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There's a bunch of Starmer teat suckling labourites defending his ineptitude, insisting he is perfect in every way and try to shift the blame when Labour mistakes are raised.

 

😂

 

He could have taken action months ago. The evidence was readily available during the last election run, I and a few other posters had posted much of it on here. A more cynical person than me would say he has waited until this decision was made for him. He's gone from taking seemingly zero action against Corbyn to suspending him from the party and has managed to get most people applauding him instead of asking why it's taken this long to take any action.

The actual reason for the suspension is based on JC's comments today apparently. He'd made similar comments previously although not during Starmer's reign to my knowledge. Still is that enough to wash your hands of the problem for 6 months?

 

It's good that these things are being taken seriously, but has JC been suspended because Starmer wants to stamp out anti-semitism in the party or because he thinks the media/labour voters/critics want a pound of flesh?

 

Interesting few weeks ahead for the labour party.

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To be really disappointed they need to have lived through a Labour goverment?

Thank goodness for new management. “It is encouraging to see the Party’s new leadership has committed to implementing our recommendations in full.“

Tories forever more is a frightening prospect. 

20 minutes ago, Regal Beagle said:

There's a bunch of Starmer teat suckling labourites defending his ineptitude, insisting he is perfect in every way and try to shift the blame when Labour mistakes are raised.

 

😂

 

He could have taken action months ago. The evidence was readily available during the last election run, I and a few other posters had posted much of it on here. A more cynical person than me would say he has waited until this decision was made for him. He's gone from taking seemingly zero action against Corbyn to suspending him from the party and has managed to get most people applauding him instead of asking why it's taken this long to take any action.

The actual reason for the suspension is based on JC's comments today apparently. He'd made similar comments previously although not during Starmer's reign to my knowledge. Still is that enough to wash your hands of the problem for 6 months?

 

It's good that these things are being taken seriously, but has JC been suspended because Starmer wants to stamp out anti-semitism in the party or because he thinks the media/labour voters/critics want a pound of flesh?

 

Interesting few weeks ahead for the labour party.

If you are looking for instant action you won't find it in politics. There has to be a significant ground swell to get political leaders to take action against one of their own.

Huge public outcry, extremely bad media reaction, damage to party chances of winning an election or more likely a combination of the above. Even then it's rare for an instant reaction.

I think Labour are failing or had failed to realise it's not the party faithful that win you an election it's the people.

Hopefully they will turn it around and get back in contention. It will be a mirical if it's next time.. but they have the Tories incompetent handling of corona virus to help out.

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The problem is that a Labour Party under Corbyn was unelectable. So it didn’t matter how principled he might be he was never going to be in a position to implement those ideals.  He couldn’t beat May when she was loathed by numbers in her own party and he could beat Johnson - the most dishonest and disreputable politician of his generation. Corbyn was made for opposition - is that what you really wanted?  

 

Of course I don't want opposition. I believe that if large parts of the party hadn't sought to actively undermine  Corbyn, then we'd have won in 2017. Are you familiar with the leaked report or the disgusting behaviour from those in Southside and the likes of Tom Watson and Ian Watson outlined in Left Out and This Land? I feel that whilst Labour lost the general election, I don't think it necessarily follows that it was solely due to Corbyn, or that another socialist leader is unelectable or that socialist policies aren't popular. The vast majority of Labour's manifesto in 2019 was very popular with voters and I suspect it would be even more so now. I also think Corbyn has shifted the Overton Window dramatically.

I see first-hand the destruction that the tories are causing to vulnerable and impoverished areas every day of my working life and I do not think for one second that a toady milquetoast lickspittle like "Sir" Keir Starmer is the person to being about the changes necessary to improve these lives. He's a watered down Ed Milliband, a beiger Gordon Brown; they did well, didn't they?

Edited by mr.hobblesworth
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1 minute ago, geosname said:

If you are looking for instant action you won't find it in politics. There has to be a significant ground swell to get political leaders to take action against one of their own.

