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Anti vaxers are just stupid anti-social cowards. Is it allowed to say that? Even Trump says get the jab. And they are now actually the problem. The tyranny of the minority.

Me the the wife and two kids 26 and 29 double jabbed, No problem. No side effects no nothing. 

 

 

 

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41 minutes ago, toyahw said:

Anti vaxers are just stupid anti-social cowards. Is it allowed to say that? Even Trump says get the jab. And they are now actually the problem. The tyranny of the minority.

Me the the wife and two kids 26 and 29 double jabbed, No problem. No side effects no nothing. 

 

 

 

I don't see why you can't say it although i'm not sure it's true, depending on the context.

I don't have a problem with people choosing not to have the jab or choosing to have it.

I have a problem with the use of force, by government or anyone.

I don't understand protesting about the jab, if you dont want it don't have it, simple..... although they do have the right to protest. Sometimes it does show the police being very selective about applying the law, especially covid restrictions.

We also have to bear in mind the vaccine is still in a trial stage, until 2023 I think, and there is no legal redress against the government or pharmaceutical companies if it goes pear shaped.

I will be getting jabbed when I get the opportunity, a decision made on risk factors.

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6 hours ago, toyahw said:

Anti vaxers are just stupid anti-social cowards. Is it allowed to say that? Even Trump says get the jab. And they are now actually the problem. The tyranny of the minority.

Me the the wife and two kids 26 and 29 double jabbed, No problem. No side effects no nothing. 

 

 

 

What an embarrassing, and frankly absurd post.

If the vaccine is so amazing, then surely anyone that isn't vaccinated is only putting themselves at risk? Why would it affect you? Why are they "stupid anti-social cowards"?

Obviously it's common knowledge that the vaccine doesn't stop you catching COVID, doesn't stop transmission and doesn't stop people being hospitalised.

So why is it so important to you that everyone in the world gets injected with an experimental drug (still in trial phase until 2023)?

By your same logic of saying your family are doubled jabbed with no problems so everyone should have it, I can say that I have had COVID twice no with no problems so everyone should just get on with their lives!

And if you want to start spouting tyranny, look at what is happening now in Australia. All because of a virus with a 99%+ survival rate!

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15 hours ago, WV said:

You dont do answering questions do you? What is the death toll compared to the 130000 deaths here? 

"130,000" deaths.

Completely inaccurate overstatement of reality.

Please see some of my previous posts for facts about how the COVID deaths have actually been counted.

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19 hours ago, leedsvaliant said:

Australia and New Zealand have literally lost their minds.  Utterly crazy. 

Not crazy, both countries have attempted to keep the lid on what is in fact, an irrepressible virus.  Only now are they waking up to the fact that mass vaccination is the only way to be able to live with Coronavirus and other such infectious diseases!  Being so far-flung, closing their borders initially kept infections & deaths at bay, but once the virus (particularly variants as virulent as the Delta one) takes hold, lockdowns and social distancing are the only solutions until vaccination takes over the 'heavy lifting', and that's what both countries and their leadership are now realising.

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2 minutes ago, Bycarsbill said:

Not crazy, both countries have attempted to keep the lid on what is in fact, an irrepressible virus.  Only now are they waking up to the fact that mass vaccination is the only way to be able to live with Coronavirus and other such infectious diseases!  Being so far-flung, closing their borders initially kept infections & deaths at bay, but once the virus (particularly variants as virulent as the Delta one) takes hold, lockdowns and social distancing are the only solutions until vaccination takes over the 'heavy lifting', and that's what both countries and their leadership are now realising.

"Not crazy". 😂😂😂

They've literally locked down their capital city because there was ONE case of COVID!

460,000 people confined to their own homes. Think of the mental and physical trauma that must cause.

All to prevent the spread of a virus with a 99%+ survival rate.

They've also been shooting innocent rescue dogs to stop people congregating!

I would love to hear what your definition of crazy is then!

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7 hours ago, toyahw said:

Anti vaxers are just stupid anti-social cowards. Is it allowed to say that? Even Trump says get the jab. And they are now actually the problem. The tyranny of the minority.

Me the the wife and two kids 26 and 29 double jabbed, No problem. No side effects no nothing. 

 

 

 

I don't like the term anti vaxxer as it suggests that these people are against all vaccines.  How are people who choose to not have a medical intervention that neither stops them getting the virus or stops transmission the problem?  You are only truly protecting yourself by getting it.

