General Erection - 12th December 2019

[geosname]

I'm not blaming anyone, I make my decisions. It's my choice...... but then I'm not trying to save the planet.

I do what I can to avoid single use items such as plastic carrier bags etc because they are useless to me..... I use plastic zip bags for freezing, which I sterilize and re-use,  everything that can be recycled is recycled including uneaten rice which goes to animal food, meat waste (bones etc) to street dogs and a number of other items..... I don't do any of that to save the planet.

[Andyregs]

20 minutes ago, geosname said:

I'm not blaming anyone, I make my decisions. It's my choice...... but then I'm not trying to save the planet.

I do what I can to avoid single use items such as plastic carrier bags etc because they are useless to me..... I use plastic zip bags for freezing, which I sterilize and re-use,  everything that can be recycled is recycled including uneaten rice which goes to animal food, meat waste (bones etc) to street dogs and a number of other items..... I don't do any of that to save the planet.

From big solutions to I don’t care. Is there a point you’re making? Ever? 

[Regal Beagle]

59 minutes ago, Andyregs said:

If you buy beef or fish, and think your helping the environment by not having a plastic bag, then I’ve got some bad news for you. 

The only people who are not hypocrites when it comes to climate change are, ironically, people who don't believe in it or don't care about it.

I don't buy into this argument that people who vociferously tell people what they should and shouldn't do to save the planet are in credit when it comes to their own behaviour.

 

And not eating meat is only a solution if there is an affordable and sustainable alternative. Otherwise it will condemn the worlds poorest people to death.

 

[Andyregs]

15 minutes ago, Regal Beagle said:

The only people who are not hypocrites when it comes to climate change are, ironically, people who don't believe in it or don't care about it.

I don't buy into this argument that people who vociferously tell people what they should and shouldn't do to save the planet are in credit when it comes to their own behaviour.

 

And not eating meat is only a solution if there is an affordable and sustainable alternative. Otherwise it will condemn the worlds poorest people to death.

 

Don’t disagree with the first half to be honest. I just find it ridiculous to see someone using a paper straw and eating a beef burger. 
poor people however, eat less meat. Meat is a luxury. It’s just nonsense to use the poor as an argument. There’s a reason that grain is provided to starving people rather than steak. Cheaper and better energy conversion. If all the world ate a western diet, we’d need two planets to produce it. 
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-47057341
I know some behaviour is unavoidable. We can’t stop using planes and cars (though we can do things better), there needs to be bigger fundamental change for some things. We are on the way to doing that, but that has been pushed by people vociferously pushing the issue. 

[geosname]

24 minutes ago, Andyregs said:

From big solutions to I don’t care. Is there a point you’re making? Ever? 

The point is simple.

If you are going to rectify the planet with manifesto promises don't start with things that have little impact to make the party look good and buy votes... any party.... actually do something that has an impact now..... it is a crisis after all... no the feel good bits that will take 10 years to impact..... we only have 20 according to some.

[geosname]

27 minutes ago, Nofinikea said:

Of course there isn't.

Need to know basis.... you don't need to know

[Andyregs]

4 minutes ago, geosname said:

The point is simple.

If you are going to rectify the planet with manifesto promises don't start with things that have little impact to make the party look good and buy votes... any party.... actually do something that has an impact now..... it is a crisis after all... no the feel good bits that will take 10 years to impact..... we only have 20 according to some.

So we need everyone doing here bit instead of waiting to be told what to do or ‘not trying to save the planet. Your ‘both side Schtick is becoming more impressive. You want big solutions but you don’t want to save the planet. 

[geosname]

4 minutes ago, Andyregs said:

Don’t disagree with the fruit half to be honest. I just find it ridiculous to see someone using a paper straw and eating a beef burger. 
poor people however, eat less meat. Meat is a luxury. It’s just nonsense to use the poor as an argument. There’s a reason that grain is provided to starving people rather than steak. Cheaper and better energy conversion. If all the world ate a western diet, we’d need two planets to produce it. 
I know some behaviour is unavoidable. We can’t stop using planes and cars (though we can do things better), there needs to be bigger fundamental change for some things. We are on the way to doing that, but that has been pushed by people vociferously pushing the issue. 

I live in a poor country, meat isn't a luxury. We don't eat the same amount of meat per meal as in the west, beef is a rareaty,  things like pork chops and steaks are not normal except in restaurants (for westerners). 1 chicken leg has enough meat for 4 people as does a 1lb fish.

[Andyregs]

3 minutes ago, geosname said:

I live in a poor country, meat isn't a luxury. We don't eat the same amount of meat per meal as in the west, beef is a rareaty,  things like pork chops and steaks are not normal except in restaurants (for westerners). 1 chicken leg has enough meat for 4 people as does a 1lb fish.

Are you actually arguing against yourself now?

[geosname]

8 minutes ago, Andyregs said:

So we need everyone doing here bit instead of waiting to be told what to do or ‘not trying to save the planet. Your ‘both side Schtick is becoming more impressive. You want big solutions but you don’t want to save the planet. 

I don't want anything, what I do isn't because I want to save the planet.

I get irritated at party sound bites to buy votes that will have little impact in the time we are reportedly left.

If you are going to save the planet get on with it, stop trying to comfort people that the measures you promise to do, rarely delivered, will have any meaningful impact in the short term...... crack on.

[geosname]

3 minutes ago, Andyregs said:

Are you actually arguing against yourself now?

How?..... I eat meat.... I don't eat steaks or western portions of meat of any kind... meat is a staple of Thai diet.... rat, frog, insects, snake, land crab even dog in some places.... very small portions with larger portions of rice and vegitables with herbs etc on the side.

[Andyregs]

6 minutes ago, geosname said:

I don't want anything, what I do isn't because I want to save the planet.

I get irritated at party sound bites to buy votes that will have little impact in the time we are reportedly left.

If you are going to save the planet get on with it, stop trying to comfort people that the measures you promise to do, rarely delivered, will have any meaningful impact in the short term...... crack on.

We’ve halved our co2 output per person since the 1980’s. 

[Andyregs]

1 minute ago, geosname said:

How?..... I eat meat.... I don't eat steaks or western portions of meat of any kind... meat is a staple of Thai diet.... rat, frog, insects, snake, land crab even dog in some places.... very small portions with larger portions of rice and vegitables with herbs etc on the side.

You said meat isn’t a luxury and then went on to say how rare it was. 

[geosname]

1 minute ago, Andyregs said:

We’ve halved our co2 output per person since the 1980’s. 

Have other countries reduced? China, India, USA? If they have increased does that lessen the effect we have had.

[geosname]

2 minutes ago, Andyregs said:

You said meat isn’t a luxury and then went on to say how rare it was. 

It's rare, as in beef and lamb, because the animals aren't here to produce it.... your thinking meat in a western context.....