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Labour leadership


geosname

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1 hour ago, Howjy04 said:

Wrong-Dailey says she would invite Jez onto her cabinetemoji50.png.2 left,Smarmer and Nandy Pandy.

You couldn't make it up could you?  Labour's left wing although understandably trying to cling on to control of the party, must have a collective brain-fade, as they clearly still don't understand why they lost the last two elections!!!

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On 12/02/2020 at 20:43, Regal Beagle said:

Rob, come on now, this is not the "right wing press" this is Ruth Smeeth, a former Labour MP who has been publically calling this out for years.

 

There is absolutely zero evidence that the tories are "as bad as" or worse, and in fact, very little evidence in general.

 

There is an absolute plethora of evidence which shows the rampant anti-semitism in the labour party however, most of it does not originate from the "right wing" but from labour whistleblowers.

 

This is a serious problem and is a huge reason why they got trounced. The british public simply don't like racist bigots.

Not only was there a plethoraof evidence of anti-semitism in their party, but it also graphically highlighted and showed up the sheer lack of any competent leadership from the top of the party!

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 20/02/2020 at 11:41, Bycarsbill said:

You couldn't make it up could you?  Labour's left wing although understandably trying to cling on to control of the party, must have a collective brain-fade, as they clearly still don't understand why they lost the last two elections!!!

You couldn't make it up could you. The Labour Party spokesman on Andrew Marr said this morning if it wasn't for Brexit, we could have won the election. I do wonder if KS can change the party, if that is their mindset.

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Tend to agree.

For me only KS has the gravitas, experience and intelligence to lead an effective opposition but the problem in my view is that Labour has been taken over by the left wing to a large extent and they won't want to give up their influence. I've always subscribed to the view that (1) a centre left party is the way to go in this country now and (2) we need to change the electoral system to a form of PR that better reflects the votes of the electorate.

I would love to see a broad left/centre coalition, including the Greens, working together to counteract this very right wing government, to hold it's feet to the fire, and to provide a realistic alternative. As it is they are getting away with (blue) murder. But their lies and deception is going largely unchallenged because we currently have no effective opposition.

But politics is a funny old game. You thought Labour was dead in the water in the eighties but Blair won election after election and it was the Tories then who struggled, so things can change quickly.

I would expect this government to implode sooner or later - as all governments do. But it will also be quite interesting to see if the Tories stick with their hard right policies and inclinations or try and pull back more towards the centre.

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2 minutes ago, TheSage said:

Tend to agree.

For me only KS has the gravitas, experience and intelligence to lead an effective opposition but the problem in my view is that Labour has been taken over by the left wing to a large extent and they won't want to give up their influence. I've always subscribed to the view that (1) a centre left party is the way to go in this country now and (2) we need to change the electoral system to a form of PR that better reflects the votes of the electorate.

I would love to see a broad left/centre coalition, including the Greens, working together to counteract this very right wing government, to hold it's feet to the fire, and to provide a realistic alternative. As it is they are getting away with (blue) murder. But their lies and deception is going largely unchallenged because we currently have no effective opposition.

But politics is a funny old game. You thought Labour was dead in the water in the eighties but Blair won election after election and it was the Tories then who struggled, so things can change quickly.

I would expect this government to implode sooner or later - as all governments do. But it will also be quite interesting to see if the Tories stick with their hard right policies and inclinations or try and pull back more towards the centre.

If you had PR you would get a mish mash of everything in a coalition not everyone against the Tories as opposition..... everything put forward would be like brexit, 4 years and no movement.... the larger parties would be buying off the minnows with concessions that would screw their own policies and we get gridlock and chaos. 

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Germany hasn't done too badly with PR. 

We can pick and choose our examples - but regardless of who is in power we currently have governments that can steamroller through any legislation they like, based on as little as 40% of the popular vote. I think we mentioned this before but wasn't the 45 Labour admin the only one that got over 50% of the vote? The current system also disenfranchises voters in "safe" seats of all colours and does not reflect the total number of votes cast for parties. Is it any wonder 20+ million people never bother to vote?

There are pros and cons. I accept that. But this confrontational system in which more people collectively vote against a government than for it is outdated and run its course. Most other westernised democracies have a form of PR. But there is no ideal situation, I agree.

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25 minutes ago, TheSage said:

Tend to agree.

For me only KS has the gravitas, experience and intelligence to lead an effective opposition but the problem in my view is that Labour has been taken over by the left wing to a large extent and they won't want to give up their influence. I've always subscribed to the view that (1) a centre left party is the way to go in this country now and (2) we need to change the electoral system to a form of PR that better reflects the votes of the electorate.

I would love to see a broad left/centre coalition, including the Greens, working together to counteract this very right wing government, to hold it's feet to the fire, and to provide a realistic alternative. As it is they are getting away with (blue) murder. But their lies and deception is going largely unchallenged because we currently have no effective opposition.

But politics is a funny old game. You thought Labour was dead in the water in the eighties but Blair won election after election and it was the Tories then who struggled, so things can change quickly.

I would expect this government to implode sooner or later - as all governments do. But it will also be quite interesting to see if the Tories stick with their hard right policies and inclinations or try and pull back more towards the centre.

Blair was an oddity. He was a Labour politician who wanted to win power rather than stand shouting in opposition. 

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If you have more than 2 parties there is always the possibility of the winner getting less than 50% of the vote...... the more parties the greater the likelihood. 

If you total all the various candidates I'm surprised any winner gets over 33%.

The biggest problem for me is if a party got enough votes to get say 5 seats under PR but actually won none...... where would they represent?..... which constituencies would they be parachuted into.

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