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A golden opportunity to relieve Cummings of his position, he seems to have an opinion on everything. IMO he has completely undermined legislation which he probably has had some involvement in implementing, his actions are indefensible and if he doesn’t have his position terminated, then the public pressure on the Boris will be ramped up, which is justified. Nice to see that the Chief Constable has stated that they spoke to the Cummings family about it, shows a certain level of integrity, hat isn’t seen that often in political circles these days. It’ll be interesting to follow CC of Durham to see how much longer they’re in post.

Advisors advise, ministers make decisions. Is that actually the case.

Another high profile individual who thinks that rules and regulations apply to the masses but they’re above it and untouchable.

Probably will still get found a well paid position but in a lower profile role, a bit like  Gove, who I wouldn’t put in charge of my sock drawer.

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Hi all, An announcement from OVF Towers... this evening I will be putting a few things in place to hopefully help some users out during the pandemic,  particularly during the self-isolation perio

I am a law abiding citizen. I have never even had a parking ticket and I am in my 60th year. I accept that the Government has had a very difficult job but they have made a complete horlicks of it. The

Just don’t understand the need for politics to become involved in this. It’s a world wide pandemic come what may. Let’s rally round together. Sadly impossible as too many keep trying to gain some form

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I think people should question and compare  the devolved admins performances in Wales and Scotland  and ask yourselves “ Have Labour and the SNP done any better ?”

 

 

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55 minutes ago, tommytunstall said:

What a weak leader Johnson is proving to be, or he won't sack him because Cummings knows where the bodies are buried.

I just wish the Tories had been as pro active in fighting this virus, as they have been in supporting Cummings North East tour.

Did Kinnock enjoy his father’s party?

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10 minutes ago, Regal Beagle said:

Weight of evidence - There is no evidence other than the bluebell story, and that is so dodgy to build your entire case on.

What would you do if an unnamed source claims that he was in London looking at daffodils at the same time, so the person in Durham could not be correct? How would you possibly choose one to believe over the other?

There are journalistic codes of conduct and journalistic law. I used to work in news teams on websites and there is NO WAY you would simply publish a comment like that without several checks taking place... recording the source on the record, running it past the editor, the legal experts, getting signed statements from the witnesses etc. This is to safeguard the newspaper and also the clear implication to the source that they will be sued by the papers if they made it up. 

To suggest that you can simply call up a journalist with a wild claim and they would accept it and publish without fact checking is rubbish.

Not only that but the newspapers have confirmed these are statements from several different people so there's even less risk of it being a single individual making it up.

Finally the newspapers have actually named one of people who made the statements ("Robin Lees, 70, a retired chemistry teacher from the town") so he's prepared to have his name and personal details in the piece. In all likelihood is he really likely to do that if he made it up? 

 

 

 

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17 minutes ago, Regal Beagle said:

Take it everyone is happy for the 5 or so members of the press to be sacked after they surrounded Cummings and his family yesterday? Breaching lockdown conditions/social distancing?

Yes,  if they were (not seen the footage) then my view is there is no rule for one and not for the other.

Take you are happy for Cummings to be sacked after he breached lockdown conditions too?

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3 minutes ago, robf said:

There are journalistic codes of conduct and journalistic law. I used to work in news teams on websites and there is NO WAY you would simply publish a comment like that without several checks taking place... recording the source on the record, running it past the editor, the legal experts, getting signed statements from the witnesses etc. This is to safeguard the newspaper and also the clear implication to the source that they will be sued by the papers if they made it up. 

To suggest that you can simply call up a journalist with a wild claim and they would accept it and publish without fact checking is rubbish.

Not only that but the newspapers have confirmed these are statements from several different people so there's even less risk of it being a single individual making it up.

Finally the newspapers have actually named one of people who made the statements ("Robin Lees, 70, a retired chemistry teacher from the town") so he's prepared to have his name and personal details in the piece. In all likelihood is he really likely to do that if he made it up? 

 

 

 

The weight of evidence people need differs based on their view of the person being discussed.

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It's amazing the lengths some of you go to to defend Cummings.

Let's copy the right wing twitter brigade and dredge up the story about Kinnock. That'll take the heat off Cummings and deflect criticism. Even though the details are not comparable. Cummings was self isolating and though to have been infected. That's a major difference. He's the chief government adviser and architect of the message "stay at home." Kinnock was open about it and rightly reprimanded by the police. But he wasn't spreading the virus and leaving his house while infected at the height of a pandemic. His crime was "unnecessary travel". 

