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37 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:

You're arguing about one man, whereas consensus on that site comes from a range of different sources. Surely we should allow some questioning of policy and government scientists consensus?

I find it amusing that lockdown zealots will always argue the small points but never address the excessive damage that lockdowns cause. They call us selfish, but I think actively supporting lockdown is selfish because it ultimately leads to much more death and hardship for future generations than a virus will ever do.

I’m questioning that you’re choice of truth comes from a Toby young blog. You questioned when I got mine from the boss of the nhs and the British medical journal. 

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15 hours ago, leedsvaliant said:

Absolutely true, even at the very peak of the pandemic there were very few days (if any) where there was actually 1,000 deaths on a specific day. It's simply 1000 + deaths were reported on that day. There might be 200 from last Tuesday, 265 from last Wednesday, 57 from December, etc.

It doesn't fit the propoganda to publicise this. Sounds scarier if you hear 1000 deaths today. In fact, if you look at the deaths by day of death, the rate is pretty flat and doesn't rise and rise. Lots of deaths in the past week occurred over the holiday period and so have been delayed in being reported.

Still a difficult situation and a lot of people dying, but it's nothing massively out of the ordinary for this time of year.

They may not have died that day but if you look at an accumulative total over a week for example it will average over 1000 deaths a day which will be pretty accurate. So in other words, yes, there is over 1000 dying each day at this current period.

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They may not have died that day but if you look at an accumulative total over a week for example it will average over 1000 deaths a day which will be pretty accurate. So in other words, yes, there is over 1000 dying each day at this current period.
There's nowhere near 1000 on average dying every day. The most so far in this 'peak' is 690 odd on one day, many days are a lot less but average probably around 400 at a guess.

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I’m questioning that you’re choice of truth comes from a Toby young blog. You questioned when I got mine from the boss of the nhs and the British medical journal. 
Never questioned the validity or accuracy of your data, simply the interpretation of said data. The arguments against lockdown come from the same sets of data.

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14 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:
3 hours ago, Andyregs said:
I’m questioning that you’re choice of truth comes from a Toby young blog. You questioned when I got mine from the boss of the nhs and the British medical journal. 

Never questioned the validity or accuracy of your data, simply the interpretation of said data. The arguments against lockdown come from the same sets of data.

Semantics. But it makes it worse for you. I’m questioning the interpretation of a blog edited by Toby young. You’re questioning the interpretation of the nhs and British medical journal. 

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Semantics. But it makes it worse for you. I’m questioning the interpretation of a blog edited by Toby young. You’re questioning the interpretation of the nhs and British medical journal. 
Au contraire. The analysis is not undertaken by Toby Young, he simply provides the channel for experts to show their analysis.

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6 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:
39 minutes ago, Andyregs said:
Semantics. But it makes it worse for you. I’m questioning the interpretation of a blog edited by Toby young. You’re questioning the interpretation of the nhs and British medical journal. 

Au contraire. The analysis is not undertaken by Toby Young, he simply provides the channel for experts to show their analysis.

I assume I don’t have to explain what an editor does.

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1 hour ago, leedsvaliant said:
2 hours ago, philpvfc said:
They may not have died that day but if you look at an accumulative total over a week for example it will average over 1000 deaths a day which will be pretty accurate. So in other words, yes, there is over 1000 dying each day at this current period.

There's nowhere near 1000 on average dying every day. The most so far in this 'peak' is 690 odd on one day, many days are a lot less but average probably around 400 at a guess.

Oh just 400 so that’s ok then, don’t know what we are worrying about. Ffs

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15 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:
48 minutes ago, Andyregs said:
Semantics. But it makes it worse for you. I’m questioning the interpretation of a blog edited by Toby young. You’re questioning the interpretation of the nhs and British medical journal. 

Au contraire. The analysis is not undertaken by Toby Young, he simply provides the channel for experts to show their analysis.

Ive just delved into your favourite website and looked at the forums. Jesus wept, you say you’re not a conspiracy theorist but it’s like a qanon gathering in there. Lots of talk about ‘lockdown zealots’ too funnily enough. Like I said, ‘the company you keep...’

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Oh just 400 so that’s ok then, don’t know what we are worrying about. Ffs
Sounds bad on the face of it doesn't it, but there's that word again 'context '. 1600 people die every day in the UK, around 10,000 per week. How many people normally die of respiratory illnesses at this time of year?

Of course, not all those average 400 people will have died of Covid...many will have caught it while in hospital or will have been dying of something else and simply tested positive.

Is it sad that people die? Of course it is, but that's life. People die all the time, thousands per week, tens of thousands per month. We've lost sight of this. Was it bad in April last year? Yes. Is it as bad now? No. Is it the perfect storm for the NHS at the moment? Yes, particularly considering the lack of beds and lack of staff.

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Ive just delved into your favourite website and looked at the forums. Jesus wept, you say you’re not a conspiracy theorist but it’s like a qanon gathering in there. Lots of talk about ‘lockdown zealots’ too funnily enough. Like I said, ‘the company you keep...’
Hey, I'm not saying there's no nutters on there. It has become infiltrated by some far right nutters and has become a ground for pro Trump groups and people who support a number of conspiracy theories. However, within that group there are a number of normal people, young and old, vulnerable and not, left and right who have genuine concerns about lockdown.

