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What are we going to do about all this? It could be getting out of hand.
Unfortunately if you say one word against any of the utter madness that has been bestowed upon us over the last year, you are deemed a granny killer, conspiracy theorist, nutter, denier etc. Until it actually dawns on people that maybe, just maybe this continues to be the wrong course of action and is ruining and costing lives, we have a problem. Unfortunately the government did a brilliant job in employing a bunch of psychologists masquerading as SAGE to believe that we were all susceptible to this deadly virus and that every other human being should be perceived as a threat.

If you are under 60 and in good health, the likelihood of you dying or even being seriously ill is virtually nothing and all the vulnerable categories have now been vaccinated, with early signals that they provide 95% plus protection. If the government is serious, it needs to concentrate its advert campaigns on these issues and not the bogeyman 1 in 3 asymptomatic transmission adverts based on sparse and unreliable evidence.

I cannot actually believe there are people out there that still go along with this nonsense. The 'don't hug ' thing makes me smile. I will NEVER prevent my children from hugging their grandparents, it's completely wrong to expect a child not to do that.

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10 hours ago, leedsvaliant said:

Thank God I have support!

Another one of the 'conspiracies' coming to pass....we were told that freedom would return on June 21st and vaccines would be our way out. I was harrangued again and people told me to stop talking nonsense.

Now we are told that masks and social distancing will continue for at least another year and we'll have a 3rd wave! We told you so....again!

One day people will finally wake up and realise.

Sometimes worth looking at the company you keep.

Could you provide a link for what you’re are saying by the way. So we can see what was said.

As for a third wave, it was always said that a rise in cases was inevitable as we relax restrictions (if lockdowns didn’t work the. This surely wouldn’t be the case?). It’s how we manage it that is important. 

Edited by Andyregs

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Sometimes worth looking at the company you keep.
Could you provide a link for what you’re are saying by the way. So we can see what was said.
As for a third wave, it was always said that a rise in cases was inevitable as we relax restrictions (if lockdowns didn’t work the. This surely wouldn’t be the case?). It’s how we manage it that is important. 
Yep, university professors, doctors, really bad company. Nothing like tarring everyone with the same brush. There are nutters on both sides of the debate, but it's good to see that more and more people are finally thinking that something isn't right.

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4 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:
33 minutes ago, Andyregs said:
Sometimes worth looking at the company you keep.
Could you provide a link for what you’re are saying by the way. So we can see what was said.
As for a third wave, it was always said that a rise in cases was inevitable as we relax restrictions (if lockdowns didn’t work the. This surely wouldn’t be the case?). It’s how we manage it that is important. 

Yep, university professors, doctors, really bad company. Nothing like tarring everyone with the same brush. There are nutters on both sides of the debate, but it's good to see that more and more people are finally thinking that something isn't right.

The source?

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9 hours ago, leedsvaliant said:

Unfortunately if you say one word against any of the utter madness that has been bestowed upon us over the last year, you are deemed a granny killer, conspiracy theorist, nutter, denier etc. Until it actually dawns on people that maybe, just maybe this continues to be the wrong course of action and is ruining and costing lives, we have a problem. Unfortunately the government did a brilliant job in employing a bunch of psychologists masquerading as SAGE to believe that we were all susceptible to this deadly virus and that every other human being should be perceived as a threat.

If you are under 60 and in good health, the likelihood of you dying or even being seriously ill is virtually nothing and all the vulnerable categories have now been vaccinated, with early signals that they provide 95% plus protection. If the government is serious, it needs to concentrate its advert campaigns on these issues and not the bogeyman 1 in 3 asymptomatic transmission adverts based on sparse and unreliable evidence.

I cannot actually believe there are people out there that still go along with this nonsense. The 'don't hug ' thing makes me smile. I will NEVER prevent my children from hugging their grandparents, it's completely wrong to expect a child not to do that.

Couple of things in this. If you take away people who aren’t virologists and epidimologists from your one and only expert source, then there would be no one left in it. 

im not sure you’re point in the vaccine. We need everyone vaccinated to stop it spreading. Vaccines aren’t 100%, and we need the vaccine wall to be as sturdy as possible so we can not only reopen, but reopen with confidence.

And of course, god forbid we teach children to be thoughtful of others and protect the vulnerable. By the way, you always argued that you didn’t break the lockdown guidelines/laws. Are you now admitting you did? 
 

And the source?

