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Very worrying indeed.
 
I was joking before, but it's quite sickening that at a time when we have genuine fascist-like policies being introduced around the world, that it is seemingly not allowed to use that word any more. It used to be fascism when our elected officials wanted to deliver a thing more people voted for than against, in a referendum. 
 
Now he's locked us in our homes for months at a time and is sacking care workers and nurses for not "consenting" to a medical procedure that they might not want, democracy takes a back seat in the name of "public health". And that isn't being called out as fascistic? Benito Mussolini, the founder of fascism, called it a merger between corporate and state power. Doesn't that sound familiar when you think about who controls the information we consume? Who is telling us what we must inject into our bodies? Who these policies is benefitting? (eg politicians and the huge corporations)
 
The only thing that is missing is that it's not racial or ethnicity grounds that this is being done, but on health records/compliance status.
 
 
I'd like to think the Austria health apartheid (or the Dan Andrews power grab in Australia) would not be successful in this country, but if the millions who have marched for freedom so far have not had an impact, I'm not really sure how we'd stop it. 
The difficulty that you have is that many people are so naive (or lazy) that they've been convinced that their very existence is at threat from another group of people, with very little or no evidence to back it up. But the government has said that it's 'The Science', so people lap it up.

At this point, such has the mass hysteria and ridiculously disproportionate nature of the response, that anything to 'keep people safe ' is seen as a reasonable and valid response. This is how dictatorship and totalitarianism takes hold, because people believe it's in their best interests. Just like they thought persecuting Jews was going to keep them safe back in the 1930s.

We've had a pretty pathetic attitude to mortality in this country but it's nothing compared to some other countries. The lack of critical thinking and the acceptance that people over 80 have a high chance of dying is just baffling to me.
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44k plus today. Think a lot of people give up on this thread because you get bombarded by LV. Well cases are on the rise, people have given up on masks and social distancing. We need to get some measures in place or else we could be facing lockdown again. Daily figures of 45k cases and approaching 200 deaths is not acceptable 

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44k plus today. Think a lot of people give up on this thread because you get bombarded by LV. Well cases are on the rise, people have given up on masks and social distancing. We need to get some measures in place or else we could be facing lockdown again. Daily figures of 45k cases and approaching 200 deaths is not acceptable 
Yes let's get masks back in place everywhere including the bath. Lockdown so that you can only go outside for 5 minutes just after midnight. Let's also all wear eye patches. You can also only move by hopping on one leg and hanging garlic up over your door.

All these measures have clearly worked so well so far, including the 'way out of the pandemic ' vaccine, so we'd better double down on the previously failed tactics.

This is getting ridiculous, hence nobody is complying anymore.

Can I just ask, how many people of old age normally die of respiratory illness on any given day? I bet you don't know and I guarantee 2 years ago you didn't care. You probably won't understand the subtext of why I'm asking that question.

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19 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:

Yes let's get masks back in place everywhere including the bath. Lockdown so that you can only go outside for 5 minutes just after midnight. Let's also all wear eye patches. You can also only move by hopping on one leg and hanging garlic up over your door.

All these measures have clearly worked so well so far, including the 'way out of the pandemic ' vaccine, so we'd better double down on the previously failed tactics.

This is getting ridiculous, hence nobody is complying anymore.

Can I just ask, how many people of old age normally die of respiratory illness on any given day? I bet you don't know and I guarantee 2 years ago you didn't care. You probably won't understand the subtext of why I'm asking that question.

You are absolutely correct, masks and distancing, plus dancing and nightclub restrictions are in place in Portugal and Spain, and guess what they are working. It does not stand up just blandly saying people normally die of respiratory illness, well yes they do, but then we have COVID on top, that is helping to drown the NHS. Still when your head is in the sand.

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You are absolutely correct, masks and distancing, plus dancing and nightclub restrictions are in place in Portugal and Spain, and guess what they are working. It does not stand up just blandly saying people normally die of respiratory illness, well yes they do, but then we have COVID on top, that is helping to drown the NHS. Still when your head is in the sand.


Your proof that masks are having any demonstrable effect in Spain and Portugal? Oh that's right....none. We don't have Covid on top, it's just replacing other normal causes.

My head is not in the sand. I don't just blindly accept everything I am told. To be honest the reaction of a lot of people to this has been pathetic.

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5 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:


 

 


Your proof that masks are having any demonstrable effect in Spain and Portugal? Oh that's right....none. We don't have Covid on top, it's just replacing other normal causes.

My head is not in the sand. I don't just blindly accept everything I am told. To be honest the reaction of a lot of people to this has been pathetic.

 

Your correct the reaction of some has been pathetic …..

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12 hours ago, leedsvaliant said:


 

 


Your proof that masks are having any demonstrable effect in Spain and Portugal? Oh that's right....none. We don't have Covid on top, it's just replacing other normal causes.

My head is not in the sand. I don't just blindly accept everything I am told. To be honest the reaction of a lot of people to this has been pathetic.

 

This is why you are a seen as a lunatic. 

