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The House of Lords


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No,  a second house plays an important role. However it does need to be different. No life peers,  no hereditary peers and no lords spiritual. I flip flop on the next bit though. If we want a fully elected lords, then they probably need more power but we risk losing expertise. We know what people think of experts currently. If we have an appointed house to provide oversight then they shouldn’t have powers to change or reject legislation, as we don’t live in a perfect world and who they know and how much they donate to a political party may influence their appointment. 
 

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22 hours ago, Jacko51 said:

Should we get rid of it?

It's a temptation.

We need a second house/chamber to counterbalance the first, if they are elected you get the same party politics and stagnation..... if they are selected you get what we have already. 

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We need  2 houses, but they both need electing by a PR system.  The lower house based on constituencies similar to the present but say 300 members,  the upper house  reduced  to  200 members. Also Regional/Metropolitan parliaments say 10, as a comparison Germany has 18. who would take over Health and  Education. I would convert  Westminister into a museum.  Completely off topic. But should we tinker with  the Lordss or start afresh? Myself I see nothing happening due to Turkey Syndrome, but I suppose acorns make trees.

 

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We do need a second chamber - to scrutinise and check and have a second look at what the Commons proposes. There are some (some) hard-working, able and experienced parliamentarians in there and the standard of debate can often be higher than that in the Commons as there is a bit less ya-boo sucks stuff and more mature debate. Not always but often. I tend to agree with Fosse. It needs reforming and a new look but it's hard to please everyone. Ideally it should be elected but I still think there's a place for some experienced former MPs who still wish to contribute to political life

Johnson's packing the place with lackeys and ridiculously silly appointments like his brother, Russian oligarchs and Ian Botham probably means it's more likely than ever to get reformed in the future. It's way too big and there are far too many in there who do far too little. But, hey, it's a nice job if you can get it. I believe the wine cellar is among the best anywhere!

I suspect both the Lords and the Monarchy are living on borrowed time. But that's another story.

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On 09/08/2020 at 19:53, Andyregs said:

No,  a second house plays an important role. However it does need to be different. No life peers,  no hereditary peers and no lords spiritual. I flip flop on the next bit though. If we want a fully elected lords, then they probably need more power but we risk losing expertise. We know what people think of experts currently. If we have an appointed house to provide oversight then they shouldn’t have powers to change or reject legislation, as we don’t live in a perfect world and who they know and how much they donate to a political party may influence their appointment. 
 

Agreed.

 

I was a staunch defender of the HoL a few years ago but I have mellowed a bit. I definitely think it serves an important purpose and as it stands, the industry experts are beneficial overall. Any reform, like you say, should first look at the appointment process. I suspect everyone with a dog in the race will claim that the house is packed with too many of the other side though, which is the argument used by people who defend the bbc against allegations of bias.

 

Overall for me, good, could be better, not quite sure wholesale reform is the right move currently but could be swayed in the future as an unelected upper house gets more and more dated.

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My problem with the House of Lords is the people who get shunted in there with no apparent expertise in government.  Why has Ian Botham been given a peerage?  Has the HoL got a cricket team?  What has Philip May done to deserve a peerage other than put up with Theresa's snoring?  Why has Claire Fox been given a peerage when she was a form Trotskyist and supporter of the IRA?  And what about the Russian son of a KGB bloke?  I thought Boris and his mates were against unelected bods interfering with our laws?

We need a second house.  We do not need it to be filled with random folk who just happen to be contributors to a particular political party and who are bunged in there without any public oversight - that is not democracy.

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1 hour ago, Jacko51 said:

My problem with the House of Lords is the people who get shunted in there with no apparent expertise in government.  Why has Ian Botham been given a peerage?  Has the HoL got a cricket team?  What has Philip May done to deserve a peerage other than put up with Theresa's snoring?  Why has Claire Fox been given a peerage when she was a form Trotskyist and supporter of the IRA?  And what about the Russian son of a KGB bloke?  I thought Boris and his mates were against unelected bods interfering with our laws?

We need a second house.  We do not need it to be filled with random folk who just happen to be contributors to a particular political party and who are bunged in there without any public oversight - that is not democracy.

Agreed 100% ALL parties are and have been guilty of using the House of Lords as a bribe for either keeping quiet or for support mainly financial.

There needs to be an overhaul, one of the problems though is turkeys dont vote for Christmas.

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