This coercion is plain wrong no matter how you dress it up and excluding people from certain parts of society is like excluding the Jews because they chose to be Jewish. 

Medical intervention should always be a personal choice whether you agree with it or not. I've had both but I can fully understand the hesitancy of people who are not willing to take a vaccine that has not been tested long term and is still in its trial phase. Particularly against a virus which for the vast majority they will have very little chance of becoming seriously ill from.  

It's the complete brain dump of the public that have misunderstood the level of risk all along that has kept this 'deadly virus ' myth going. 

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38 minutes ago, valeparklife said:

"130,000" deaths.

Completely inaccurate overstatement of reality.

Please see some of my previous posts for facts about how the COVID deaths have actually been counted.

It'll come out eventually what the real figure is mate.  2020 was not an extraordinary year in terms of deaths.  Many years in the early 2000s had higher deaths per 100,000 population.  The excess deaths were based on the last 5 years which have been historically low years.  It's just people are lazy and just take everything at face value.  I have intelligent friends who quote the deaths all the time. 

How many of the 130,000 deaths would have happened anyway?  I anticipate it will be a lot.  

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5 hours ago, valeparklife said:

"Not crazy". 😂😂😂

They've literally locked down their capital city because there was ONE case of COVID!

460,000 people confined to their own homes. Think of the mental and physical trauma that must cause.

All to prevent the spread of a virus with a 99%+ survival rate.

They've also been shooting innocent rescue dogs to stop people congregating!

I would love to hear what your definition of crazy is then!

"Crazy"  is doing nothing and letting a virulent strain of virus grow exponentially with all the damage both physical & mental that would create.  Your ONE quote for number of cases is totally innacurate and well out of date.  Are you suggesting that it should run rampant?

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58 minutes ago, Bycarsbill said:

"Crazy"  is doing nothing and letting a virulent strain of virus grow exponentially with all the damage both physical & mental that would create.  Your ONE quote for number of cases is totally innacurate and well out of date.  Are you suggesting that it should run rampant?

You've already made some very embarrassing statements regarding your definition of crazy, but please check the facts. A city of 460,000 has been forced into another draconian lockdown, where people are unable to leave their houses, for ONE single COVID case. 

It's a virus with a 99%+ survival rate. Read that again.

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2 hours ago, valeparklife said:

You've already made some very embarrassing statements regarding your definition of crazy, but please check the facts. A city of 460,000 has been forced into another draconian lockdown, where people are unable to leave their houses, for ONE single COVID case. 

It's a virus with a 99%+ survival rate. Read that again.

I'm certainly not embarrassed by my definition of "crazy" in the context of what we are discussing here.  I am however, at a loss to see exactly what you're advocating. And, as yet, you haven't answered my question;  are you suggesting that Australia (and any other country for that matter), does nothing and just lets the virus run rampant throughout its population?

To correct you yet again, on 21st August (last published figures in Australia) there were 891 new cases (not one), making a rolling seven day average of 637 new cases per day.  Nothing compared with here, but nevertheless the start of some exponential growth that, if allowed to go un-checked will result in a substantial increase in the number of cases.  In total Australia has registered 45,570 infections and there have been 984 deaths in that time--this may only be 2.2% in statistical terms, but each one of those deaths is a real family tragedy!

The biggest problem that both Australia & New Zealand have is that they thought their remote (and mainly sealed) borders would protect them.  In fairness that course of action did pretty well work until the arrival of the Delta variant.  Sadly, neither country pursued the vaccination route, which they are both now trying to reverse very quickly. 

Although reasonably steady at the moment, the 30,000 plus daily  infected cases in this country is at its highest since March.  Thankfully because of the vaccine effect, the link between infections & hospitalisations/deaths has been partially broken.  However the number of hospital admissions is on a slight rise at the moment, +6.6% on the previous week up to the 17th August when the data was last updated.  There are now almost 6.5K people in hospital with 928 of those (almost 15%) on ventilators.  It's a nasty, pernicious and virulent virus that isn't done yet!