I note Jenrick's name hasn't been cited yet by Cummings' defenders (can't think why!) yet what he did was much worse than Kinnock.

I note also that Hancock wanted Ferguson out asap and was calling for police action. So too Duncan-Smith. But with Cummings..... a deafening silence. It's called hypocrisy and double standards.

And this business about child care is rubbish. No one should leave home if they are self isolating. Cummings has a sister in law and brother (or the other way round) in the same city. His PR/secretary lives two streets away. Does he have no friends living nearby? Most families manage to look after their children and if it became more serious then family members can come to them. 

He should not be leaving his home while infected and, even worse, travelling from a badly affected area (London) to one that was hardly touched at that stage.

 

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4 hours ago, Howjy04 said:

Do you mean like Stephen Kinnock did?I wonder how he will feel if he unknowingly passes the virus onto them?Good old Hacker.Obnoxious Tosser of the People.

It is not a football match,  Johnson only holds Cumming`s cards, a weak manager risks his own position, especially now the back benches are getting restless.

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25 minutes ago, robf said:

Yes,  if they were (not seen the footage) then my view is there is no rule for one and not for the other.

Take you are happy for Cummings to be sacked after he breached lockdown conditions too?

I don't believe there is any reliable evidence that he breached lockdown Rob. He had a reasonable excuse for the first one, no allegations of wrong doing for the second, and the third apparently didn't even happen.

 

9 minutes ago, TheSage said:

It's amazing the lengths some of you go to to defend Cummings.

Let's copy the right wing twitter brigade and dredge up the story about Kinnock. That'll take the heat off Cummings and deflect criticism. Even though the details are not comparable. Cummings was self isolating and though to have been infected. That's a major difference. He's the chief government adviser and architect of the message "stay at home." Kinnock was open about it and rightly reprimanded by the police. But he wasn't spreading the virus and leaving his house while infected at the height of a pandemic. His crime was "unnecessary travel". 

I note Jenrick's name hasn't been cited yet by Cummings' defenders (can't think why!) yet what he did was much worse than Kinnock.

I note also that Hancock wanted Ferguson out asap and was calling for police action. So too Duncan-Smith. But with Cummings..... a deafening silence. It's called hypocrisy and double standards.

And this business about child care is rubbish. No one should leave home if they are self isolating. Cummings has a sister in law and brother (or the other way round) in the same city. His PR/secretary lives two streets away. Does he have no friends living nearby? Most families manage to look after their children and if it became more serious then family members can come to them. 

He should not be leaving his home while infected and, even worse, travelling from a badly affected area (London) to one that was hardly touched at that stage.

 

The opposite is true Sage.

The lengths people will go to try and get Dr Evil out of the Government. This is about brexit, make no mistake about that.

People are genuinely arguing that caring for your child should be criminalised. That's not sane by any definition.

 

You are genuinely arguing that he should be prepared to send his child to live with his PA for a few weeks? Come on, can you not see how ludicrous you sound?

Please also note that if he had of sent his child to live with his PA for 2 weeks whilst he and his wife recovered, the headlines (and the OVF outrage mob) would likely be calling for his child to be taken away from him and Cummings to be prosecuted for allowing his child to leave self isolation having also been exposed to the virus.

 

I find this intentional misunderstanding of common sense so disingenuous. We had someone on here a few weeks ago pretending they didn't know what "alert" means and demanding that the Government tells us what to do if the park is a bit busy. It's so gross. It's political, nothing more, nothing less. If it was a labour Government and a Starmer advisor this would not be an issue.

 

23 minutes ago, Iron Curtain said:

The weight of evidence people need differs based on their view of the person being discussed.

Correct.

People desperately want this to be true.

Edited by Regal Beagle

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1 minute ago, Regal Beagle said:

I don't believe there is any reliable evidence that he breached lockdown Rob. He had a reasonable excuse for the first one, no allegations of wrong doing for the second, and the third apparently didn't even happen.

A reasonable excuse. I'll tell that to my near neighbours who were locked down at home with their little boy at roughly the same time. 

You carry on believing it's reasonable to travel a 480 round trip when the rest of the country is told to remain at home. 

You carry on believing that two independent witnesses just made up a story for a specific location and were prepared to both lie on record.

You carry on believing...

I will carry on believing that everyone should be judged the same - whether that's journalists, Labour MPs or Tory advisors. People who break social distancing and lockdown guidance are all equally guilty of being selfish and deserve our contempt, that's what I believe. 

 

 

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43 minutes ago, Howjy04 said:

I think people should question and compare  the devolved admins performances in Wales and Scotland  and ask yourselves “ Have Labour and the SNP done any better ?”