It also has a highly useful library of information, articles, graphs, which all support anti lockdown.

Unfortunately, there's no other resource on the internet for the other side of the argument and so you are always going to attract some nutters with extreme viewpoints.

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4 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:
1 hour ago, Andyregs said:
I assume I don’t have to explain what an editor does.

He deems what to include in his blog but doesn't pertain to be an expert or virologist, he's just the vehicle for people whose voices are not being heard.

And that’s who you’re choosing to filter your evidence for you. I’m reading it now, some highlights:

’wuflu’, ‘police state’, ‘stasi’, talk of peeling social distancing stickers off floors, 

Toby has qualities of leadership and most importantly, he knows when he's right and that will be sufficient to keep us going as long as it takes to bring this thing to conclusion. Toby knows that the truth will eventually strike down all the false ideas with one arm. It is only a matter of time before we witness the final denouement, and it sustains me to know how well it will be once nature has seen fit to expose all the fickle outcomes of lockdown. Nature is a creature of chance, but in the long run it is always an exactly fair chance. We can only wait for nature to take its course, and let's all stick the boot in when the time is right.’
‘Don't forget that the reaction of lockdown zealots is quite plainly an emanation of the wokeflake generation.
It's driven by social(ist, communist) media, presents emotive, illogical arguments, a failure to question, see the wider ad literally global picture, driven itself by a generation who have been de-programmed to think for themselves and vainly rely on *likes* and *shares* to support their ill-informed charlatanism.’

‘Perhaps we will only be allowed to vote if we have had the vaccine. Then I suppose a postal vote could be mandated. Run of course by Dominion Voting Systems.’

A thread wanting the end of the nhs

‘Lately I've started to actually give serious consideration to the Great Reset theory’

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8 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:


Unfortunately, there's no other resource on the internet for the other side of the argument and so you are always going to attract some nutters with extreme viewpoints.

Ever wondered why there are no other sources apart from one full of nutters?

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And that’s who you’re choosing to filter your evidence for you. I’m reading it now, some highlights:
’wuflu’, ‘police state’, ‘stasi’, talk of peeling social distancing stickers off floors, 
‘Toby has qualities of leadership and most importantly, he knows when he's right and that will be sufficient to keep us going as long as it takes to bring this thing to conclusion. Toby knows that the truth will eventually strike down all the false ideas with one arm. It is only a matter of time before we witness the final denouement, and it sustains me to know how well it will be once nature has seen fit to expose all the fickle outcomes of lockdown. Nature is a creature of chance, but in the long run it is always an exactly fair chance. We can only wait for nature to take its course, and let's all stick the boot in when the time is right.’
‘Don't forget that the reaction of lockdown zealots is quite plainly an emanation of the wokeflake generation.It's driven by social(ist, communist) media, presents emotive, illogical arguments, a failure to question, see the wider ad literally global picture, driven itself by a generation who have been de-programmed to think for themselves and vainly rely on *likes* and *shares* to support their ill-informed charlatanism.’
‘Perhaps we will only be allowed to vote if we have had the vaccine. Then I suppose a postal vote could be mandated. Run of course by Dominion Voting Systems.’
A thread wanting the end of the nhs
‘Lately I've started to actually give serious consideration to the Great Reset theory’
I see what you've done there. Picked some extreme views to back your argument.

Have you bothered to look at the wealth of contents or just the comments section?

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1 hour ago, leedsvaliant said:

Sounds bad on the face of it doesn't it, but there's that word again 'context '. 1600 people die every day in the UK, around 10,000 per week. How many people normally die of respiratory illnesses at this time of year?

Of course, not all those average 400 people will have died of Covid...many will have caught it while in hospital or will have been dying of something else and simply tested positive.

Is it sad that people die? Of course it is, but that's life. People die all the time, thousands per week, tens of thousands per month. We've lost sight of this. Was it bad in April last year? Yes. Is it as bad now? No. Is it the perfect storm for the NHS at the moment? Yes, particularly considering the lack of beds and lack of staff.

Wrong.

it is as bad now. 

it will be worse in a week or so. 

if we weren’t in lockdown the NHS would already be completely overwhelmed and people with other illnesses would have no chance at all of being seen. 

It sounds bad on the face of it. Because it is bad. 

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3 minutes ago, leedsvaliant said:

I see what you've done there. Picked some extreme views to back your argument.

Have you bothered to look at the wealth of contents or just the comments section?

I took minutes to find on the front page of the forum.

  • Haha 1

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3 hours ago, leedsvaliant said:
5 hours ago, philpvfc said:
They may not have died that day but if you look at an accumulative total over a week for example it will average over 1000 deaths a day which will be pretty accurate. So in other words, yes, there is over 1000 dying each day at this current period.

There's nowhere near 1000 on average dying every day. The most so far in this 'peak' is 690 odd on one day, many days are a lot less but average probably around 400 at a guess.

So your data is different to the government? I’m sure they only mentioned earlier the daily average being close to 1000? ‘Peak’ guess 45k new infections a day and 1k dying a day is nothing then. Unbelievable 

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