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Couple of things in this. If you take away people who aren’t virologists and epidimologists from your one and only expert source, then there would be no one left in it. 
im not sure you’re point in the vaccine. We need everyone vaccinated to stop it spreading. Vaccines aren’t 100%, and we need the vaccine wall to be as sturdy as possible so we can not only reopen, but reopen with confidence.
And of course, god forbid we teach children to be thoughtful of others and protect the vulnerable. By the way, you always argued that you didn’t break the lockdown guidelines/laws. Are you now admitting you did? 
 
And the source?
Have you got kids? You clearly don't live in the real world. We're not teaching kids respect, we're teaching them that even their own grandparents are a potential danger. It's monstrous and you just can't see it because you want to feel 'safe'.

I've hugged my parents and let my children hug them throughout, arrest me officer. If you speak to 99% of the parents at my daughter's school, they'll have done the same thing. In general, I've followed the laws.

We were sold on the vaccines being the way out of this, the one way ticket to freedom and now, again, the goalposts change. If the vaccines have over 95% efficacy then you're left with a very small vulnerable population and even then, there's no guarantee these people become ill. You're fighting hard to keep these restrictions in place Andy, but the tide is turning. As a Vale fan, do you want to see your club go out of business? The more this nonsense continues, the more likely that scenario is.

Also, with regards the experts, there's not just 2 or 3. There are bound to be less that speak out against the tyranny as they fear for their careers and funding. Much easier to tow the party line than to stick your head above the trenches.

What source do you need and for what?
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11 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:

Have you got kids? You clearly don't live in the real world. We're not teaching kids respect, we're teaching them that even their own grandparents are a potential danger. It's monstrous and you just can't see it because you want to feel 'safe'.

I've hugged my parents and let my children hug them throughout, arrest me officer. If you speak to 99% of the parents at my daughter's school, they'll have done the same thing. In general, I've followed the laws.

We were sold on the vaccines being the way out of this, the one way ticket to freedom and now, again, the goalposts change. If the vaccines have over 95% efficacy then you're left with a very small vulnerable population and even then, there's no guarantee these people become ill. You're fighting hard to keep these restrictions in place Andy, but the tide is turning. As a Vale fan, do you want to see your club go out of business? The more this nonsense continues, the more likely that scenario is.

Also, with regards the experts, there's not just 2 or 3. There are bound to be less that speak out against the tyranny as they fear for their careers and funding. Much easier to tow the party line than to stick your head above the trenches.

What source do you need and for what?

I was just pointing out that you constantly argued that you didn’t break the restrictions, now you’re saying differently. Whatever fits your point at the time it seems.

who said the vaccines have an offer 95% efficacy. You keep making unsubstantiated claims and not backing it up. Again, just saying whatever you need to at the time. 
Im not fighting to keep restrictions in place, What a ridiculous thing to say. I’m commenting on a COVID thread on a football forum. I’m just following them. Maybe if everyone did then the dreaded lockdowns would end sooner. 
Now your argument is that there are experts, you just can’t say who because they darent but there are definitely lots of them. Again, whatever you have to say at the time.

the source where the government states that current masks and social distancing restrictions will have to stay for another year. The last briefing they stayed we were in target with the projected roadmap.

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25 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:

Brilliant, we are allowed studies now, or just ones that fit the argument you are making today. Can’t have it both ways surely? How do I know if this one is correct but the biased lancet and bmj are fake news in the laps of the government? Obviously good news as I’d seen good results but not all that high (see how easy that was to respond to evidence). Read back though, I always argued that AZ was a good vaccine generally and that the attack on it was wrong. Doesn’t really change anything as the shielding has not stopped for all vulnerable people. 
Now how about the source I asked for?
 

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41 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:

Not an ideal source but the lady interviewed is https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/19176933.amp/

Lol ok the Bolton news or the actual government?
But let me remind you of what you claimed:

Now we are told that masks and social distancing will continue for at least another year and we'll have a 3rd wave! We told you so....again!”

This is where you end up when you search for any evidence to back up what you want to believe instead if the other way around. And it doesn’t say what you claim. It doesn’t say we will have to, it’s a warning. It doesn’t say we will be made to, and it doesn’t say what the government is saying.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/prime-minister-sets-out-roadmap-to-cautiously-ease-lockdown-restrictions

“It is hoped all legal limits on social contact can be removed.” (June 21)

This was your big ‘gotcha...told you so...again’. And it’s just made up. It’s the same every time you try to evidence your claims.

The only thing that could change that is if the death rate goes up like it is in France (who didn’t lockdown like we did). 

In fact I thought you were talking about what valance said in a recent briefing, where he stated to a similar question that guidelines (not laws) that may continue is things like washing your hands, or not going to work when ill. 