 

 

We have enough problems in England to question,  it is up to them how they use their devolved powers .

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12 minutes ago, Regal Beagle said:

People desperately want this to be true.

I think some people desperately want it to be untrue! 😉 🤐

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24 minutes ago, TheSage said:

It's amazing the lengths some of you go to to defend Cummings.

Let's copy the right wing twitter brigade and dredge up the story about Kinnock. That'll take the heat off Cummings and deflect criticism. Even though the details are not comparable. Cummings was self isolating and though to have been infected. That's a major difference. He's the chief government adviser and architect of the message "stay at home." Kinnock was open about it and rightly reprimanded by the police. But he wasn't spreading the virus and leaving his house while infected at the height of a pandemic. His crime was "unnecessary travel". 

I note Jenrick's name hasn't been cited yet by Cummings' defenders (can't think why!) yet what he did was much worse than Kinnock.

I note also that Hancock wanted Ferguson out asap and was calling for police action. So too Duncan-Smith. But with Cummings..... a deafening silence. It's called hypocrisy and double standards.

And this business about child care is rubbish. No one should leave home if they are self isolating. Cummings has a sister in law and brother (or the other way round) in the same city. His PR/secretary lives two streets away. Does he have no friends living nearby? Most families manage to look after their children and if it became more serious then family members can come to them. 

He should not be leaving his home while infected and, even worse, travelling from a badly affected area (London) to one that was hardly touched at that stage.

 

Kinnock travelled on the same weekend as Cummings.How do you know he wasn’t carrying the virus?How did Kinnock know?Looks like you’ve got Cummings off the hook.Both ,just to repeat,both, should be sacked.BTW ,it was his wife who was infected.

Edited by Howjy04

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1 hour ago, Regal Beagle said:

I agreed with Neil Ferguson stepping down - as one of the leading people behind the implementation of the lockdown and he did not have a reasonable excuse for being complicit in the lockdown breaches. 

I read this sentence and having replaced the name "Neil Ferguson" with "Dominic Cummings" I completely agreed with you.

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If you are showing symptoms self isolate at home, not 200 miles away. End of.  Jenrick also did it and got away with it. Are these people different, or should they obey the law like most of Joe Public are doing.

 

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Just now, robf said:

A reasonable excuse. I'll tell that to my near neighbours who were locked down at home with their little boy at roughly the same time. 

You carry on believing it's reasonable to travel a 480 round trip when the rest of the country is told to remain at home. 

You carry on believing that two independent witnesses just made up a story for a specific location and were prepared to both lie on record.

You carry on believing...

I will carry on believing that everyone should be judged the same - whether that's journalists, Labour MPs or Tory advisors. People who break social distancing and lockdown guidance are all equally guilty of being selfish and deserve our contempt, that's what I believe. 

 

 

 

I think you should tell it to the deputy Medical Officer who told the nation that exactly this scenario was an exceptional circumstance on 23rd March, a whole week before Cummings apparently went to Durham.

 

This is not a cover up. This isn't "one rule for them" - It's a rule for all of us, the whole nation.

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Regal Beagle said:

I'm doing the exact same thing.

 

Weight of evidence - There is no evidence other than the bluebell story, and that is so dodgy to build your entire case on.

What would you do if an unnamed source claims that he was in London looking at daffodils at the same time, so the person in Durham could not be correct? How would you possibly choose one to believe over the other?

 

I didn't demand Corbyn be sacked when he failed social distancing in a railway cafe. I didn't demand any of the other 3 labour MPs be sacked when they broke lockdown rules.

I agreed with Neil Ferguson stepping down - as one of the leading people behind the implementation of the lockdown and he did not have a reasonable excuse for being complicit in the lockdown breaches. And the Scottish medical officer was literally going on a holiday to her second home - clearly different from someone ensuring that their child can be cared for in the worst case scenario.

 

Of course you agree with Ferguson stepping down, he wasn't a Tory.

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4 minutes ago, Regal Beagle said:

 

I think you should tell it to the deputy Medical Officer who told the nation that exactly this scenario was an exceptional circumstance on 23rd March, a whole week before Cummings apparently went to Durham.

 

This is not a cover up. This isn't "one rule for them" - It's a rule for all of us, the whole nation.

Sorry, I have no idea what you are trying to say. 

At what point did anyone in authority say it was perfectly fine to travel a 480 miles round trip when knowingly infected? Please fire over a link because I thought the message was stay at home and protect the NHS. 

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