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Ale and the Vale Podcast


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Ah okay, so for the record you're claiming that Pope made up a story about Askey telling him Carol had ordered him to take the captaincy off him? That conversation never took place and Pope just decided to lie on record for .... sorry I can't think of a reason, because he likes telling lies?


Ah okay, so for the record TP is claiming that JA made up a story that Carol had ordered him to take the captaincy off him? That conversation never took place and JA just decided to lie to TP face for .... sorry I can't think of a reason, because he likes telling lies?

See what I did there? Point is nobody but at least 1 of the 3 involved know the truth. I'm certain both Carol and JA would tell it completely differently to TP and given TPS current state of mind I'm not convinced. No evidence that JA has lied in the past so what have we got?

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Finally got the chance to listen to it. Entertaining listen, was nice listening to him talk about his career. Onto more recent matters, he says he’s not bitter but that’s exactly how it seems to me.

He hates Clarke because Clarke didn’t play him above Robinson after saying he’d give him some game time, but who can blame Clarke after our winning run (and Pope’s poor goal scoring record the last couple of seasons). Then saying he was refusing to come on as a sub until Pugh made him, talk about throwing your toys out the pram.

I struggled not to laugh when he complained about Flitcroft not asking him his opinions on players. That’s the sort of old boys club mentality I’m glad we’ve moved away from. 

Also, going back to the Askey days, he seems incredibly unprofessional. Slating Bennett complaining how he got benched for him, what a great teammate. And to be honest, although I agree Pope was a better player than Bennett, we played far better as a team in the 433 with Bennett than we did Pope so I was also in favour of Bennett starting. If what he said about Askey is true then that is poor on Askey’s part, but it doesn’t excuse his behaviour initially from being dropped.

It basically all seems to me as though he couldn’t deal with being left out and not being the main man anymore, which is summarised by his sudden dislike of Flitcroft just due to him not asking his opinion on things.

I’ll be forever grateful for what Pope did for Vale and look back fondly on it. But I have lost all respect for the man, especially after his twitter escapades. I fear that this could have undermined the club, as many fans think Pope can do no wrong and may now turn quicker against Clarke than they otherwise would. 

P.S. Who refers to themselves in the third person??

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His sudden dislike of Flitcroft is bizarre in view of what he said in his Sentinel page when Flitcroft arrived:

”Our new director of football David Flitcroft has plenty going for him – hard working, intelligent and a brilliant motivator.

I got to see all that when he was my manager at Bury so I’m really pleased he’s going to be working at Vale Park.”

 

 

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4 hours ago, philmpv said:



 

 


Ah okay, so for the record TP is claiming that JA made up a story that Carol had ordered him to take the captaincy off him? That conversation never took place and JA just decided to lie to TP face for .... sorry I can't think of a reason, because he likes telling lies?

See what I did there? Point is nobody but at least 1 of the 3 involved know the truth. I'm certain both Carol and JA would tell it completely differently to TP and given TPS current state of mind I'm not convinced. No evidence that JA has lied in the past so what have we got?

 

Askey would want a different captain for any number of valid reasons. Perhaps he did discuss it with Carol beforehand. That part is very believable. Fact is Pope was replaced as captain in October so something was very probably rumbling on before then.

So let's say it's likely that conversation did take place in pre-season. Well clearly Askey made a balls of it because Pope remained as captain for ten weeks into the season before it was taken off him. Askey may well have hoped that by saying "this order comes from the top" would stop any arguement, not counting on Pope storming off and ringing up the chair woman.

We notice a pattern of behaviour people have for dealing with Pope. That is basically "just say something to keep this mad idiot from kicking off and starting a shouting match". I can understand why Askey would tell him it was Carol's decision, but it still is poor on his part as he should stand by his own decisions.

Pope goes on for three hours, saying a lot of things that make himself look bad. Why would he lie about this one incident to make Askey look slightly worse? If he's lying why not make up something that makes Askey look awful or himself really great?

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Just now, Jacko51 said:

His sudden dislike of Flitcroft is bizarre in view of what he said in his Sentinel page when Flitcroft arrived:

”Our new director of football David Flitcroft has plenty going for him – hard working, intelligent and a brilliant motivator.

I got to see all that when he was my manager at Bury so I’m really pleased he’s going to be working at Vale Park.”

 

 

He mentioned Flitcroft telling the press there was "no room for sentiment" when he arrived, which Pope saw as Flitcroft implying he had decided Pope would be gone in the summer.

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11 minutes ago, Wrex said:

Askey would want a different captain for any number of valid reasons. Perhaps he did discuss it with Carol beforehand. That part is very believable. Fact is Pope was replaced as captain in October so something was very probably rumbling on before then.

So let's say it's likely that conversation did take place in pre-season. Well clearly Askey made a balls of it because Pope remained as captain for ten weeks into the season before it was taken off him. Askey may well have hoped that by saying "this order comes from the top" would stop any arguement, not counting on Pope storming off and ringing up the chair woman.

We notice a pattern of behaviour people have for dealing with Pope. That is basically "just say something to keep this mad idiot from kicking off and starting a shouting match". I can understand why Askey would tell him it was Carol's decision, but it still is poor on his part as he should stand by his own decisions.

Pope goes on for three hours, saying a lot of things that make himself look bad. Why would he lie about this one incident to make Askey look slightly worse? If he's lying why not make up something that makes Askey look awful or himself really great?

I don’t know why Pope was so shocked to lose the captaincy either. He wasn’t playing enough and he’d disgraced the club on Twitter. His position was untenable imo. Legge was a far better option to be leader of the club.