 

Edited by Andyregs

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Lol ok the Bolton news or the actual government?
But let me remind you of what you claimed:
“Now we are told that masks and social distancing will continue for at least another year and we'll have a 3rd wave! We told you so....again!”
This is where you end up when you search for any evidence to back up what you want to believe instead if the other way around. And it doesn’t say what you claim. It doesn’t say we will have to, it’s a warning. It doesn’t say we will be made to, and it doesn’t say what the government is saying.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/prime-minister-sets-out-roadmap-to-cautiously-ease-lockdown-restrictions
“It is hoped all legal limits on social contact can be removed.” (June 21)
This was your big ‘gotcha...told you so...again’. And it’s just made up. It’s the same every time you try to evidence your claims.
The only thing that could change that is if the death rate goes up like it is in France (who didn’t lockdown like we did). 

In fact I thought you were talking about what valance said in a recent briefing, where he stated to a similar question that guidelines (not laws) that may continue is things like washing your hands, or not going to work when ill. 
 
Just pointing out that when there is a warning like this it usually comes to pass. I have read other similar comments coming from scientists. I guess we'll see come the 21st June won't we, but I very much doubt you'll admit you were wrong.

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Brilliant, we are allowed studies now, or just ones that fit the argument you are making today. Can’t have it both ways surely? How do I know if this one is correct but the biased lancet and bmj are fake news in the laps of the government? Obviously good news as I’d seen good results but not all that high (see how easy that was to respond to evidence). Read back though, I always argued that AZ was a good vaccine generally and that the attack on it was wrong. Doesn’t really change anything as the shielding has not stopped for all vulnerable people. 
Now how about the source I asked for?
 
You wanted evidence to back up my claim that vaccines have nearly 95% efficacy, based on real world data (not putting numbers into excel as you seem to love). I'm not sure what more you want me to do?

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8 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:
33 minutes ago, Andyregs said:
Brilliant, we are allowed studies now, or just ones that fit the argument you are making today. Can’t have it both ways surely? How do I know if this one is correct but the biased lancet and bmj are fake news in the laps of the government? Obviously good news as I’d seen good results but not all that high (see how easy that was to respond to evidence). Read back though, I always argued that AZ was a good vaccine generally and that the attack on it was wrong. Doesn’t really change anything as the shielding has not stopped for all vulnerable people. 
Now how about the source I asked for?
 

You wanted evidence to back up my claim that vaccines have nearly 95% efficacy, based on real world data (not putting numbers into excel as you seem to love). I'm not sure what more you want me to do?

And I accept that the vaccines are good vaccines. I haven’t put any numbers into excel, you need to stop making things up.

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11 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:
21 minutes ago, Andyregs said:
Lol ok the Bolton news or the actual government?
But let me remind you of what you claimed:
“Now we are told that masks and social distancing will continue for at least another year and we'll have a 3rd wave! We told you so....again!”
This is where you end up when you search for any evidence to back up what you want to believe instead if the other way around. And it doesn’t say what you claim. It doesn’t say we will have to, it’s a warning. It doesn’t say we will be made to, and it doesn’t say what the government is saying.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/prime-minister-sets-out-roadmap-to-cautiously-ease-lockdown-restrictions
“It is hoped all legal limits on social contact can be removed.” (June 21)
This was your big ‘gotcha...told you so...again’. And it’s just made up. It’s the same every time you try to evidence your claims.
The only thing that could change that is if the death rate goes up like it is in France (who didn’t lockdown like we did). 

In fact I thought you were talking about what valance said in a recent briefing, where he stated to a similar question that guidelines (not laws) that may continue is things like washing your hands, or not going to work when ill. 
 

Just pointing out that when there is a warning like this it usually comes to pass. I have read other similar comments coming from scientists. I guess we'll see come the 21st June won't we, but I very much doubt you'll admit you were wrong.

It’s funny how you say ‘you won’t admit that you’re wrong’ when you have just been proven for a fact that you are wrong. 

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20 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:
32 minutes ago, Andyregs said:
It’s funny how you say ‘you won’t admit that you’re wrong’ when you have just been proven for a fact that you are wrong. 

No, you think I'm going to be wrong. There's a big difference.

No, you were wrong. What you said was factually wrong. You’re just changing the point you’re arguing now.

19 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:
33 minutes ago, Andyregs said:
And I accept that the vaccines are good vaccines. I haven’t put any numbers into excel, you need to stop making things up.

So therefore you'll accept that there is very little need to continue with these measures even now, nevermind in two months?

No not at all. Amazing how you can make that jump. It would be a neglect if duty if the highest order to be this close to getting on top of the virus to just pack it all in now. It’s complete nonsense. 

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