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Black Lives Matter


Joe B

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20 minutes ago, geosname said:

It might help if the message was clear instead of being fogged by crap.

If the message is simply black lives matter then it's clear.

If it's black lives matter and white lives matter and brown lives matter etc then it's not clear, add the political crap and baggage that comes with it and it's as clear as mud.

It is clear,  black lives matter, the rest already do matter. the  crap is just diversionary tactics. Nothing further to add.

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Our commitment to all black lives means that we lift up the experiences of the most marginalised in our communities, including but not limited to working class queer, trans, undocumented, disabled, Muslim, sex workers, women/non-binary, HIV+ people.

 

I genuinely don't know if this sentence means that they're fighting on behalf of those marginalised groups as well as black people (ie, sex workers with white skin would be included) or if they're saying that it's all black people, especially those with 'aggravating' circumstances such as disabilities or sex workers?

 

Maybe you could explain this part Fosse?

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Fosse69 said:

It is clear,  black lives matter, the rest already do matter. the  crap is just diversionary tactics. Nothing further to add.

Spot on.

Black lives matter because they haven't mattered as much as they should to date. It's a simple and clear message.

If you choose not to understand and acknowledge that it's your choice.

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3 hours ago, TheSage said:

Spot on.

Black lives matter because they haven't mattered as much as they should to date. It's a simple and clear message.

If you choose not to understand and acknowledge that it's your choice.

If your shouting the message to the people I would suggest most know.

If you are shouting at the state I doubt it cares.

In an ideal world the people are the state but it's far from an ideal world.

Discrimination based on colour, sexuality, religion etc is wrong, positive discrimination is also wrong

There are many groups of people not treated equally in many different ways... are the poor treated the same as the rich? The famous the same as the unknown? The politician the same as the commoner? The police the same as the public?... the list goes on.

The common fault line is people, they dont want to be equal they seem to want to be equal plus.

The problem with equality is you can't adjust or tinker with it.... you have it or you don't..  there is no middle ground, no compromise.

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15 hours ago, Fosse69 said:

It is clear,  black lives matter, the rest already do matter. the  crap is just diversionary tactics. Nothing further to add.

It's slogan is clear and easy to say but harder to implement using their political agenda.

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23 minutes ago, For Us All said:

It's slogan is clear and easy to say but harder to implement using their political agenda.

But  political agendas  belongs to all races,  such as prevention is better than cure,  i.e. better to spend money on youth and mental health services  and less on policing. 

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3 hours ago, Nofinikea said:

Further to the point about the opinions of a few vocal but minority Brexit supporting groups....

Not all Brexiteers are racist but all racists are brexiteers.

That is a statement of fact and truth and despite it being explicitly clear that not all brexiteers are racist, it still upsets brexiteers as they feel like the sub text is inferring that brexiteers stand with racists.

Do any of you get it yet?

It's upsetting to brexiteers because this is patently false. It stems back from the absolute garbage that was spouted by anti-democrats when they tried to void the brexit vote by calling brexit racist. They then tempered their views with this outrageous lie that "not all brexit voters are racist but all racists are brexit voters".

 

It couldn't be further from the truth.

 

We are seeing open racists on the "progressive" left ALL the time. They are given air time on the BBC. We see many bigoted views in the Labour party which was not a brexit supporting party.

 

You have zero evidence for the claim that "all racists are brexiteers". You want this to be the case and therefore you say it is a fact. But what are you basing it on? Absolutely nothing.

 

There are CLEARLY racists on the sides which have opposied brexit.

 

 

This was always a smear campaign and a classic example of weaponised false accusations of racism. Pretty disgusting to be honest.

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3 hours ago, Nofinikea said:

Why are people getting hung up on the semantics?  It just shows you up as ignorant.  This was never about black people wanting to crush white people it was about black people wanting to be treated the same a white people.

On the fringes you have more extreme people talking about a more political agenda but they do not represent the majority.

RB, you were a staunch Brexiteer.  Organisations like the EDL were also staunch Brexiteers, did there message represent your opinions on it?  UKIP a party set up to get us out of the EU went too far with its poster campaign showing Syrian refugees winding there way to the UK, did this blatant lie directly represent your opinion of the EU? 

So why are you so hell bent on painting the entire movement with the message of a politicised few?

Black people have lived with white people dancing around the semantics of there message about equality for hundreds of years and here some of you are, in 2020, still doing it.  Grow up.

Grow up he says 😂

 

You are trying to move the goal posts. It's been a common theme in this thread right from the opening post there has been an attempt to control the language that is used.

 

I've explicitly stated that I believe the majority of people who use the HEADLINE black lives matter are not supporters of the POLITICAL organisation's aims. Not one person has attempted to paint all protesters with the same brush, so let's just put that one to bed.

