams around us.

For crying out loud, man - we're out of the playoffs on GD, having spent most of this season in and around them - it's not like we're plummeting, helplessly, down the League! And yes - we do score goals and create things - you don't win unless you score goals and we have 6 wins from 12 games...we just haven't done great in 3 or 4 games, but, even there, with a bit of luck...and without some seriously awful refereeing decisions...we could have done better! Let's get some perspective - as has been said before, by others - and not start calling for change this early?

How many have we scored from open play this season? 

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14 minutes ago, Coyney Valiant said:

The people on here that say replacing the manager won’t change things just watch Mansfield now Nigel Clough has gone there just had a tenner on them making the play offs 

Nobody is saying it won't improve things - just that there is no guarantee that it will! There is a difference! And for every Cloughie, there is a Michael Brown, or Alan Pardew around! 

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10 hours ago, Nofinikea said:

I think you have missed the point Darren.

What point have I missed ?

People are saying don't judge him on 12 games because JR wouldn't of lasted long had we done so. 

I'm not judging JA by calling for his head at all , but questions need to be asked .

The two people shouldn't even be mentioned in the same thread a complete irrelevance 30 years ago to now and the current manager and every manager since bar Adams are not fit to lace Rudgies boots 

 

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Most the fans here will always have the bang average club they deserve. They're happy just as long as we're surviving in the football league. Pitiful.
Purely out of interest TB, what do you do in the weeks we win? Have you and RS Carl got your own little support bubble going on? Or do you call The Samaritans?
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26 minutes ago, PortVale4Life said:

How many have we scored from open play this season? 

Totally irrelevant - are you going to try to argue that goals from setpieces / penalties don't count? Scraping the bottom if you are!

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I like Askey, and think he's done a good job in steadying the ship and getting us back towards the top 7.

Is he good enough to get us out of the league? I'm not sure.

Should definitely be given the season to attempt it, but anything less than 7th needs a serious inquiry.

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20 minutes ago, LancyTony said:

19 points against 16 or 17 same stage last season! Inarguable improvement.

And out of the fa cup. We peaked back end of last season. If we don’t go on that brilliant run we will be behind. Oh and the league is trash this season 

Edited by PortVale4Life

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18 minutes ago, LancyTony said:

Totally irrelevant - are you going to try to argue that goals from setpieces / penalties don't count? Scraping the bottom if you are!

Not irrelevant at all. We’ve hardly scored anything from open play. It’s fine let’s just keep losing to 0. Never heard such rubbish. 

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It's a fair point btw; teams that rely on set pieces/penalties to create chances often do not enjoy success.

Unfortunately, our open play chance creation, one of the key indicator of success, is completely mid-table up until this point. Brown performing heroics from close range chances has kept us up there.

Alas, as always in football, things even out; in the last two games, two wonder strikes with a low chance of going in have beaten us. You can't rely on luck to go up.

Askey needs to employ a proper number 10 behind the striker pronto.

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Final point - as mentioned by others, you should be allowed to offer justified criticism of Askey and also not want him sacked.

Askey's decision making over the last few weeks has been questionable at best, but he's had sufficient success to give us evidence that he knows what he's doing.

I think it's entirely fair that he has the season, but if top 7 isn't achieved, you need to look at why.

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45 minutes ago, PortVale4Life said:

Not irrelevant at all. We’ve hardly scored anything from open play. It’s fine let’s just keep losing to 0. Never heard such rubbish. 

You should try reading your own drivel then! 50% of our games have been won...which means we have created and scored goals - if they come from a setpiece or penalty, that's fine - you have to be attacking to get them!

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I'm not even close to saying that we're playing well or up to expectation, however we're 2 points off 5th, where I thought we'd finish. It's been the lack of creativity that has been most concerning. Of my reckoning we've played:

 

Well against - Crawley, Exeter, Oldham, Cheltenham, Southend

Average Against - Salford, Cambridge, Tranmere

Poor Against - Harrogate, Morecambe, Carlisle, Scunthorpe

 

I would say the worry is that we've played badly 33% of the time, last year I would say we didn't touch that low level so far last year and why we drew so many games. One draw this year is a surprise. 

Askey has a system, and I really don't think the players have been fully immersed in playing that system. We play as if we have a big target man up front, even when we don't. They look hesitant to play forward balls and don't look confident that they're going to find their man in the box. 

However I still think that is relatively fixable. So either play a big target man, or switch your style to adapt to the striker you have playing. No big balls to Cullen all game! And put Monty back at left-back. That move last year resulted in us turning the corner (v Bradford). More attacking play from the full backs is required in this system. You don't get that from playing Crookes.

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Back to my initial comparison to Wycombe, I’d like to explain after someone pointed out longevity doesn’t guarantee success.

This was not my point. Longevity doesn’t guarantee success. However. Look at all the clubs that have had success that are similar in size and budget to us. What do they all have in common? Longevity with the manager and a squad that’s been built up over time. So longevity doesn’t guarantee success but imo success requires longevity.

It’s also worth pointing out that we shouldn’t go s*** or bust for promotion. You see a lot of teams do that and for what? They come straight back down the next year. I’d rather get promoted 3 years from now after having 3 good seasons and then build from there in league 1 and hopefully towards the championship, rather than throwing the kitchen sink at this season, going up, coming straight back down, having all our players poached and then being back to square one. 

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