Huge public outcry, extremely bad media reaction, damage to party chances of winning an election or more likely a combination of the above. Even then it's rare for an instant reaction.

I think Labour are failing or had failed to realise it's not the party faithful that win you an election it's the people.

Hopefully they will turn it around and get back in contention. It will be a mirical if it's next time.. but they have the Tories incompetent handling of corona virus to help out.

100% spot on there I think. They don't appeal to their traditional voters any more. It's amazing how obvious to everyone it is but they still don't seem to accept it. That being said, Starmer does show signs that he at least gets that but whether or not he will have the stones to do anything about it is another question.

 

We need a strong opposition. As bad as Johnson has been over the last few months, Starmer basically nods along with everything he says and then questions him on it 2 weeks later. It's almost non-existent. Scoring cheap shots in PMQs 2 weeks after the fact as if it changes anything. Why are the tories still polling better despite their 'collapse' ? - Some will say it's because the nation is duped. That's their go to excuse for explaining things that they don't like. But the fact is that Starmer doesn't offer a viable opposition to Johnson currently, despite a British PM never being as vulnerable as Boris is, for decades. 

 

He could be biding his time considering there's potentially 4 more years until an election, but that's a staggering lack of ambition if you ask me. 

 

He should pilling misery on Johnson or he should be backing him during an unprecedented (in modern times) pandemic. Dancing between the two isn't winning him any more voters because the majority of people see through it.

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43 minutes ago, mr.hobblesworth said:

 

Of course I don't want opposition. I believe that if large parts of the party hadn't sought to actively undermine  Corbyn, then we'd have won in 2017. Are you familiar with the leaked report or the disgusting behaviour from those in Southside and the likes of Tom Watson and Ian Watson outlined in Left Out and This Land? I feel that whilst Labour lost the general election, I don't think it necessarily follows that it was solely due to Corbyn, or that another socialist leader is unelectable or that socialist policies aren't popular. The vast majority of Labour's manifesto in 2019 was very popular with voters and I suspect it would be even more so now. I also think Corbyn has shifted the Overton Window dramatically.

I see first-hand the destruction that the tories are causing to vulnerable and impoverished areas every day of my working life and I do not think for one second that a toady milquetoast lickspittle like "Sir" Keir Starmer is the person to being about the changes necessary to improve these lives. He's a watered down Ed Milliband, a beiger Gordon Brown; they did well, didn't they?

If the party is going to be so self destructive how is it going to lead the people to believe it can run the country?

The big issue in the last election was brexit and Labour screwed it up by trying to give everyone what they wanted and no one got anything. Telling leavers they would get a deal to leave and telling remainers they could have another referendum and the party would campaign to remain is utter confusing gibberish and pulled down the "red wall" and by losing so many seats it gave the Tories free reign. 

The problem they face now is the voters have lost faith in them and it's bloody difficult to regain it...... although Boris is doing his best to give them a leg up they have to help themselves.

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54 minutes ago, Regal Beagle said:

100% spot on there I think. They don't appeal to their traditional voters any more. It's amazing how obvious to everyone it is but they still don't seem to accept it. That being said, Starmer does show signs that he at least gets that but whether or not he will have the stones to do anything about it is another question.

 

We need a strong opposition. As bad as Johnson has been over the last few months, Starmer basically nods along with everything he says and then questions him on it 2 weeks later. It's almost non-existent. Scoring cheap shots in PMQs 2 weeks after the fact as if it changes anything. Why are the tories still polling better despite their 'collapse' ? - Some will say it's because the nation is duped. That's their go to excuse for explaining things that they don't like. But the fact is that Starmer doesn't offer a viable opposition to Johnson currently, despite a British PM never being as vulnerable as Boris is, for decades. 

 

He could be biding his time considering there's potentially 4 more years until an election, but that's a staggering lack of ambition if you ask me. 