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1 minute ago, toyahw said:

The vociferous vaccine denier and conspiracy theorist? Who isn't any more......

Yes, that irks me. But at the time he was a far better choice as captain. Since then Conlon has emerged as a leader and so has taken the job. Not quite sure what point you’re making? 

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11 minutes ago, Powerline said:

Yes, that irks me. But at the time he was a far better choice as captain. Since then Conlon has emerged as a leader and so has taken the job. Not quite sure what point you’re making? 

No one is perfect. Least of all footballers. I'm firmly in the Pope is in the past camp. Just that I don't think that this is a good stick to beat Pope with.  My point is if he gets sacked for that comment that he may or may not have meant as anti Semitic. To be replaced by  someone putting bonkers stuff out 24/7 on twitter seems a bit odd.

Neither are now, so a bit accademic.

Edited by toyahw

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7 hours ago, toyahw said:

No one is perfect. Least of all footballers. I'm firmly in the Pope is in the past camp. Just that I don't think that this is a good stick to beat Pope with.  My point is if he gets sacked for that comment that he may or may not have meant as anti Semitic. To be replaced by  someone putting bonkers stuff out 24/7 on twitter seems a bit odd.

Neither are now, so a bit accademic.

Legge wasn’t putting that stuff out at the time though. 

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Some of the comments on here are a bit precious.

Also a few fans on a forum having an argument  isn’t the definition of a <ovf censored> storm and vale fans need no excuse to turn on each other anyway. 

Pope deserved to lose the captaincy when he got banned because of Twitter, that’s not the image the club wanted to be in the news. The decision to take it off him came from the very top is what I heard from more than one source back when it happened. 
 

I have no issue with any player backing themselves, no one else is going to, being a footballer is about having a strong mental attitude and self belief. I agree with Pope on the issue of Bennett. We were weak as anything when he played up front, his hold up play and his willingness to put himself about was a liability. I felt that the ball was coming straight back with him in the side.

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18 hours ago, Wrex said:

So a fan podcast is supposed to turn down the chance to talk to a club legend? It's not like Pope was drunk or something. He's honestly telling the truth as he sees it.

What are they supposed to do? Say "excuse me we will not entertain criticism of the current/former manager or director of football on this podcast, please keep your opinions to yourself Tom"?

People complain that modern footballers are robots that come out with clichés rather than speak the honest truth or say anything interesting or controversial. People bemoan that we don't see 'characters' in modern football. Well here's Pope, speaking his mind. I'm all for it. I think he makes himself seem silly at times but it was a fascinating listen either way. Thank you to the lads for putting this episode together.

Not only is Tom Pope a club legend he is also supposed to be a Vale fan and as such should support the club.  To use a cliche, he has washed his dirty linen in public. I just know there is no way anyone at the club will respond to this in any official capacity. Pope has become the Prince Harry of Burslem. The podcast has given him free reign to say what he wants, which is fair enough but he was never challenged on some issues, particularly in relation to his U turn on Flitcroft. Nobody will have fallen off their chair upon listening to what he had to say, we know he is bitter but sadly he now wants us to fail. Tom is waiting in the wings, in order to have a cheap, "I told you so" at some point in the future. I think Clarke should take a leaf out of the Queen's book and release the statement "recollections may vary".

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2 hours ago, rob1983 said:

Probably not wise doing the pod in the first place as it's created a <ovf censored> storm. Turning fans against each other and the management team. Well done ale and the vale.

Not their fault that Pope’s an arse.

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2 hours ago, PV1973 said:

Some of the comments on here are a bit precious.

Also a few fans on a forum having an argument  isn’t the definition of a <ovf censored> storm and vale fans need no excuse to turn on each other anyway. 

Pope deserved to lose the captaincy when he got banned because of Twitter, that’s not the image the club wanted to be in the news. The decision to take it off him came from the very top is what I heard from more than one source back when it happened. 
 

I have no issue with any player backing themselves, no one else is going to, being a footballer is about having a strong mental attitude and self belief. I agree with Pope on the issue of Bennett. We were weak as anything when he played up front, his hold up play and his willingness to put himself about was a liability. I felt that the ball was coming straight back with him in the side.

It certainly has caused some upset. It’s turning people against Clarke as some people treat Pope as a God and lap up everything he does.

And yes Pope was better than Bennett, but we played worse with Pope. Bennett didn’t need to hold the ball up, we played 433 and pressed. When Pope came into the team it turned into hoofball.

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38 minutes ago, Dr Delgado said:

The podcast has given him free reign to say what he wants, which is fair enough but he was never challenged on some issues, particularly in relation to his U turn on Flitcroft.

With respect to Stu, Baz and Jonny it's safe to say neither of them are Jeremy Paxman, or even Piers Morgan. Besides the episode was already three hours long, if they started challenging Pope on what he was saying they'd probably still be recording now!

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1 hour ago, Powerline said:

It certainly has caused some upset. It’s turning people against Clarke as some people treat Pope as a God and lap up everything he does.

And yes Pope was better than Bennett, but we played worse with Pope. Bennett didn’t need to hold the ball up, we played 433 and pressed. When Pope came into the team it turned into hoofball.

Absolutely. But the Forest Green game early doors I think we won 2-1 and Bennett scored was as good a footballing performance Vale have given in the past 2 or 3 seasons. Bennett rightly kept his place for a few games. He wasn't/ isn't great but certainly at that time merited the shirt. 

Bitter and twisted man Mr Pope is. 

His bad mouthing of Southend when we thrashed them, Bennett and Theo is pathetic 

Incredibly some people I'm sure hanker for the prodigal son to return one day, coaching badge in hand as the new Vale manager.

Do me a favour 

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