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I'm certainly not embarrassed by my definition of "crazy" in the context of what we are discussing here.  I am however, at a loss to see exactly what you're advocating. And, as yet, you haven't answered my question;  are you suggesting that Australia (and any other country for that matter), does nothing and just lets the virus run rampant throughout its population?
To correct you yet again, on 21st August (last published figures in Australia) there were 891 new cases (not one), making a rolling seven day average of 637 new cases per day.  Nothing compared with here, but nevertheless the start of some exponential growth that, if allowed to go un-checked will result in a substantial increase in the number of cases.  In total Australia has registered 45,570 infections and there have been 984 deaths in that time--this may only be 2.2% in statistical terms, but each one of those deaths is a real family tragedy!
The biggest problem that both Australia & New Zealand have is that they thought their remote (and mainly sealed) borders would protect them.  In fairness that course of action did pretty well work until the arrival of the Delta variant.  Sadly, neither country pursued the vaccination route, which they are both now trying to reverse very quickly. 
Although reasonably steady at the moment, the 30,000 plus daily  infected cases in this country is at its highest since March.  Thankfully because of the vaccine effect, the link between infections & hospitalisations/deaths has been partially broken.  However the number of hospital admissions is on a slight rise at the moment, +6.6% on the previous week up to the 17th August when the data was last updated.  There are now almost 6.5K people in hospital with 928 of those (almost 15%) on ventilators.  It's a nasty, pernicious and virulent virus that isn't done yet!
Cases yawn. No context again. 1200 hospitals in the UK , so that's roughly 5 patients per hospital and as I've highlighted previously, these are people that have likely contracted Covid in hospital and were in for something unrelated. 900 odd on ventilators, all for Covid? Yeah ok! 6% rise of a very small number is an even smaller number.

Until people understand context and risk this will just keep rolling on. The naivety and lack of brain power we have in this country is astonishing.
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11 hours ago, Bycarsbill said:

"Crazy"  is doing nothing and letting a virulent strain of virus grow exponentially with all the damage both physical & mental that would create.  Your ONE quote for number of cases is totally innacurate and well out of date.  Are you suggesting that it should run rampant?

Crazy is also doing more damage by stopping something than if you hadn't tried to stop it with the measures you employ.

Austria 

National vaccination progress

Eligible population (20,619,959)

EligibleTotal

30.88% Fully vaccinated (6,368,421)

53.56% First dose (11,043,784)

The vaccination figures are not impressive, perhaps they should redirect their efforts.

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Cases yawn. No context again. 1200 hospitals in the UK , so that's roughly 5 patients per hospital and as I've highlighted previously, these are people that have likely contracted Covid in hospital and were in for something unrelated. 900 odd on ventilators, all for Covid? Yeah ok! 6% rise of a very small number is an even smaller number.

Until people understand context and risk this will just keep rolling on. The naivety and lack of brain power we have in this country is astonishing.
It is not the total number of hospitals that matters but the number of beds staffed and available to treat the serious conditions of Covid. That is the context.

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On 24/08/2021 at 09:10, leedsvaliant said:

I don't like the term anti vaxxer as it suggests that these people are against all vaccines.  How are people who choose to not have a medical intervention that neither stops them getting the virus or stops transmission the problem?  You are only truly protecting yourself by getting it.

This coercion is plain wrong no matter how you dress it up and excluding people from certain parts of society is like excluding the Jews because they chose to be Jewish. 

Medical intervention should always be a personal choice whether you agree with it or not. I've had both but I can fully understand the hesitancy of people who are not willing to take a vaccine that has not been tested long term and is still in its trial phase. Particularly against a virus which for the vast majority they will have very little chance of becoming seriously ill from.  

It's the complete brain dump of the public that have misunderstood the level of risk all along that has kept this 'deadly virus ' myth going. 

"Still in its trial phase" 

You do realise that every vaccine you have ever had is in the same phase as the covid vaccines which is phase 3 clinical trial phase? 

You're spreading myth as usual. 

Edited by WV

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1 hour ago, leedsvaliant said:
1 hour ago, Fosse69 said:
It is not the total number of hospitals that matters but the number of beds staffed and available to treat the serious conditions of Covid. That is the context.

And in context that still does not equate to any kind of disaster.

Except to the people, and their families,  who are no longer alive.

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Except to the people, and their families,  who are no longer alive.
Emotional arguments do not wash I'm afraid.Sad as it is, unfortunately people die, particularly old and ill people. If we want to go down that line, we can talk about the lack of cancer diagnosis in people of all ages, some with their whole lives ahead of them but you don't want to face that truth in the pursuit of keeping people 'safe '.

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