John Askey

[rider1308]

In reply to the earlier post I agree Askey is just a bloke like the rest of us folks who cares about their jobs and I’m sure he takes every defeat personally and is trying to do his best. On the flip side, Carol and co bought a business at an horrendously over inflated price no thanks to the previous owner !!!! So I’m sure that they will want a return on their investment.

[Guitar Ray]

12 hours ago, Nofinikea said:

So what was the problem when Askey took over a team hurtling towards relegation?  He binned a few players out for causing problems and we stabilised...  that kind of defeats your point.  

Football is probably more susceptible to the bad egg influence than your average workplace if anything.  It only takes one telling a few they are better than the players above them etc..  footballers love an ego massage.  It really doesn't take much and I know the Askey hate mob (not you, they know who they are) are desperate for McKirdy to single handedly come into the team and dazzle after Aksey goes, proving them right because that's what its about, but it ain't going to happen.

I will be enjoying a John Askey led promotion come May, whilst the few, what was the word?  Oh yeh, melts on here who hate Askey will be sulking in the corner.

So you think Askey turning the team around was as simple as binning out a few "bad eggs"?  What about hard work on the training ground?

Either way, I would guess that football is no more susceptible to the bad egg influence than any other walk of life, in the sense that it's made up of a similar broad spectrum of personalities, some of whom are more professional than their peers, some less so.  I think if it's one or two fringe players unsettled, as is being suggested, it's not a major problem.  You can only put 11 players out on the park so it's normal for players to know what it's like to miss out and not over-react.  It's part of the job.  It's also quite common to read "so and so is training with the kids".  It happens at football clubs across the land.  People fall out.  All sorts of things happen in any workplace and mostly people just get on with things.  It doesn't automatically lead to the wheels falling off.  The real problems start when you have cliques of players in the squad, along with major disciplinary issues, as would appear to have been the case when Askey took charge.

[darren1810]

The Bolton forum, wanderers way are praising Askey and his tactics for sussing out their weaknesses and fully exploiting it.

One of the quotes, ' Askey did a job on us ' 

[vale victory]

So you think Askey turning the team around was as simple as binning out a few "bad eggs"?  What about hard work on the training ground?
Either way, I would guess that football is no more susceptible to the bad egg influence than any other walk of life, in the sense that it's made up of a similar broad spectrum of personalities, some of whom are more professional than their peers, some less so.  I think if it's one or two fringe players unsettled, as is being suggested, it's not a major problem.  You can only put 11 players out on the park so it's normal for players to know what it's like to miss out and not over-react.  It's part of the job.  It's also quite common to read "so and so is training with the kids".  It happens at football clubs across the land.  People fall out.  All sorts of things happen in any workplace and mostly people just get on with things.  It doesn't automatically lead to the wheels falling off.  The real problems start when you have cliques of players in the squad, along with major disciplinary issues, as would appear to have been the case when Askey took charge.

I wouldn’t say 1 win in 7 constitutes turning the team around , lose on Saturday the vultures will be circling again

[rayzer]

I know this is an Askey thread but how is Stuart McAll still in a job at Bradford?

[Guitar Ray]

16 minutes ago, vale victory said:

I wouldn’t say 1 win in 7 constitutes turning the team around , lose on Saturday the vultures will be circling again

The comment I replied to alludes to when JA took over rather than the current situation.

[werstayinup]

3 hours ago, rayzer said:

I know this is an Askey thread but how is Stuart McAll still in a job at Bradford?

I am sure they gave him a new contract last week as well

[darren1810]

29 minutes ago, werstayinup said:

I am sure they gave him a new contract last week as well

They did and Bradford fans are mystified.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/55093262

[Joe B]

5 hours ago, darren1810 said:

The Bolton forum, wanderers way are praising Askey and his tactics for sussing out their weaknesses and fully exploiting it.

One of the quotes, ' Askey did a job on us ' 

Askey did well on Saturday, but his style of play was perfect to exploit them.

3 at the back with a high line (against our three forwards who had acres of space in the channels), a commitment to passing from the back (easily disrupted by our high press), an open game as they wanted to attack and score (allowing us to attack on the break which suits our style more than breaking deeper lying teams)

We know Askey can win these games; Crewe, Swindon, Plymouth, Exeter, Colchester, and Bolton have all been spun with his tactics.

It's the games against Scunthorpe, Stevenage, Macclesfield, Grimsby, Mansfield etc where he has historically struggled. He needs to figure out games where teams turn up to frustrate, and not entertain as Bolton did on Saturday.