 

He should pilling misery on Johnson or he should be backing him during an unprecedented (in modern times) pandemic. Dancing between the two isn't winning him any more voters because the majority of people see through it.

I hope starmer is keeping his powder dry and just firing off the odd warning shot to remind everyone Labour is still alive.

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5 minutes ago, geosname said:

I hope starmer is keeping his powder dry and just firing off the odd warning shot to remind everyone Labour is still alive.

Seeing the news today I fear that Labour is about to eat itself.

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I really wish that there could be a separate Tory bashing thread. Where these relentless Tory bashers could just go and do their thing. Even on this thread about Labour, it comes around to Tory bashing. See above. 

How come they win elections? because more people vote for them. The relentless left wing moaning on here is so tedious. And I'm not even a Tory.

Just start a dedicated left wing anti-government thread where they can circle-jerk.  And stop hijacking all conversation.

Edited by toyahw
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30 minutes ago, toyahw said:

I really wish that there could be a separate Tory bashing thread. Where these relentless Tory bashers could just go and do their thing. Even on this thread about Labour, it comes around to Tory bashing. See above. 

How come they win elections? because more people vote for them. The relentless left wing moaning on here is so tedious. And I'm not even a Tory.

Just start a dedicated left wing anti-government thread where they can circle-jerk.  And stop hijacking all conversation.

Rubbish. You don't need to be left wing to see that this Government is totally inept.

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42 minutes ago, toyahw said:

I really wish that there could be a separate Tory bashing thread. Where these relentless Tory bashers could just go and do their thing. Even on this thread about Labour, it comes around to Tory bashing. See above. 

How come they win elections? because more people vote for them. The relentless left wing moaning on here is so tedious. And I'm not even a Tory.

Just start a dedicated left wing anti-government thread where they can circle-jerk.  And stop hijacking all conversation.

Any anti-tory threads end up with anti-Labour posts and anti-Labour threads end up with anti-tory posts. You can't really discuss one without others discussing the other, I've tried. 

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3 minutes ago, mr.hobblesworth said:

Any anti-tory threads end up with anti-Labour posts and anti-Labour threads end up with anti-tory posts. You can't really discuss one without others discussing the other, I've tried. 

Fair point,

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This is clearly very serious for Labour. Already, the Campaign Against Antisemitism, which first made the formal complaint to the EHRC, have followed this up with a letter to Sir Keir, resubmitting their original complaint against Jeremy Corbyn with additional evidence and making new complaints against 15 former and current MPs, Councillors and other members of the party. These include Sir Keir's deputy leader, Angela Rayner, Dianne Abbot, Rebecca Long Bailey and Richard Burgon.

Their letter can be found here: https://antisemitism.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/Complaint-letter-to-Keir-Starmer-and-David-Evans.pdf

Sorry it's so long but I couldn't separate the annex with all the evidence from the letter. Of local interest, one of the persons subject to complaint is Mark McDonald, former parliamentary candidate for Stoke on Trent South, while an incident involving Ruth Smeeth is part of the complaint against Jeremy Corbyn (para 17). 

The other matter that might surface again is yet more legal action by former Labour staff, potentially leading to significant financial damages.

Sir Keir has a lot ahead of him.

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Maybe Lisa Nandy should be added to that list.
 

 

But we all know she won't, will she? Same as Barry "run on silver shekels" Sheerman and Rachel "Lets erect a statue to a nazi sympathiser" Reeves won't. 

Meanwhile Sir Keith is proving himself to be about as forensic as my big toe.

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I really don't think the Labour party has a major problem with anti-Semitism. But it has some. Disentangling anti-Semitism from opposing Israeli policy is a tricky problem. But a necessary line to draw. Corbijn never grasped that nettle. And he was kicked out for his comments on the report today. Quite rightly so. Still passing the buck and equivocating.

I can't see this causing major problems for Labour. Corbijn was yesterdays man tomorrow. 

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