You have been taken in by youtube scientists and the need to be different. This is what happens when you get your opinions from secret facebook groups. 

Show me some evidence that other causes of deaths have gone down to the same level covid deaths have gone up. IN the last 5 years please. I shall not hold my breath. 

Edited by WV

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As someone living in Austria about to lockdown again I can tell you that the observations of some in the UK are very incorrect. I juts hope this lock down will cut things off here before it inevitably gets worse everywhere else - looks like my family won't be able to visit me for Christmas again. 

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52 minutes ago, Emile said:

As someone living in Austria about to lockdown again I can tell you that the observations of some in the UK are very incorrect. I juts hope this lock down will cut things off here before it inevitably gets worse everywhere else - looks like my family won't be able to visit me for Christmas again. 

Good luck Emile. You are absolutely correct, people in UK are very complacent, and with the figures we are producing that could be costly

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This is why you are a seen as a lunatic. 
You have been taken in by youtube scientists and the need to be different. This is what happens when you get your opinions from secret facebook groups. 
Show me some evidence that other causes of deaths have gone down to the same level covid deaths have gone up. IN the last 5 years please. I shall not hold my breath. 


And again you use the 'lunatic' and 'conspiracy theorist ' card. Classic.

I don't listen to YouTube scientists and I'm not in any private Facebook groups (I don't even use Facebook) but do listen to genuine scientists like Professor Carl Heneghan and Dr John Lee who have been brilliant in assessing the data without the emotional baggage.

From 2000 to 2009 we had more all cause mortality per 100,000 people than in 2020. That's a fact.

We also had an historically mild winter in the year before Covid and the last 5 years have been pretty low in mortality. So comparing 2020 against the previous 5 years is folly. Flu deaths fell off a cliff, heart disease deaths fell off a cliff (I will find the exact figures). Lots of additional people died at home from non Covid reasons. Lots of additional people have died and are still dying due to lack of medical treatment because they were too scared to access it.

People with Covid were cleared out of hospitals and back into their old people homes to infect and kill others, exacerbating the problem. Yes, we had an increase in deaths at an unusual time of year and yes this was caused by a new virus, but most of these deaths were simply brought forward to a peak and would have happened at some other point during the year.

Deaths have actually been running consistently below the historically low 5 year average for some time now, so 2021 is even lower in terms of all cause mortality.

As I said, I know you disagree with me but we've done pretty much all we can now. The most vulnerable people have been jabbed 3 times, the majority of the rest have had 2. We can't keep threatening lockdown every winter because the NHS gets a bit busy. We would have done that every winter before the Covid marketing campaign. We have to return to normal life and accept that people are going to catch and die from Covid, just like people caught and died from flu and other viruses before. It sounds harsh but old people have got to die of something. Nobody lives forever but some people are happy to curtail their freedom and enjoyment of life to obtain some unobtainable panacea of 'safety' that doesn't exist. Every day we face risks and this is just another very tiny risk.We have vaccines and we have treatments , we have to crack on.

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As someone living in Austria about to lockdown again I can tell you that the observations of some in the UK are very incorrect. I juts hope this lock down will cut things off here before it inevitably gets worse everywhere else - looks like my family won't be able to visit me for Christmas again. 


Yeah the lockdowns have worked so well before haven't they? Let's keep trying them again and again because they're so successful and don't affect anything else. Look at the protests in Austria today, it seems that many thousands agree with me.

I just can't see why people don't think this is utter insanity. Austria is going down the route of one of its own. A certain man with a moustache from Austria would be delighted.

I feel sorry for you that your family won't be able to visit again...all for the 99.97% survivable 'deadly ' virus.

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Things are not great here in NL. We have police shooting people just down the road. A 20.00 curfew. Hospitals rammed and cancelling all other stuff. Just really grim.  If you think your Gov are bad just look at our lot. Actually they are not a government because we don't have one since the election in March. They are the "carrying on" government.  s h i t  show here I tell you.

Total s h i t show. No booster programme no plan  no nothing. Just back to the dark days of  eternal lock down misery.

 

Edited by toyahw

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The riots in Rotterdam were pretty ironic. Anti-vaxxers complaining about discrimination? There is no discrimination. The decomisionar  gov  floated the idea but that has zero chance of getting through parliament. 

They were just a bunch of bloody yobs.  As usual the highly respected  mayor of Rotterdam, Ahmed Aboutaleb, spoke sense on the subject.

 

Edited by toyahw

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On 20/11/2021 at 10:05, WV said:

This is why you are a seen as a lunatic. 

You have been taken in by youtube scientists and the need to be different. This is what happens when you get your opinions from secret facebook groups. 

Show me some evidence that other causes of deaths have gone down to the same level covid deaths have gone up. IN the last 5 years please. I shall not hold my breath. 

Yeah Leeds Valiant, you should read some proper news like the stuff that is sponsored by the people who make more and more money the longer the crisis goes on, the more scared people are and the lack of any alternative treatments/preventions available. 

 

 

 

 

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