 

EDL/UKIP has zero to do with anything, your example doesn't work. Some labour party members supported brexit.

 

A common theme with the people who are vociferously supporting BLM in this thread is that they have not once accepted BLM's OWN MISSION STATEMENT.

 

If you are so offended by me taking BLM at their word and asking for clarity on THEIR words, maybe it isn't the organisation you want it to be?

 

Black people don't deserve to be used as pawns by the far left. I truly believe in equality (dictionary definition not a far left definition) and I truly believe that BLM is doing immense damage to race relations in the UK/USA. Any accusations you can throw at me for failing black people, I can throw right back at you.

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2 hours ago, Regal Beagle said:

Grow up he says 😂

 

You are trying to move the goal posts. It's been a common theme in this thread right from the opening post there has been an attempt to control the language that is used.

 

I've explicitly stated that I believe the majority of people who use the HEADLINE black lives matter are not supporters of the POLITICAL organisation's aims. Not one person has attempted to paint all protesters with the same brush, so let's just put that one to bed.

 

EDL/UKIP has zero to do with anything, your example doesn't work. Some labour party members supported brexit.

 

A common theme with the people who are vociferously supporting BLM in this thread is that they have not once accepted BLM's OWN MISSION STATEMENT.

 

If you are so offended by me taking BLM at their word and asking for clarity on THEIR words, maybe it isn't the organisation you want it to be?

 

Black people don't deserve to be used as pawns by the far left. I truly believe in equality (dictionary definition not a far left definition) and I truly believe that BLM is doing immense damage to race relations in the UK/USA. Any accusations you can throw at me for failing black people, I can throw right back at you.

You know what they say about the left RB.They will accuse you of something they are guilty of in attempt to shut you down.

Even Starmer's latched on to that by actually doing something about racist comments in his party.

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6 hours ago, Nofinikea said:

Further to the point about the opinions of a few vocal but minority Brexit supporting groups....

Not all Brexiteers are racist but all racists are brexiteers.

That is a statement of fact and truth and despite it being explicitly clear that not all brexiteers are racist, it still upsets brexiteers as they feel like the sub text is inferring that brexiteers stand with racists.

Do any of you get it yet?

So untrue.

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1 hour ago, For Us All said:

You know what they say about the left RB.They will accuse you of something they are guilty of in attempt to shut you down.

Even Starmer's latched on to that by actually doing something about racist comments in his party.

I remember them balking at me a few years ago on this site when I said that racism was alive and well on the left.

 

It genuinely is getting to the point now where if someone has those politics and tells me something, I may as well just believe the opposite. The levels of hypocrisy are staggering.

 

I've done this a few times but I can't quite believe that this is where we're at:

 

-All Lives Matter = Racism

-White Lives Matter = Racism

-Black Lives Matter - Brilliant, anti-racism, pro every oppressed group including all lives.

-black lives matter (no caps) = Semantics, you need to grow up as you are probably a racist

-Saying nothing at all = Racism, silence is violence

-Saying you don't want to dismantle capitalism = "part of the problem" you are probably a racist

-Saying you don't want to abolish the police = semantics, you are probably a racist

-Talking about the stated goals of BLM = semantics, you are probably a racist

 

Insanity. It's about time we had someone in our mainstream politics actually stand up to this garbage.

 

It's very funny how the people who refuse to acknowledge the far left extremism of BLM as a movement also are the ones that are desperate to shut down every other opinion.

 

There's one acceptable opinion - We must abolish capitalism and the police force and the nuclear family, and if you don't agree, you hate black lives.

 

 

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19 hours ago, Regal Beagle said:

I remember them balking at me a few years ago on this site when I said that racism was alive and well on the left.

 

It genuinely is getting to the point now where if someone has those politics and tells me something, I may as well just believe the opposite. The levels of hypocrisy are staggering.

 

I've done this a few times but I can't quite believe that this is where we're at:

 

-All Lives Matter = Racism

-White Lives Matter = Racism

-Black Lives Matter - Brilliant, anti-racism, pro every oppressed group including all lives.

-black lives matter (no caps) = Semantics, you need to grow up as you are probably a racist

-Saying nothing at all = Racism, silence is violence

-Saying you don't want to dismantle capitalism = "part of the problem" you are probably a racist

-Saying you don't want to abolish the police = semantics, you are probably a racist

-Talking about the stated goals of BLM = semantics, you are probably a racist

 

Insanity. It's about time we had someone in our mainstream politics actually stand up to this garbage.

 

It's very funny how the people who refuse to acknowledge the far left extremism of BLM as a movement also are the ones that are desperate to shut down every other opinion.

 

There's one acceptable opinion - We must abolish capitalism and the police force and the nuclear family, and if you don't agree, you hate black lives.

 

 

Yes,it seems to be getting more difficult not to be a racist these days?

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