Some will see this as a dig but Saturday only reinforced what we know about Askey; he can play the underdog brilliantly, to the extent where he nearly got us into the top 7. Colchester and FGR should be much the same. 

[MBE]

4 hours ago, Joe B said:

Askey did well on Saturday, but his style of play was perfect to exploit them.

3 at the back with a high line (against our three forwards who had acres of space in the channels), a commitment to passing from the back (easily disrupted by our high press), an open game as they wanted to attack and score (allowing us to attack on the break which suits our style more than breaking deeper lying teams)

We know Askey can win these games; Crewe, Swindon, Plymouth, Exeter, Colchester, and Bolton have all been spun with his tactics.

It's the games against Scunthorpe, Stevenage, Macclesfield, Grimsby, Mansfield etc where he has historically struggled. He needs to figure out games where teams turn up to frustrate, and not entertain as Bolton did on Saturday.

Some will see this as a dig but Saturday only reinforced what we know about Askey; he can play the underdog brilliantly, to the extent where he nearly got us into the top 7. Colchester and FGR should be much the same. 

Absolutely spot on. 

[darren1810]

12 hours ago, Joe B said:

Askey did well on Saturday, but his style of play was perfect to exploit them.

3 at the back with a high line (against our three forwards who had acres of space in the channels), a commitment to passing from the back (easily disrupted by our high press), an open game as they wanted to attack and score (allowing us to attack on the break which suits our style more than breaking deeper lying teams)

We know Askey can win these games; Crewe, Swindon, Plymouth, Exeter, Colchester, and Bolton have all been spun with his tactics.

It's the games against Scunthorpe, Stevenage, Macclesfield, Grimsby, Mansfield etc where he has historically struggled. He needs to figure out games where teams turn up to frustrate, and not entertain as Bolton did on Saturday.

Some will see this as a dig but Saturday only reinforced what we know about Askey; he can play the underdog brilliantly, to the extent where he nearly got us into the top 7. Colchester and FGR should be much the same. 

All good points Joe.

Only slight disagreement is are Port Vale really the underdog against anyone in this division apart from Bolton, Bradford, Salford and maybe Mansfield with their spending power.

In terms of the League table we are the underdog maybe we need to bull ourselves up more instead of cosy little old Port Vale from a sleepy backwater somewhere in The Midlands, or is it Wales ? 

[Joe B]

10 hours ago, darren1810 said:

All good points Joe.

Only slight disagreement is are Port Vale really the underdog against anyone in this division apart from Bolton, Bradford, Salford and maybe Mansfield with their spending power.

In terms of the League table we are the underdog maybe we need to bull ourselves up more instead of cosy little old Port Vale from a sleepy backwater somewhere in The Midlands, or is it Wales ? 

I 100% agree, and have advocated an end to 'mid-table/existence will do' for a while. We get 4000 STs, get 4500-5000 every home game, a massive financial advantage over most, and should be firmly in contention for playoffs every year we're in this league. If we're not then questions should be asked. I don't think this is demanding.

Askey's style of play though is more suited to when an opponent thinks they can attack, was my point. 

[wotsyobeef]

I 100% agree, and have advocated an end to 'mid-table/existence will do' for a while. We get 4000 STs, get 4500-5000 every home game, a massive financial advantage over most, and should be firmly in contention for playoffs every year we're in this league. If we're not then questions should be asked. I don't think this is demanding.
Askey's style of play though is more suited to when an opponent thinks they can attack, was my point. 

I think that the counter attacking way in which we play is probably more to do with the last few seasons performance rather than the way the manager wants to play. We are not in a mid table existence. Before last season we nearly went out of the league 2 years in a row. We have only had one season in mid table.


The season before last we were awful and just avoided relegation for the 2nd season running having been relegated the season before.


I think players look at how a club has done when signing. For Askeys first summer window we were a club with unproven owners who had had 3 bad seasons. He managed to change the team around from one that was performing less than the sum of its parts to one than was performing greater than the sum of its parts. We had a great run before the season ended due to Covid. Whilst we all like to think that that run would have continued and we would have won the playoffs it is just as likely that it wouldn't have and we would have finished 8th or lower.


To a player looking in from outside we improved but weren't quite good enough for a playoff spot.


So this summer gone we are a bit more attractive to players but are a club that has had 2 bad seasons followed by a reasonable one. In that situation you are unlikely to attract big players unless you pay over the odds.


We chose to focus on the squad and whilst the players that we have brought in maybe don't improve the first team I think they are stronger than the replacements that we had last season.


This season we are performing at a similar level to last season although we are winning and losing more and drawing less. This to me is part of the evolution from a midtable team to a top 7. When it goes wrong it goes very wrong and doesn't look pretty. Teams that played us last season approach games in a different way and make it difficult.


This season if we can push on and get into the playoffs great. If not then we need to ensure that we are in or around the playoffs. If we do then next summer all of a sudden we are a more attractive league 2 team for players to sign for. Players who would have signed for a lower league 1 team and sat on the bench last summer may consider signing for a consistent top half league 2 team for a bit less money where they are going to play and likely to win games and look good.


Slow progression is the best way to improve as that way it costs less and you are in a financial position to make the next step up rather than having used your gamble to get to the position you are currently in.

[SFBT]

11 hours ago, wotsyobeef said:

I think that the counter attacking way in which we play is probably more to do with the last few seasons performance rather than the way the manager wants to play. We are not in a mid table existence. Before last season we nearly went out of the league 2 years in a row. We have only had one season in mid table.


The season before last we were awful and just avoided relegation for the 2nd season running having been relegated the season before.


I think players look at how a club has done when signing. For Askeys first summer window we were a club with unproven owners who had had 3 bad seasons. He managed to change the team around from one that was performing less than the sum of its parts to one than was performing greater than the sum of its parts. We had a great run before the season ended due to Covid. Whilst we all like to think that that run would have continued and we would have won the playoffs it is just as likely that it wouldn't have and we would have finished 8th or lower.


To a player looking in from outside we improved but weren't quite good enough for a playoff spot.


So this summer gone we are a bit more attractive to players but are a club that has had 2 bad seasons followed by a reasonable one. In that situation you are unlikely to attract big players unless you pay over the odds.


We chose to focus on the squad and whilst the players that we have brought in maybe don't improve the first team I think they are stronger than the replacements that we had last season.


This season we are performing at a similar level to last season although we are winning and losing more and drawing less. This to me is part of the evolution from a midtable team to a top 7. When it goes wrong it goes very wrong and doesn't look pretty. Teams that played us last season approach games in a different way and make it difficult.


This season if we can push on and get into the playoffs great. If not then we need to ensure that we are in or around the playoffs. If we do then next summer all of a sudden we are a more attractive league 2 team for players to sign for. Players who would have signed for a lower league 1 team and sat on the bench last summer may consider signing for a consistent top half league 2 team for a bit less money where they are going to play and likely to win games and look good.


Slow progression is the best way to improve as that way it costs less and you are in a financial position to make the next step up rather than having used your gamble to get to the position you are currently in.

Brilliant analysis.

Thank you.

[dazzerjames]

I think that the counter attacking way in which we play is probably more to do with the last few seasons performance rather than the way the manager wants to play. We are not in a mid table existence. Before last season we nearly went out of the league 2 years in a row. We have only had one season in mid table.


The season before last we were awful and just avoided relegation for the 2nd season running having been relegated the season before.


I think players look at how a club has done when signing. For Askeys first summer window we were a club with unproven owners who had had 3 bad seasons. He managed to change the team around from one that was performing less than the sum of its parts to one than was performing greater than the sum of its parts. We had a great run before the season ended due to Covid. Whilst we all like to think that that run would have continued and we would have won the playoffs it is just as likely that it wouldn't have and we would have finished 8th or lower.


To a player looking in from outside we improved but weren't quite good enough for a playoff spot.


So this summer gone we are a bit more attractive to players but are a club that has had 2 bad seasons followed by a reasonable one. In that situation you are unlikely to attract big players unless you pay over the odds.


We chose to focus on the squad and whilst the players that we have brought in maybe don't improve the first team I think they are stronger than the replacements that we had last season.


This season we are performing at a similar level to last season although we are winning and losing more and drawing less. This to me is part of the evolution from a midtable team to a top 7. When it goes wrong it goes very wrong and doesn't look pretty. Teams that played us last season approach games in a different way and make it difficult.


This season if we can push on and get into the playoffs great. If not then we need to ensure that we are in or around the playoffs. If we do then next summer all of a sudden we are a more attractive league 2 team for players to sign for. Players who would have signed for a lower league 1 team and sat on the bench last summer may consider signing for a consistent top half league 2 team for a bit less money where they are going to play and likely to win games and look good.


Slow progression is the best way to improve as that way it costs less and you are in a financial position to make the next step up rather than having used your gamble to get to the position you are currently in.

Most sensible , balanced post I’ve read on here . I agree ️. People after a fast fix which just doesn’t exist unless someone wants to throw millions at it which we can’t. Stable and steady progress with the continued improvements off the field certainly suits me for now ! Can always be re assessed at the end of the season.